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Thread: The "I just drove a..." Thread

  1. #676
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    (I had to look this up on Wikipedia, but) it was a first gen.
    "Kimi, can you improve on your [race] finish?"
    "No. My Finnish is fine; I am from Finland. Do you have any water?"

  2. #677
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    I apologize if these reviews are just turning into random automotive exposition catalyzed by f6fhellcat13’s shitty rental cars, but I enjoy that more, and am ever-so-slightly more qualified to do that than to review a new car against its peers.

    Trip 3
    Setting: Connecticut, Massachusetts, Vermont, Québec
    Car: 2014 Chrysler 300C AWD
    Mileage: 5,000 (or thereabouts) 8,000 km


    I’d like to begin this review/ramble with a little discussion of luxury. In olden days, luxury was an electric starter. A 1912 Cadillac Model 30 driver did not have to risk breaking their wrist or leaving the car in gear and sending their children careening into a lake; they simply sat in their car, turned a key, and, a few electrons later, the big four burbles into life. Later, in the years surrounding World War II, the American luxury manufacturers took their first stumbling steps towards automatic transmissions; it all crystallizing with Oldsmobile’s 1940 release of the Hydra-Matic. Now America’s burgeoning middle class did not have to face the ignominy of using their left foot while driving. Furthermore, when it came time to park, all you needed to do was throw the transmission into reverse and turn off the engine, engaging a parking pawl. Later transmissions added a “P” gear that did, and does, the exact same thing. Gone was the need to futz around with a parking brake. This was something that the proles had to do that you did not. This was a menial task removed from your life. This was luxury!

    At the same time, if you did not find the body of your car to be suitable, or if the manufacturer did not find it to be suitable, you could take it to some Frenchmen or some grayscale men in Pasadena and they would render your car stately, sublime, or bizzare. Peter Peasant could not afford to do this to and Henry Hotrodder had other things to worry about out on the dry lakebeds and salt flats. Later, after the coachbuilder’s era had passed, limited runs of cars from exotic design houses differentiated themselves from the masses with their beauty and rarity. This was luxury!

    These things made up twentieth-century luxury: expense, rarity, beauty, and ease. Deusenbergs didn’t have big engines so their drivers could tear ass around, though some did. They had huge powerful motors so that accelerating was easy and didn’t stress them. Not anymore! No longer do we seek respite from tasks; we are so overstimulated, that we must, at any given time, have any number of gizmos, doodads, and whatsits to futz with just to keep from plunging into the turgid shallows of our extremely-low boredom thresholds. Obviously, humble tasks such as shifting, setting the handbrake, and handcranking an engine are beneath the modern man, but somehow being able to choose from forty levels of traction control or choosing how long the interior lights stay on is luxurious. So too, these days, are luxury cars not particularly rare; Bentley are common as Tercels and BMWs, Audis, and Mercs seem more common that Toyotas. Apparently that luxury ideal of exclusivity has also been abandoned. As an aside, perhaps this is why Jaguars are so cool and look so good on the street; they are much rarer and a bit of alternative old-style luxury. Their “grace, space, and pace” motto exemplifies this old luxury I’m trying to convey. Beauty is, of course, purely subjective, but although there are plenty of good-looking cars on sale today, none are beautiful, save maybe for the Model S and recently-departed 8C. Apparently, beauty has also faded from grace. Somehow “industrial design” has displaced beauty and grace. What are we left with? Expense. Carmakers are more than happy to lighten the wallets of their customers and the abovementioned commonness of many luxury cars shows consumers’ willingness to let them.

    I meditated on all of this as Vermont’s green hills rolled past. I guess it shows the luxury chops of the Tree-Hundo that I was able to do that. I also reflected on my own desire to own a luxury car, or lack thereof. As some of you know, I have a fetish for the last of the GM B-Bodies: full-sized jelly beans that marked the end of the line for GM’s body-on-framers. I am, at any given time, seriously considering buying a Roadmaster or Custom Cruiser. I am worried that they won’t quite stimulate me though and, beyond them, very few luxury cars that I like exist and fewer still are within my grasp. Very few of the “luxury” cars that I’ve driven have impressed me much. Maybe I am just young and willing to punish my ears, back, arms, and the rest of my body just to slosh the rest of my organs around once in a while on a nice canyon road. At this stage in my life I have no need for super-soft suspension, high-quality leather, electronic analog clocks, automatic transmissions, automatic headlights, automatic wipers, automatically-dimming rearview mirrors, automatic climate control, keyless entry etc… I am obviously the wrong person to review the 2014 Chrysler 300C AWD, but here goes:

    Dividing luxury into just the twentieth and twenty-first centuries was a bit facile of me. Within the greater historical eras come the more acute epochs of fads and trends. Who can forget the Brougham era of American cars? In 1960s Europe the GT was the ideal to which people aspired: long-legged luxury and speed. This rakish sporty “character: has always been valued highly by Yurops, which is plain to any poor soul who tries to buy a $40,000-$100,000 sedan. Here, though, sportiness’ appeal comes and goes, but comfort (neé luxury) has always been in vogue. From before the war until the early ‘90s, American manufacturers pursued their own marshmallowy and plush version of luxury: soft seat, soft suspension, and alternately baroque and glamorous styling. Ease was what mattered. The 300 is, in many ways, a luxury car in this old mold. It does not have a horrible landau top. It actually has a well-controlled ride and a fancy new transmission. It does not consume gasoline at a rate that would make a Pratt & Whitney Double Wasp blush. Despite these things, it is an easy car to live with, as an American luxury car should be. There are few unnecessary hassles, it looks like an American luxury car should, and is just expensive enough to scare away the filth-covered masses. Though, that last hasn’t seemed to be the case thanks to easy-bake car loans.

    Among luxury cars, there are a few features on that I think the Chrysler does very well: the climate control is largely fire-and-forget. You simply specify the number of degrees you want and the car complicitly agrees. For some reason few cars whose heat and A/C are marked in actual degrees seem to have any fidelity with reality. In the 300, 68° (20°C) is 68°. The car did have an annoying tendency to blow full A/C when the temperature strayed a degree or two beyond the setpoint. It could have the gains adjusted for a gentler ramp up and down. JLR’s system is the best I’ve experienced and it certainly has a little more finesse. That is another echelon of luxury and perhaps an unfair comparison, but the 300’s climate control does the job well enough and is better than many more-expensive cars. Equally, Chrysler’s (apparently) industry-leading UConnnect system made phone and music-player synchronization was fairly-intuitive, though for pure ease-of-use, I think the Corolla’s system comes out on top. UConnect was better-presented, certainly, than the Toyota’s system, though car manufacturers have a long long road to travel before they get to anywhere near the refinement that we expect from the software on the other devices we use.

    Despite its conceptual oldness, the 300 does have some concessions to modern carbuilding; some are helpful, like the A/C and A/V, and some are quite annoying. Among the annoying features are the overdamped nature of everything in the car. I cannot be the only one who gets satisfaction, albeit minute, from things clicking or otherwise positively acknowledging I’ve had an effect on their position. It does a disservice to the car to call the interior controls of the car unrewarding, but that’s the only word I can offer for it. Apparently all the Euros are doing this, so it must be good; the continent that brought you the 718d must know a thing or two about the luxury game. Additionally, the shifter is doesn’t have individual detents for the different positions; it just goes forward and backward, allowing the driver to toggle through the gears. It is stupid, annoying, and ineffective. As someone who cannot see the point of floor-shifted automatics (in cars not offered with a manual transmission) this is doubly offensive because it is useless and wastes interior space. I would far prefer having additional knee room and a column shift, or to be classy, PRNDL buttons on the dash. On the subject of columns, Chrysler has attempted to be clever by consolidating all the column controls onto the indicator stock; having indicators, high beams, washers, and wipers all on one little five-inch stalk is just not worthwhile. If they were truly insistent upon having just one column stalk, Chrysler should have migrated some of those controls elsewhere, which would doubtless have provoked my ire as well. Beyond those features, it is fairly pleasant. The stereo and speakers are of decent quality and the wind noise is kept to a minimum, though the car did have a disproportionate amount of tire roar, commensurate to the Veloster, I’d say. I’m sure it was actually quieter, but the lack of wind noise made me notice the tires’ noise and the thunking of the suspension. The seats are quite comfortable short trips, but after my seven hours up to and down from L’Frozen Nord, my back would be sore and I couldn’t find a position to combat that. Space is more than adequate, in the front anyway. I had no reason to go in the back.

    (Car pictured at Circuit de Gilles Villeneuve)
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    "Kimi, can you improve on your [race] finish?"
    "No. My Finnish is fine; I am from Finland. Do you have any water?"

  3. #678
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    The design of the interior is somewhat uninspired, which truly is in the spirit of American luxury. The layout is not particularly-cohesive, the aesthetics are not particularly-luxurious feeling, and it ends up feeling like a facsimilized mishmash of other luxury cars. Though Serg and the Chrysler gang would jump for joy if they heard this, the interior feels (downmarket) German. I do not mean that as a compliment.


    The exterior, however, is very nice. Though not my cup of tea, Chrysler has managed to take the classic full-sized American car idiom and adapted it to these post-modern times. The arrow-straight bodylines, vaguely bulging fenders, and stupid belt line give an impression of solidity and strength, as they should. There are also enough curves to convince you that the design was not originally rendered on an Apple II, unlike the Nissan IDX. Though obviously a car of its time, impressive given its many retro cues, I think the 300 is a successful design that will weather time’s winds well.

    Now: the fun part! First, though, I have some bad news: some idiot from the rental car agency ordered this car with AWD so I could not do a burnout. Why anyone would limit the burnout capability of a longitudinally-engine American car is beyond me. Additionally, the AWD actually proved a nuisance at times. The exit of my hotel dumped me out onto a 90km/h (“I’m soory but that kind of speed is just dangerous, eh”) frontage road. Unfortunately, the driveway was made with the kind of quality usually reserved for public roads in Québec. This meant that when I stopped at the end of the driveway one corner would either be off the ground or very lightly weighted. As the car realized that it didn’t have traction on one wheel as I gunned it to keep up with moving traffic the car would initiate a series of lurches from the traction control and center differential as they tried to send the car forward. I also tried this with the traction control (nominally) off, but apparently it doesn’t turn all the way off. This was annoying and unbefitting an otherwise transparent many-speed ‘box. The engine was one of the cars greatest disappointments, despite being objectively very good.



    Put simply: it was not a V8. The 3.7L Pentastar unit provided ample power and impressive economy. With its 300+ horsepower, the V6 carried the 300C’s lardy ass to 60 with impressive speed and, driven gently at Canadian speed limits, yielded 30 mpg (8l/100km) on the highway. Around town, mileage was predictable about 30% less than that, owing mostly to the car’s weight. With all that said, it did not make any of that seem easy: it had a thrashy direct-injected V6 exhaust note and, helped by poor transmission programming, would have to lazily downshift and moan its way up to the torque band to actually accelerate the car. Through Vermont’s fearsome (to a Toyota Corolla) hills, the 300C (56,000,000 miles/sec, 90,000,000 km/s) would need to downshift twice. The transmission would not make a fuss about this, but the engine would. If it had a V8 it would not whirr and rattle at idle, it would contentedly burble. If it had a V8 it would move, even at low engine speeds. If it had a V8 with cylinder deactivation, I think mileage would be nearly the same as the Pentastar.

    The suspension and damping worked admirably with so much weight on its hands. Never did the car feel flummoxed by railroad tracks or broken pavement, like an old under-sprung and undamped American car would. It cornered with a surprising amount of grip and composure. I would have liked, however, for the car to be a bit more softly-sprung. If the suspension was just a little more laid-back, it would have taken the sting out of nearly all bumps encountered, instead of only most of them. A car this large isn’t for racing anyways. The only time the mass really manifested was up hills, at the cornering limit, and on the brakes. I never felt like I’d cooked them, but they never seemed to retard the car quite quickly enough for my liking.

    While the 300 is a perfectly adequate luxury product, it is not premium, though I get the feeling that Chrysler and their Italic overlords really really wanted it to be. It is a good enough effort for the price which, while necessary for reality, is never where a luxury car wants to find itself. It is a good effort and, short of the Cadillac CTS, is the only American car that stays faithful to what one expects from American luxury. The definition of luxury is changing over time, and in my view cheapening, so it is reassuring to see Chrysler sticking to their guns on this one. Unfortunately, they are also sticking to their contemporary not-quite-there guns, instead of their old position and the engineering company of the Big Three.
    "Kimi, can you improve on your [race] finish?"
    "No. My Finnish is fine; I am from Finland. Do you have any water?"

  4. #679
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    This was luxury!
    The use of high quality materials in the interior, and superior design overall, has almost entirely been part of what makes a luxury car. I'm a believer in Veblen goods, but when I drive a brand new Benz at work and then hop into my Mazda to drive home, I know there is more to luxury than a brand, exclusivity, price; people are not buying a luxury car simply because it is a luxury car, there are tangible benefits to a more expensive car, and even a well specced... Chrysler 300 say, does not have the same quality of materials, ride, features, power, or performance of one of our (yeah, I said it) products.

    What I'm trying to say is that there is such a thing as luxury beyond perception, if said luxury is done well. The CLA is not an example. The CLA is a piece of isht.

    Caveat emptor; use only excess disposable income on a high end car.

    This entire section makes you sound like an old man.

    I meditated on all of this as Vermont’s green hills rolled past. I guess it shows the luxury chops of the Tree-Hundo that I was able to do that. I also reflected on my own desire to own a luxury car, or lack thereof. As some of you know, I have a fetish for the last of the GM B-Bodies:
    Some of us also know that you have a part-time, yet fully developed crack addiction, which makes your brain form such silly thoughts.

    Maybe I am just young and willing to punish my ears, back, arms, and the rest of my body just to slosh the rest of my organs around once in a while on a nice canyon road. At this stage in my life I have no need for super-soft suspension, high-quality leather, electronic analog clocks, automatic transmissions, automatic headlights, automatic wipers, automatically-dimming rearview mirrors, automatic climate control, keyless entry etc… I am obviously the wrong person to review the 2014 Chrysler 300C AWD, but here goes:
    Ok. Maybe you are not an old man.

    It does not consume gasoline at a rate that would make a Pratt & Whitney Double Wasp blush.
    You Kool-Aid drinking nerd...

    I shouldn't throw stones.

    though car manufacturers have a long long road to travel before they get to anywhere near the refinement that we expect from the software on the other devices we use.
    This. How maddening is it that the OEMs are such ridiculous failures at making HVACinfotainmentosity function in an acceptable manner? It just really makes one wonder. My relatively limited experience with any of the modern systems has been largely infuriating. Make it work. Make it simple. I have a brain and so can work through problems but many people do not have brains, and frankly I shouldn't have to whip out the owners manual while doing 105 in the fast lane holding my Timmies Double Double to check how to smoothly change audio inputs.

    the continent that brought you the 718d must know a thing or two about the luxury game
    Hiyo!

    On the subject of columns, Chrysler has attempted to be clever by consolidating all the column controls onto the indicator stock; having indicators, high beams, washers, and wipers all on one little five-inch stalk is just not worthwhile. If they were truly insistent upon having just one column stalk
    Who wants a Mercedes now?

    The design of the interior is somewhat uninspired, which truly is in the spirit of American luxury. The layout is not particularly-cohesive, the aesthetics are not particularly-luxurious feeling, and it ends up feeling like a facsimilized mishmash of other luxury cars. Though Serg and the Chrysler gang would jump for joy if they heard this, the interior feels (downmarket) German. I do not mean that as a compliment.
    "Near luxury" is my favourite segment. What a silly thing. I mean. Buick. Come one! Chrysler!?

    There are also enough curves to convince you that the design was not originally rendered on an Apple II, unlike the Nissan IDX. Though obviously a car of its time, impressive given its many retro cues, I think the 300 is a successful design that will weather time’s winds well.
    Shout out to "buff book"-esque (as some blogs regrettably refer to car magazines as) prose. See: recent sniff article parodying teh intertube car blogz.

    Unfortunately, the driveway was made with the kind of quality usually reserved for public roads in Québec.
    Well, if the construction workers (represented by "connected" unions) did good work repairing the roads, then their companies would have less opportunities to collect tax revenue from bid-rigged contracts obtained from politicians bribed by the Cosa Nostra's Rizutto crime family.

    And you thought GM nailed planned obsolescence in the 80s.



    Doom drone? Do you listen to this crap? Really dude?

    Put simply: it was not a V8.
    About the saddest thing imaginable is a V6 300. Unless it's one of the EDM diesel numbers.

    Or a Charger with High Output 3.5L V6 badging, like I saw today. A fatass car with a V6 is just sad. Buy an Accord.

    instead of their old position and the engineering company of the Big Three.
    When in the hell was this the case?

    A thoroughly entertaining read (article?). Quit your job and write for Autoblopnik.
    Last edited by Kitdy; 07-18-2014 at 05:41 PM.

  5. #680
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    What is luxury?

    For me, luxury is ease.

    Ease of driving, ease of overtaking, ease of comfort, ease of communication.

    That is way the electronic toys in cars are definitely luxurious. This is also why the Mercedes-Benz A-Class is a much more luxurious car than the Hyundai i30, despite being clearly worse.

    Grabbing the wheel of the Mercedes gives you an idea of what it is like caress the soft skin of a woman; it is just nice. In fact the whole interior is indeed a nice place to be.

    Brand, exclusivity and price make something premium. Premium is different from luxury; premium is intangible, it is image, it is belief. Premium is a feeling which is created over the years, luxury on the other hand is instantaneous.

    And then there's the tool. The Hyundai is not luxurious or premium, it is a tool and rather good one at that. Now the tool should fulfil a certain number of parameters (ride, handling, steering, braking and others) which are not necessarily included in the other two categories described above.

    In my opinion a luxury car shouldn't be a driver's car. there is simply no need to involve the driver in the process because this requires effort and attention which is annoying and not very luxurious at all. On that basis luxury cars are not GTs and neither should they be used to cross countries and/or continents, because the truly luxurious way of doing that is with a private jet.

    That's not to say that GT cars shouldn't be comfortable, they should, but let's not confuse comfort with luxury. A luxury car has to be comfortable but a comfortable car is not necessarily luxurious. Also GT cars involve you in the process, because frankly, who would want to cross continents in a car if it isn't at least somewhat interested in how a car works.

    We can discuss at length over what makes a good car if you want; my perception has definitely changed over the years, for instance noise and stiff suspensions have been replaced by an increased attention to the balance between ride and handling.

    But the conclusion is that currently the ultimate luxury car is not a Rolls-Royce, a Bentley, a Mercedes-Benz or a Cadillac. It's this one:



    PD. I agree with the Canadian man above, you should write professionally for some hipster motoring website.
    Lack of charisma can be fatal.
    Visca Catalunya!

  6. #681
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    Yesterday I got to drive one if the new hybrid Lexus ISs.

    Best thing about it is the EV-stealth-run-over-murder mode.
    Lack of charisma can be fatal.
    Visca Catalunya!

  7. #682
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferrer View Post
    What is luxury?

    For me, luxury is ease.

    Ease of driving, ease of overtaking, ease of comfort, ease of communication.

    That is way the electronic toys in cars are definitely luxurious.
    So what you need is an autobox, sufficient power, a proper suspension (I know one...) and silence in the car.

    Nothing of the above require electronic toys.........these are superfluous.

    Actually luxury is being driven around by a chauffeur.
    "I find the whole business of religion profoundly interesting, but it does mystify me that otherwise intelligent people take it seriously." Douglas Adams

  8. #683
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    Quote Originally Posted by henk4 View Post
    So what you need is an autobox, sufficient power, a proper suspension (I know one...) and silence in the car.

    Nothing of the above require electronic toys.........these are superfluous.
    I agree... if you circumscribe luxury to driving alone.

    However, satnav (to pick on an example) eases up the task of having to actually look where you are going in a map, finding the route, get lost, ask for direction to some locals, etc. Satnav is luxury too, just tell the computer where do you want to go and it tells you how to get there.

    That is luxury too.
    Quote Originally Posted by henk4 View Post
    Actually luxury is being driven around by a chauffeur.
    Hence my post of the Google contraption; the world's ultimate luxury car.
    Lack of charisma can be fatal.
    Visca Catalunya!

  9. #684
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferrer View Post
    However, satnav (to pick on an example) eases up the task of having to actually look where you are going in a map
    resulting in dumb travelling where people have no clue where they have been.
    "I find the whole business of religion profoundly interesting, but it does mystify me that otherwise intelligent people take it seriously." Douglas Adams

  10. #685
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    Good news! (Bad for me)
    I return to the Nord Gelé at the end of the month, so the rental reviews will continue. I will also finish the one I'm currently working on from the last trip.
    "Kimi, can you improve on your [race] finish?"
    "No. My Finnish is fine; I am from Finland. Do you have any water?"

  11. #686
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    When will you be in the GTA?

  12. #687
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    Aside from repairing Hellcat-shaped holes in parking garage walls, Toronno has no industry to speak of so I will not venture there.

    Is Mosport doing anything worthwhile in October? I just went the the Lime Rock Historics and that was tuns of funs, do they have a Canadian equivalent or is everyone too busy visiting http://www.nissanmicra9998.com?
    "Kimi, can you improve on your [race] finish?"
    "No. My Finnish is fine; I am from Finland. Do you have any water?"

  13. #688
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    Quote Originally Posted by f6fhellcat13 View Post
    That is just sad.

    On the other hand yesterday I got to stand next to a big Healey, start it up and hear the lovely straight six growl.
    Lack of charisma can be fatal.
    Visca Catalunya!

  14. #689
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    October is too late in the season. We will be 500m under snow.

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    Those chaps at Audi even managed to misspell my name...

    Anyway.

    Audi is unveiling the new PHEV e-tron A3 next to my office, so I decided to pop down to see what's what.

    After a far too long presentation they let us have a go with the car.

    As a bit of a background, this is the third time I have driven a hybrid (previously a third gen Prius and more recently one of the new IS300hs) but this was the first time it was a PHEV.

    I have to say, I did really rather like it. It was comfy, silent, smooth, fast and effortless. And of course it's an Audi, so built quality was superb and there were lots of toys. In every other aspect it just drives like a standard automatic A3 (although to be honest the test route didn't allow me to go too much into the driving dynamics).

    In essence then, a very good product. However, there's a but; and this but is the price tag which is, wait for it, 40 grand without adding any options.

    This leaves me with a problem. In a way I really like it. I like the silence, the instant response of the electric motor, the fact that if you fully charge it you can go rather far on electricity alone (which is ace especially in city driving) and then there is the petrol engine which provides all the performance you are ever going to need (I'm not sure about fuel economy in serious road driving since once the battery flat you essentially drive a fat turbocharged A3).

    However, I can't help feeling similarly to when I drove the Prius (and to an extent the IS300h too); yes the car is good but is it really worth the asking price? The question is much harder on the Prius which is an economy car fighting other bread and butter family hatchbacks, but still the e-tron's asking price is uncomfortably close to that of, say, the S3.

    Nevertheless it's not that far off that of an A220 CDI too, so maybe the A3 PHEV is at the price point where the hybrid's premium may start making sense.

    I think that in the end a fair conclusion would be that the A3 e-tron will make more or less sense depending on your priorities. But, personally I wouldn't not recommend it.

    (Disclaimer: you are going to need somewhere to plug it at night, the battery charges fully in under 4 hours in a standard plug so no problems in that aspect, but if you live in a block of flats and park in the collective car park this may be a problem)
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