Shock: Camry has decent dynamics according to Wheels mag

[motorsportnerd]

I know that Toyotas are not the favourite cars of most members of this forum, but since two of the three major new car releases in Australia are Toyotas, since Toyota is Australia's top selling manufacturer and since Toyota is a local manufacturer employing thousands of people, I think the new Camry and Aurion deserve their own thread.
So, rather than posting about the Camry in the VE thread, I thought I'd start a new thread.
I bought the latest issue of Wheels today. Yes, the VE dominates the magazine, but a fair bit of space is also given over to a road test and feature story on the new Camry range.
And the first paragraph of the test sets the tone: yes, shock, horror, apparantly the Camry now has excellent dynamics - maybe even class setting dynamic capability. Yes, comparable to the Mazda6 and Accord Euro - at least on first impressions according to the Wheels tester. Here's a taste "Turn the...steering wheel and the nose tucks in obediently - almost eagerly. Vibrations come telegraphing up the steering column to tickle your fingers. There's a gradual, progressive and moderate amount of body movement....this is not Sportivo, but Altise. Two days driving..leaves the mind's eye contemplating a comparison with the Mazda6 and Honda Accord Euro. Torque steer and mid-corner wheelspin - both front-wheel drive bugbears - are never major issues unless you're being ridiculous. This is a soundly designed, engineered and sorted package".
This is strong praise indeed. Having driven both the previous two generation Camry fours, I know that they were light years behind the Mazda6 - which I've also driven - for dynamic capability.
The article also praises the designers "an attempt at real syling nuance" - particularly with the stepped bonnet and boot. Um, yeah, the car looks a little better than the old model. And the designers have given it some "styling" but that doesn't mean it looks good. From the pictures I've seen that grille is ugly and overall the car still looks too much like the old model. Maybe it'll look better in the flesh.
Other points - there is now no six clyinder. As we know, that's reserved for the Aurion, due later this year. Pricing will be between $28,000 for a manual Altise spec model up to $39,900 for a Grande. The engine is basically a carry over from the old model, but with a few improvements - a 2.4 litre 4 clyinder has an extra 5kW up now to 117kW. So, that's well short of the Mazda6 with 122kW and Accord Euro with 140kW. At least a 5-speed auto is available on all models. Other transmission is a 5-speed manual (where's the 6-speed?).
Wheels suggests that the Camry's drivetrain is its weakpoint. On paper, it certainly doesn't compete with the Accord Euro or Mazda6.
Wheels also criticises the plasticy dashboard and poor interior quality.
However, the new 5-speed auto is given due praise.
So, there we have it. The Camry now drives well, has a great auto gearbox, and will certainly have Toyota reliability. But it has a weak drivetrain, we know that fuel economy isn't great for a 4-cylinder, and interior quality is a low point. Also, the safety package on the base model should be improved and its missing a 6-speed manual.
I don't see this car challenging the Accord Euro or Mazda6 to be top of the class, although it is positive that the dynamic capabiliy of the Camry may now match the Euro or 6.
Where the Camry will do well is that it is a Toyota, there is a perception that 4-clyinders are economical whatever the reality, the pricing is fairly sharp against the 6 and Euro and at a time when fuel prices are constantly rising and the whole mid-size family sedan sector has been completely revitalised - this may in fact be the right car at the right time for the majority of Australian family and fleet purchasers. As Wheels says, its the least anticipated car of the three big releases this year, but it may turn out to be the most surprising.

[acemotorsport]

certainly doesn't compete with the Accord Euro or Mazda6.
I don't see this car challenging the Accord Euro or Mazda6 to be top of the class, although it is positive that the dynamic capabiliy of the Camry may now match the Euro or 6

i don't see the Camry challenging the accord euro is smaller quicker and sportier

[motorsportnerd]

The same article makes mention of the fact that the Aurion will have a 205kW (not 190kW as previously thought) 3.5 litre V6 and a six-speed auto transmission as standard. There's also suggestions (as mentioned in the VE thread) that it will achieve economy figures of less then 10L/100kms.
So, lets get this straight: the Aurion has more power than the VE, a six-speed auto as standard therefore setting the technology pace, and is likely to be much lighter and way more economical. I don't know the pricing for the Aurion, but I'll tip it will be competitive with the VE model for model. And I'd be surprised if it doesn't at least match the VE for equipment levels and will certainly have an instant perception of reliability that no Holden (or Ford or any other manufacturer) can match.
So, on paper, where's the Commodore's advantage? I'm afraid I don't see one. Styling - yes. The Commodore on paper does look better (I haven't seen either in the flesh). And nothing else. Oh, yes. The rather uneducated perception of the advantage of RWD. Yes - as a marketing tool. On a large, four door family sedan in real world driving? Unlikely.
I'm going to stick my neck out. Without having seen any road tests of either the VE or Aurion and without yet having driven either myself, I think the Aurion is the better car on paper. There, I said it.

[motorsportnerd]

i don't see the Camry challenging the accord euro is smaller quicker and sportier

We can only go on the road test impressions. Put it this way - the new Camry has to be hugely better than the old one to even come close to matching the Mazda6. I'll let you know what I think when I get the chance to drive the new Camry.

[charged]

I bought the Wheels mag tonight and had a general look through and the new Camry and the Aurion do look like they will have the goods. Although still not sure about the looks yet. The big suprise was the Mazda 3 MPS in gear acceleration times , that little beasty is a torque monster

[motorsportnerd]

On the subject of the 3MPS, the Sydney Morning Herald's Drive section had a massive hot hatch comparison, and concluded that the 3MPS had too much power for the chassis and too much torque steer. Yet Wheels and every other drive report I've seen so far says the opposite. Either the SMH's writer has way too sensitive feet and hands or the other testers are not sensitive enough. I certainly think the 3MPS has the goods on paper and it would be on my short list if I could afford a $40K hot hatch.

[2ndclasscitizen]

I rarely take notice of road tests in newspapers. They are quite frequently rubbish.

[acemotorsport]

i watch topgear there loonies but fun show and they realy test the cars

[fpv_gtho]

On the subject of the 3MPS, the Sydney Morning Herald's Drive section had a massive hot hatch comparison, and concluded that the 3MPS had too much power for the chassis and too much torque steer. Yet Wheels and every other drive report I've seen so far says the opposite. Either the SMH's writer has way too sensitive feet and hands or the other testers are not sensitive enough. I certainly think the 3MPS has the goods on paper and it would be on my short list if I could afford a $40K hot hatch.

Personally i dont rate motoring journo's from newspapers that highly.

Based on this thread and other bits of info, Camry and Aurion look like they'll have the goods to challenge VE for COTY, perhaps Aurion moreso. I must say though, if the Camry cant at least match the 6 it would be a shame, even for someone like Toyota with the reputation for boring cars. The 6 is well into its model cycle afterall, its about time it starts getting challenged by more than Honda. Its a bit like the VE needs to be better than the BF, but its not a dead set certainty.

[charged]

In our local paper The Advertiser they have a section where a lady jurno tests the cars( girl torque), has hitting statements about cup holders and vanity mirrors in the sun visors, etc, very imformative info, nothing about vehicle dynamics etc. All its good for is wrapping up fish and chips.

[motorsportnerd]

Sounds like Wheels is planning a comparison between the Camry, Mazda6 and Accord Euro. From initial impressions, the Camry is dead in the water drivetrain wise against the other two, but might match them for dynamics. Doubt Camry will compete for COTY.
But an Aurion that does 9.9L/100km from a 205kW V6 should be strong in COTY providing it at least matches the VE in dynamics and value for money.
I wait in anticipation of the enivitable comparisons and then the loud whining from Holden fans if the Aurion proves the better car....

[fpv_gtho]

That figure could win it for them. As a large car with such a big economical advantage, its hard to overlook, especially if the rest of the car is at least a match for the BF(2) and VE.

[motorsportnerd]

Talking of COTY, I must also remind people of the VW Passat - $45K and looks the goods both on paper and in driving. Might be the dark house against the Aussie cars.

[motorsportnerd]

That figure could win it for them. As a large car with such a big economical advantage, its hard to overlook, especially if the rest of the car is at least a match for the BF(2) and VE.

Those economy figures are only rumours, but if the reality is even close to the rumour, then that really is impressive for a large six. And a huge tick under the technology criteria for COTY if such economy is achieved.

[adrenaline]

The same article makes mention of the fact that the Aurion will have a 205kW (not 190kW as previously thought) 3.5 litre V6 and a six-speed auto transmission as standard. There's also suggestions (as mentioned in the VE thread) that it will achieve economy figures of less then 10L/100kms.
So, lets get this straight: the Aurion has more power than the VE, a six-speed auto as standard therefore setting the technology pace, and is likely to be much lighter and way more economical. I don't know the pricing for the Aurion, but I'll tip it will be competitive with the VE model for model. And I'd be surprised if it doesn't at least match the VE for equipment levels and will certainly have an instant perception of reliability that no Holden (or Ford or any other manufacturer) can match.
So, on paper, where's the Commodore's advantage? I'm afraid I don't see one. Styling - yes. The Commodore on paper does look better (I haven't seen either in the flesh). And nothing else. Oh, yes. The rather uneducated perception of the advantage of RWD. Yes - as a marketing tool. On a large, four door family sedan in real world driving? Unlikely.
I'm going to stick my neck out. Without having seen any road tests of either the VE or Aurion and without yet having driven either myself, I think the Aurion is the better car on paper. There, I said it.

205kW V6 standard in a Toyota?? That's impressive. Its beats the VE in power but I still have so many questions about it...Is it any heavier than VE? And how does it drive? I haven't seen the interior. Is there a spots model (not a sportivo with all the extra plastic - I mean a turbo 6 or something)...Will they market it as an F1 car instead of a large car (which wouldn't surprise me).

When it comes to sales they will almost certainly lose. Think about it, the Falcon has been superior to the Commodore for years and it hasn't nearly outsold it (although probably due to fleet buys)...I think that even if the Aurion is a superior car to the VE (which it won't be), it still needs more than that to make it past the bogans. Toyota need to go looking for fleet deals.