Car companies to be closed in a nearest decade

[faksta]

According to Businessweek's article (which, BTW, I didn't find in original yet), during a decade General Motors can close Buick, Pontiac, GMC and Saab. The saem can be said for Ford's Mercury and Volvo. Plus Daimler AG's Maybach, as I wrote before.

I can't only understand one thing. If Americans can't deal well with Swedish companies, wtf they need to close them, when they can simply sell them to Europeans?

[2ndclasscitizen]

GM should get rid of those brands, there's no reason for them to have so many when they're selling the exact same cars with different badges. And Volvo won't be closed, it's actually making some money and selling stuff people want.

[fpv_gtho]

Brands like Saab and Volvo are hard to sell off when to get them profitable, GM and Ford have had to get them either running badge engineered cars or cars built off their platforms. Any prospective buyer would either need to continue an alliance with GM or Ford, or spend the considerable investment in producing stand alone models again.

With brands like Buick, Pontiac, GMC and Mercury, theyve been tainted by mis-management. GM for instance could have Chev for their baseline range, Pontiac sell performance biased, Buick sell semi luxury and Cadillac keep seeling luxury. I wouldnt be sure where GMC fits in, as i understand it theyre mostly known for pickups/SUV's and perhaps could take that over from Chev. Even then, if GM wanted to have products for all of those brands on the same platform whilst still having unique styling for all theyre not quite in the right financial situation to afford it. That means between Buick and Cadillac a model might get scrapped, and the same between Chev and Pontiac.

[faksta]

GMC should have done Typhoon again to stay alive - I guess it would sell nowadays...

[MadMax13]

Because those Swedish manufacturers make better cars than the American ones...

[drakkie]

They probably need the large sums of money gained to pay their enormous debts and to keep GM alive in the first place..

[Matra et Alpine]

Well Saab and Volvo are poor propositions as long as the dfollar is so weak.

Likely, Ford are looking forward and seeing no hope that the dollar will strengthen and thus manufacturers with plants outside of the US with significant sales INSIDE the US are losing money in the exchange.

[Ferrer]

Originally Posted by 2ndclasscitizen

And Volvo won't be closed, it's actually making some money and selling stuff people want.

Problem is they aren't...

Volvo is losing money, quite a lot of it actually (or at least it was last year).

Originally Posted by Matra et Alpine

Well Saab and Volvo are poor propositions as long as the dfollar is so weak.

I'm sorry but that's just a poor excuse. They can focus on the European market, or try other markets, like China for instance.

I believe that if someone had a clear plan of what to do with Saab and Volvo they could be profitable. Volvo even has it's own petrol and diesel engines. It's just that they are just a tiny little drop in the GM and Ford ocean and therefore an issue they don't care much about or they don't know how to deal with.

As for the US brands they have no future outside their industrial groups since they don't carry any added value. Their cars are just rebadged versions of other cars within the group. The best they could is kill them, just like they did with Oldsmobile or Plymouth.

[NSXType-R]

Mercury is very likely to close down.

The difference between what Ford offers and what Mercury offers is very little- the same Ford Escape/Mariner and etc.

Either change up the models or die. Simple enough.

Same goes for Maybach. The 56 and 63 is based on an old model of the S Class. Why would I need to buy them if the new S class is a better car (maybe not quite as luxurious, but you get my point)?

[Matra et Alpine]

Originally Posted by Ferrer

I'm sorry but that's just a poor excuse. They can focus on the European market, or try other markets, like China for instance.

Well it's the facts and you can't just sell a car into a market. If it's a poor fit then it won't sell.
The current Volvo range is top end in Europe and most sales are in the US.
What tyupe of car do you think sells in China ? Volvo == safety ? Who cares It either has to look uber-rich or be ultra-cheap. Neither slots Volvo have cars to fit in. So it's 2-3 years away from addressing those.
GWB screwed the dollar as a currency and nobody coudl have predicted the US woudl have been so willing to lose the $ as the world currency.

I believe that if someone had a clear plan of what to do with Saab and Volvo they could be profitable. Volvo even has it's own petrol and diesel engines. It's just that they are just a tiny little drop in the GM and Ford ocean and therefore an issue they don't care much about or they don't know how to deal with.

Having a plan isn't enough. It needs to be a plan that works.
Saab have struggled and Volvo will bring more to the Ford bottom line by being sold as a viable profitable business than they can return in profit to them !
Of course, we may see a return to the negotiations of the 60s and see Saab and Volvo merge

[Ferrer]

Originally Posted by Matra et Alpine

Well it's the facts and you can't just sell a car into a market. If it's a poor fit then it won't sell.
The current Volvo range is top end in Europe and most sales are in the US.
What tyupe of car do you think sells in China ? Volvo == safety ? Who cares It either has to look uber-rich or be ultra-cheap. Neither slots Volvo have cars to fit in. So it's 2-3 years away from addressing those.
GWB screwed the dollar as a currency and nobody coudl have predicted the US woudl have been so willing to lose the $ as the world currency.

I don't think Volvo has an image problem. See in new markets such as China people don't have the stereotypes that Europeans and Americans have. Therefore Volvo can establish thmeselves a premium manufacturer not necessarily identified alone by safety. Buick is recognised nameplate there and their calls sell well apparently. So if Buick can do it Volvo can do it too (and the same could be applied to Saab).

My point was that if your main market is shrinking it's time to either focus on other existing markets or try to find new unexplored ones.

Originally Posted by Matra et Alpine

Having a plan isn't enough. It needs to be a plan that works.
Saab have struggled and Volvo will bring more to the Ford bottom line by being sold as a viable profitable business than they can return in profit to them !
Of course, we may see a return to the negotiations of the 60s and see Saab and Volvo merge

Of course, a plan that doesn't work is useless...

Volvo was already profitable before being sold to Ford, so I don't know why this can't be the case again. Saab is altogether another matter, a more difficult one I admit.

On the merge plans I'm not sure it'd be a good idea, too much overlapping possibly.

[Matra et Alpine]

Originally Posted by Ferrer

I don't think Volvo has an image problem. See in new markets such as China people don't have the stereotypes that Europeans and Americans have

For expensive cars they do
AND Volvo has nothing in their portfolio that is cheap

Therefore Volvo can establish thmeselves a premium manufacturer not necessarily identified alone by safety.

You can't create a "premium" identity, it has to be earned or inherited

Buick is recognised nameplate there and their calls sell well apparently. So if Buick can do it Volvo can do it too (and the same could be applied to Saab).

And do you think anybody is actually making money out of building Buick ? It's a repeat of India and the UK in the 50s/60s. Move old productin line to emerging nation who will be happy to buy second rate. What are the per unit costs and profit for the Buick productino in China ?

My point was that if your main market is shrinking it's time to either focus on other existing markets or try to find new unexplored ones.

AND it wasn't possible to predict that reduction.
NOBODY expected a US president woudl continue on a path which undermined the strength of the $$. So it's kind of a surprise and difficult to see the ratinale in new investment to build in the US to avoid the currency hit.

Volvo was already profitable before being sold to Ford, so I don't know why this can't be the case again.

AND it was profitable on every car sold UNTIL the recent dollar weakness meant the US dealerships were discounting HEAVILY to re-align the $$ price One option is to just hold out till new goverment which won't be so closed-minded as GWB on how to run an economy

On the merge plans I'm not sure it'd be a good idea, too much overlapping possibly.

Yeah but their are quite interesting partnerships in Saab
I only raised it as it has been on the table almost every decade since they were both formed

[togos452]

Originally Posted by MadMax13

Because those Swedish manufacturers make better cars than the American ones...

What swedish sports car is better than the Saleen S7 or Panoz Esperante?

[2ndclasscitizen]

FYI, as far as I'm aware the lead car for Buick in China is a 2.8 V6 version of the Holden Caprice. I'm not sure what else they've added to the lineup, but that's what they kicked off with.

Originally Posted by togos452

What swedish sports car is better than the Saleen S7 or Panoz Esperante?

You might want to look up a little company called Koenigsegg.

[F1_Master]

Originally Posted by togos452

What swedish sports car is better than the Saleen S7 or Panoz Esperante?

Who said he was talking about these supercars, and not cars in general? Either way, he is correct as is 2ndclass. I'm willing to bet the Volvo R models are probably of better build quality than the Panoz Esperante as well.