Tesla Roadster

[2ndclasscitizen]

Originally Posted by Sledgehammer

If you willing to dish out 90,000 for a car, you can install a 3-phase outlet.

Really? It'd be a giant pain in the arse to get someone to figure out how to pull 415v and 32amps out of the normal suburban power grid.

[Matra et Alpine]

Originally Posted by 2ndclasscitizen

Really? It'd be a giant pain in the arse to get someone to figure out how to pull 415v and 32amps out of the normal suburban power grid.

"suburban" can mean differnt for you Aussies But for the rest of us suburban power IS 3 phase and property feeds are taken off different phases to give house voltage. So for 3-phase it's just a matter of running the extra cables a very short distance.
Every US property I've ever lived in had 3-phase for power-hungry equipment -- washer/drier etc etc ... coz 110V is a PITA

[2ndclasscitizen]

Originally Posted by Matra et Alpine

"suburban" can mean differnt for you Aussies But for the rest of us suburban power IS 3 phase and property feeds are taken off different phases to give house voltage. So for 3-phase it's just a matter of running the extra cables a very short distance.
Every US property I've ever lived in had 3-phase for power-hungry equipment -- washer/drier etc etc ... coz 110V is a PITA

Well there you go. We've got 240v so I've never seen a 3-phase outlet in a house.

[Matra et Alpine]

Originally Posted by 2ndclasscitizen

Well there you go. We've got 240v so I've never seen a 3-phase outlet in a house.

Here too, true. But a few garages have it installed - mine will once complete !!
But readily available if requested
Do you have a pole-mount transformers in rural areas ?
If yes, then it's 99% sure to be 3-phase to that point.
240V can go further than 110v single phase ... but not LOTS further

[Coventrysucks]

Originally Posted by Matt

There's no point in being negative about this vehicle.

I refuse to be brow-beaten into thinking this car is in any way remarkable by pious fools all too eager to fawn over a slickly-worded P.R. campaign.

Tesla's claims, given the context of their operation, are laughable.

To stand any chance of fulfilling their ambitions of reducing the USA's dependence on "foreign oil", they need to be rivalling the major motor manufacturers, producing hundreds of thousands of vehicles per year, not strapping someone else's batteries and motors into someone else's chassis in someone else's factory at a rate of two a week.

That the concept of widespread practical, usable electric cars is of interest does not alter the fact that this car, in isolation, is no more than a novelty; it is, in essence, a 13 year old car with a battery instead of an engine.

Similarly, that the company has grand ambitions to expand their range and sell a ten thousand "mainstream" saloons in 5 years does not confer excellence on this particular product.

That millions of people fly the world in 747s each year now does not mean that the Wright Flyer was an excellent aeroplane.

I'm sorry if this car does not send me into rapture, as you would clearly prefer, but I have no intention of swallowing the lie and pretending this automotive mutton is actually an attractive, delicious cut of lamb.

Perhaps if it were BMW, or Ford, proposing such an idea, in a new package, rather than an electric mk.6 Escort or E36, with the intention of producing tens of thousands rather than a handful, I might have something more positive to say on the venture.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Coventrysucks

I refuse to be brow-beaten into thinking this car is in any way remarkable by pious fools all too eager to fawn over a slickly-worded P.R. campaign.

Tesla's claims, given the context of their operation, are laughable.

To stand any chance of fulfilling their ambitions of reducing the USA's dependence on "foreign oil", they need to be rivalling the major motor manufacturers, producing hundreds of thousands of vehicles per year, not strapping someone else's batteries and motors into someone else's chassis in someone else's factory at a rate of two a week.

That the concept of widespread practical, usable electric cars is of interest does not alter the fact that this car, in isolation, is no more than a novelty; it is, in essence, a 13 year old car with a battery instead of an engine.

Similarly, that the company has grand ambitions to expand their range and sell a ten thousand "mainstream" saloons in 5 years does not confer excellence on this particular product.

That millions of people fly the world in 747s each year now does not mean that the Wright Flyer was an excellent aeroplane.

I'm sorry if this car does not send me into rapture, as you would clearly prefer, but I have no intention of swallowing the lie and pretending this automotive mutton is actually an attractive, delicious cut of lamb.

Perhaps if it were BMW, or Ford, proposing such an idea, in a new package, rather than an electric mk.6 Escort or E36, with the intention of producing tens of thousands rather than a handful, I might have something more positive to say on the venture.

If you would actually read and do some more research beyond the press release, you'd realize the chassis only uses the same bonding technologies as the Elise, but is NOT the Elise chassis. It is not just dropping a new engine in an old body.

The reason this car is a step towards automotive revolution is that it takes the technology that has been improving for years and finally puts in a package that is attractive to the masses. It's a halo car for the electric automobile industry in the same way a supercar is the halo car for a specific manufacturer. It garners attention for the technology and, in theory, should make the mainstream manufacturers take notice. If this car is successful, if enough people purchase and laud the performance and reliability of this car, then you will see electric cars come from the mainstream manufacturers.

[90ft]

Originally Posted by Matt

If this car is successful, if enough people purchase and laud the performance and reliability of this car, then you will see electric cars come from the mainstream manufacturers.

I'm not a fan of this car either. I lean towards CovSucks way of thinking more than yours. However . . . that said, the point I have quoted above is an interesting one because from where I am sitting, the major automotive companies really aren't paying this car any attention at all. That's not to say they aren't paying attention to electric cars though.
However it is the super cheep non crash tested cars that get through congestion charges in places like London that have them interested. That and personalised transport. Look at the number of concepts from companies like Toyota, Suzuki, and Nissan on personalised transport and electric vehicles.

I still don't see batteries as a good alternative though.
Unless that is you can make something like this work - American Antigravity - Betavoltaic Power-Cells

Edit: having said that - I just looked at another page and Honda, at the Tokyo motor show said :
"Fukui said Honda is working on high-performing lithium batteries, and if they succeed a pure battery-powered electric vehicle is in its future."

[Coventrysucks]

Originally Posted by Matt

If you would actually read and do some more research beyond the press release, you'd realize the chassis only uses the same bonding technologies as the Elise, but is NOT the Elise chassis. It is not just dropping a new engine in an old body.

"The chassis design is licensed from Lotus, based on the Elise chassis"

"Also, the Tesla Roadster is based on the Lotus Elise -- they look superficially similar and have the same basic chassis (though the Roadster's chassis is heavily modified) and other parts."

"the car’s chassis and many interior bits are shared with Lotus."

"The Roadster was developed in collaboration with Lotus, which supplied a subsequently-modified Lotus Elise chassis as the base for the new car"

"The Roadster shares much of its chassis components with the Lotus Elise... That’s good news because the Elise chassis is one of the lightest and most entertaining in all of sportscardom."

"the car is based on an Elise floorpan"

"Small surprise, since the Tesla is based heavily on the Elise chassis and bodywork."

"That buys you a stretched (to accommodate the batteries and crumple zone) Lotus-built Elise chassis"

"The battery-powered Tesla is based on a modified Lotus Elise chassis."

"the front end of the Elise chassis was kept in the retooling."

"Lotus provides the chassis and suspension from its Elise to make the Tesla."

"Tesla's first car, the $92,000 Lotus Elise-based Roadster"

"It feels like a Lotus in fast corners because underneath the slick carbon-fiber body of the Tesla there is most of a Lotus Elise chassis."

"The Elise and VX220 parts bins have been raided... Tesla is upfront about how it’s borrowed heavily from Lotus in terms of chassis mechanicals and running gear. They make a virtue of it in fact..."

"The similarities with the Elise are no coincidence: Lotus has had a large hand in the development of the Tesla, with the basic chassis and tub coming straight from the Elise."

Originally Posted by Matt

The reason this car is a step towards automotive revolution is that it takes the technology that has been improving for years and finally puts in a package that is attractive to the masses.

Unavailable to the masses.

Originally Posted by Matt

It's a halo car for the electric automobile industry in the same way a supercar is the halo car for a specific manufacturer.

The Ferrari Enzo wasn't a re-hashed 355, the Porsche Carrera GT wasn't a 964 with a new engine, the Aston Martin DBS is not a Virage with a V12.

They can't build a completely new car from scratch. I accept that it would be far too ambitious for a start-up to try and do everything themselves, but it does not change the fact that a stretched Elise is a stretched Elise. Stop trying to tell me that I should be dropping to my knees in worship because someone dared to swap Shell for Duracell.

Originally Posted by Matt

If this car is successful, if enough people purchase and laud the performance and reliability of this car, then you will see electric cars come from the mainstream manufacturers.

Again; that the concept of electric cars are likely to become mainstream does not confer greatness on this car.

The V2 rocket paved the way for space travel, but that does not make it a great space ship.

The Gotha G.1 paved the way for aerial bombardment, but that does not make it a great bomber.

You are confusing the ambitions and aims of the company with their current product - they are not the same thing. Perhaps their Blue/Whitestar projects will be of more interest, but this is just a stop-gap, headline-grabbing, novelty item.

Every decade there is a revolutionary electric car that will change the world, because, this time, it finally works - I don't see this as being much different.

It is not going to change the outlook of major manufacturers, as I am sure they are all well aware of what technology is available, what can be achieved, and what they can sell. If the promise of making a car that could be run for pennies, customers would be falling over themselves to buy it, so why is no one rushing to make that killing? What have their endless marketing surveys and focus groups told them?

It is certainly not going to stop wars, as Tesla seem to want to imply, by reducing the USA's yearly oil consumption by a heady 0.000001%

[Matra et Alpine]

Originally Posted by Coventrysucks

swap Shell for Duracell

Liek it Can I steal it ?

Every decade there is a revolutionary electric car

every CENTURY

[Coventrysucks]

Originally Posted by Matra et Alpine

Liek it Can I steal it ?

By all means.

Originally Posted by Matra et Alpine

every CENTURY

Sorry, should be "revolutionary".

Happens with fuel cells too.

It will work, this time...