Godzilla (as they call it) Vs whatever it seems

[faksta]

Originally Posted by NSXType-R

Are manufacturers allowed to underestimate the power figures?

Even some of our possy Lada's are underestimated in power matter, to reduce the annual tax paid by car owners, which is counted on an hp basis.

I don't think, though, that GT-R owners need such 'services' badly, so I guess here is another reason

Originally Posted by Rockefella

I hate things that become really trendy or overly popular to the point that it gets sick. I don't have an iPod, I hate drifting/street-racing, I hate the New York Yankees, etc. For this same reason, I wouldn't be caught dead saying the Nissan Skyline is my favorite car. For one, I don't want two 15 year old wannabe-gangsta homies come up to me and be all, "oh sh1t hell yeah man teh skyline is sickk they hav like 1400 hp"

In general, that's my point, too.

[Rockefella]

Originally Posted by henk4

yes, I just surprised myself, finding me in THIS thread

Can't avoid them all.

[LeonOfTheDead]

Originally Posted by Rockefella

Can't avoid them all.

oh guys, it seems you are disliking my thread...

[Rockefella]

Originally Posted by LeonOfTheDead

oh guys, it seems you are disliking my thread...

I'm just bored. I woke up at 6am with nothing to do so I had to hijack something.

[henk4]

Originally Posted by LeonOfTheDead

oh guys, it seems you are disliking my thread...

in spite of all good intentions, threads on the GTR invariably will head into the wrong direction....

[LeonOfTheDead]

Originally Posted by henk4

in spite of all good intentions, threads on the GTR invariably will head into the wrong direction....

Pieter, this is one of the smartest thing you ever said. and usually you say a lot of smart things...but this, oh...

[kingofthering]

Originally Posted by LeonOfTheDead

i'm looking for that article, i just can't find now, sorry. what i was saying was that probably, as this article said, J and US cars would be different. so even J and EU ones. i will continue to searching it later.

Which amounts to moving the steering wheel to the right side ( ), some minor suspension tweaks, and the removal of the goddamned 118 m.p.h. speed limiter.

[LeonOfTheDead]

Originally Posted by kingofthering

some minor suspension tweaks

which you don't know how much difference they can do.
probably more than what you can imagine. when a new car is presented to the media, the automaker choses the place for their test drive also thinking about the kind of the road and road surface they are going to "use" in order to highlight some characteristics of the car, and maybe hide others. even some journalists, and i am not a fan of them, recognize sometimes that they are driving a car very comfortable for example, but on a too perfect road without any kind of imperfections and with the best kind of asphalt available.
not the case of the GT-R, but even moving the steering wheel on the other side could be disastrous for the balance if it wouldn't be done properly, but i never heard of such a case up to know, fortunately.

[kingofthering]

Originally Posted by LeonOfTheDead

which you don't know how much difference they can do.
probably more than what you can imagine. when a new car is presented to the media, the automaker choses the place for their test drive also thinking about the kind of the road and road surface they are going to "use" in order to highlight some characteristics of the car, and maybe hide others. even some journalists, and i am not a fan of them, recognize sometimes that they are driving a car very comfortable for example, but on a too perfect road without any kind of imperfections and with the best kind of asphalt available.
not the case of the GT-R, but even moving the steering wheel on the other side could be disastrous for the balance if it wouldn't be done properly, but i never heard of such a case up to know, fortunately.

Erm... a better question is: Who doesn't do it?

Why would a car company intentionally choose a road that would highlight the car's flaws? That's like BMW telling journalists, "Hey, this new 5-series has shit styling and ride quality, you're better off spending your Euros at the Mercedes Benz dealership!"

[LeonOfTheDead]

Originally Posted by kingofthering

Why would a car company intentionally choose a road that would highlight the car's flaws?

not intentionally, i hope, but even if a car has a bad handling, setting the test drive on a highway will only put doubts on journalists, smart ones at least.
for the italian debut of the Audi S8 a couple of years ago, they created a sort of "autocross" slalom with street cones to test the car with the ESP disabled. an epic fail, since EVO wrote "it seems it has been bitten by a tarantula, it's totally uncontrollable" or something like that. i use to trust that magazine.

now they (lot of automakers) are paying too much attention to nurburgring tests and times, but imo in this way they are only underlining how much the car is focused only on such a kind of use.
i am not saying that a car that goes as fast as hell on the ring is a bad car on a standard road, but since the automaker, or its commercial office, is so obsessed with the ring, i could doubt they payed enough time or attention to other aspects. that's why i prefer the "jaguar's attitude" as i said before, and i don't like the nissan's (or even porsche's) obsession started since the R34 broke the 8 minute wall on the ring. it's just a time, and it doesn't mean one car is better or faster in a general way, or even funner to drive.
they same magazine in 2001 IIRC tested all the more important 911 of the previous 40 years, and finally they choosed the first 911 2.7 RS, which i guess it's a little slower around the ring than the (at the time) bran new GT2 or of the 996 Turbo, among others

btw, i guess we understood one another.

[whiteballz]

Originally Posted by Rockefella

Look at the country icon next to their Username. The common theme of Australia in your quotes will explain all of these issues. The only way to beat Australians is with humiliation, that's why ECC runs **** on MSN against them.

You werent there when quiggs was pwnt by me.. So you fail.

As always, I like the GTR, its a beast of a car, and wether its a quick as people claim or not, i dont think it matters - its a damned sight quicker than alot of things, and having seen a few on the streets, they have a huuuuge presence on the road (yes that includes the sheer size of it!)

[Ingolstadt]

Originally Posted by LeonOfTheDead

i prefer the "jaguar's attitude" to the ring. they use it as a benchmark since it creates all sort of difficult situations of an open road but in safe condition, paying no attention to the time the are able to achieve.

Originally Posted by Ferrer

Exactly.

I don't care what time does the GT-R get. I still can't like it.

I guess it's because Jaguar's purpose of existence wasn't to tackle the ring's time. What would you do, if the new GTR was marketed as the most comfortable GT?

Originally Posted by Kitdy

......3.5 sec ..... I thought it was 510 or something.

Originally Posted by kingofthering

Motor Trend found that it was significantly higher than 480 at the crank. Something closer to 600.

There goes another reason for fans to shout about .. :" Turbo charging a 3.8 liter car all the way to 600 hp without turbo lag is awweessoommee! "

[Ferrer]

Originally Posted by Ingolstadt

I guess it's because Jaguar's purpose of existence wasn't to tackle the ring's time. What would you do, if the new GTR was marketed as the most comfortable GT?

Yes but even if the the GT-R follows a completely different approach from a Jag, the Nissan is a sportscar, I can't quite see the point of setting insanely fastest times in the Nurburgring.

The thing is I'm not a racing driver, nor do I have the talent of one, so I'd say lap times on a race track are pretty much meaningless for a road car so you won't be racing anyone or anything.

What I want in a road car is enjoyment. I don't care if I can shave 0.00001 of a second thanks to the GT-R's advanced four wheel drive system. We've seen the Nissan can do that, but can it do enjoyment? I'm not sure.

Therefore for this reason (and others), for me the Jag is the better car.

[Ingolstadt]

Originally Posted by Ferrer

Yes but even if the the GT-R follows a completely different approach from a Jag, the Nissan is a sportscar, I can't quite see the point of setting insanely fastest times in the Nurburgring.

The thing is I'm not a racing driver, nor do I have the talent of one, so I'd say lap times on a race track are pretty much meaningless for a road car so you won't be racing anyone or anything.

What I want in a road car is enjoyment. I don't care if I can shave 0.00001 of a second thanks to the GT-R's advanced four wheel drive system. We've seen the Nissan can do that, but can it do enjoyment? I'm not sure.

Therefore for this reason (and others), for me the Jag is the better car.

True, but 'Enjoyment' will forever be impossible to gauge quantitatively. Putting lap records of nurburgring is at least 1 million times more meaningful than posting 0-60 figures, 60-0 figures, 1/4 figures, cd figures and whatever power to weight ratio stuffs, because for a sportscar, the main thing is the ability of the car itself, hence to have a common ground, and to have the track record listed for comparison, all bhp figures or torque and all the above mentioned would be rendered meaningless, or to say, it's actually a summary of all the figures to showcase the performance of the car.

I for one, do accept the establishment of using a common race track to shout about a car's potential capability. The GTR is a very good example, on papers, it might have loose out to alot of other cars, average buyers won't be able to even slightly guess their car, under such affordable cost, can actually go faster around a track compared to the likes of porsche or a ferrari 430... that. totally makes more sense to me than out right torque, hp figures.

I too, would like an enjoyable drive more thanone that could terrorize porsches on the nurburgring ... but it would be almost impossible for nissan to sell me based on an Enjoyable index figure.

[clutch-monkey]

i think of the GTR as the object which spurs advancements in marques i actually care about