why havnt hot hatches gone rwd ??

[TVR IS KING]

I think a lot of people would be with me when I said...
It doesnt matter if it has 500bhp, its still front wheel drive. The handling is still the same, just with more power,

[henk4]

the hatchback is a concept that was designed in order to create optimal room within a fairly limited space. Frontwheel drive allows the absence of drive trains and differentials in places where they would abosorb useful room. Therefore RWD and hatchback are a sort of contradiction. That BMW is producing the 1 series is just based on snob appeal, and the four doors are an excuse to make it look like a four seater, while in reality the rear seat space is much less than a Golf. The trunk space is also pathetic. It has the shape of a hatchback, but in reality it is just a spacious 2+2 for which you have to pay the price of a normal 3-series BMW.

[TVR IS KING]

Well that really wraps up the thread. Suffice to say that RWD should only really be used on "hot hatches".
Otherwise...just stick with sedans.

[2ndclasscitizen]

Originally Posted by d-quik

im gunna be a smartass like the 2nd poster and say theres that rwd ford focus 3rd party package, with the v8 engine bay or something

Ford has also just built a RWD Focus for the ARC

[syko]

Originally Posted by TVR IS KING

For all Ive heard its more than decent. Its a BMW! Its leading the way on RWD Hot Hatches in my opinion.
I know it costs a lot, but its a BMW, its made for drivers..it is a sportscar. It has more room than a 350Z...I wonder what gives a better drive?

That doesn't make sense, your saying its a great car because it has a bmw badge when you should be saying its a great car because its a great car, which it isn't for the amount bmw are charging for it.

[Matra et Alpine]

one thing to add, K, you poined out the increase to over 250hp adn that may be better in a RWD.

I would concur *IF* they wheelbase were long enough to make a RWD 250+hp car controllable. But of course then the car wouldn't be a "hot hatch" and woudl be more "sedan" sized.

So the laws of physics kind of limit it
Shert wheelbase isn't a major issue in FWD as the front wheels will work to PULL the car, but wiht RWD the short distance from the driven to teh steering wheels can make for almnost uncontrollable handling requiring continuous and quick steering input. This can be partially solved with a near solid LSD, but then it won't go round corners

[KM2]

Well, off topic but Ford managed to develop the current Transit (far from hot or hatch) to be front or RWD, depending on the application the customer wants, so they should know how to do it. It's definitely possible, a bit more expensive but not so much, as many components can remain the same.

Btw. any applications with a transversely mounted engine in the front and RWD?

[henk4]

Originally Posted by KM2

Btw. any applications with a transversely mounted engine in the front and RWD?

that is almost asking like providing the Porsche 911 with Front WD only....

[KM2]

If Alfa can equip their cars with a transversely mounted engine and give them a torsen diff AWD with 65% rear bias, why would it be so impossible?

[henk4]

Originally Posted by KM2

If Alfa can equip their cars with a transversely mounted engine and give them a torsen diff AWD with 65% rear bias, why would it be so impossible?

I thought you meant a transverse front engine and RWD only..... Of course a transverse front engine can be combined with AWD, look at a Fiat Panda for instance...

[Matra et Alpine]

Originally Posted by KM2

If Alfa can equip their cars with a transversely mounted engine and give them a torsen diff AWD with 65% rear bias, why would it be so impossible?

Nothing is "impossible".
But the practicalities of cost come into it.
You have to turn the drive through 90 degrees to a shaft to the rear diff.
IN FWD the diff does both tasks
Packaging gets difficult. The market will pay for it in a top fo the range AWD , not necessarily in a RWD

[kingofthering]

it would cost too much.

[Jakg]

Originally Posted by Blue Supra

yeh, the 120d i heard is a mad sports car

my music teacher owns one ( a 120D), she drove up behind a bus, and of course it stopped, she almost ran into the back of it, but it in reverse and just sat there with the wheels spinning, it was actually quite funny!

[Clivey]

Originally Posted by KnifeEdge_2K1

why are most hot hatches still fwd ??

ignoring the fact that most hot hatches are based on eco box fwd models wouldnt the switch to rwd improve handling and response dramatically ?? expecially with the trend for more power in these hot hatches why havnt we seen any manufacturers opt for a rwd model to make better use of the grunt ??

under 200 hp most fwds with an lsd and well setup suspension would be able to put its power down at corner exits earlier then rwd and would be an advantage in lo to mid speed corners but now with the average power output of these hot hatches closing in on 250hp the fwd's inherent downfalls start to kick in

The reason is cost. The Astra and Vectra VXRs are both very good cars and they provide one hell of a bang for your buck. The BMW 130iM Sport is a rear wheel drive "hot hatch" but look at the price next to an Astra VXR with the same extras added.

The Vectra's platform can be equipped with All Wheel Drive but that would bring the price up to around BMW levels...and what are you going to buy for £30k, a 3-Series or a Vectra?

Of course the exception to the rule is still there, in the form of the Subaru Impreza WRX. AWD and at around £20k. It'll eat most hot hatches for breakfast but you do pay for it with an interior that can't match the Astra or Golf.

[TVR IS KING]

Originally Posted by syko

That doesn't make sense, your saying its a great car because it has a bmw badge when you should be saying its a great car because its a great car, which it isn't for the amount bmw are charging for it.

Its not good because its a BMW, its expensive because its a BMW. They make luxury cars, you cant expect a cheap RWD sports hatch from BMW...cheapness isnt really their forte.