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Old 07-05-2004, 05:58 PM
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Greatest Racing Heritege

Which manufacturer do you believe has the greatest racing heritege. Is it Porsche, Ferrari, Mercedes, Alfa Romeo, Ford, etc.?

I personally think its a tie between Porsche and Ferrari. Porsche because of its dominating success in sportscar racing and Ferrari for its success in sportscar racing and its great success in Formula One.
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Old 07-05-2004, 07:38 PM
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i can think of numerous reasons why anyone could have the greatest, like Ford and their GT40's, Jaguar and the old E types etc, but i think overall it would have to bbe Alfa Romeo
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Old 07-05-2004, 08:02 PM
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It depends what you mean by greatest.

Mercedes certainly has been racing the longest, so in a way that makes their racing heritage greatest in one sense.

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Old 07-05-2004, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coventrysucks
It depends what you mean by greatest.

Mercedes certainly has been racing the longest, so in a way that makes their racing heritage greatest in one sense.

I mean greatest in a sense of durability, winning, diversity, etc.
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Old 07-06-2004, 12:53 AM
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It's Ferrari hands down
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Old 07-06-2004, 01:15 AM
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Bugatti, no way it couldn't be(Type 35 ).
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Old 07-06-2004, 01:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fpv_gtho
i can think of numerous reasons why anyone could have the greatest, like Ford and their GT40's, Jaguar and the old E types etc, but i think overall it would have to bbe Alfa Romeo
The E-Type wasn't much of a racer. Alfa Romeo has had success in every type of road racing, winning LeMans, F1 championships and multiple touring car championships. Ferrari has managed to use their racing successes as a marketing tool best of all manufacturers.
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Old 07-06-2004, 03:52 AM
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hard to choose one . but i'll go for one of the italians
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Old 07-06-2004, 04:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wouter Melissen
The E-Type wasn't much of a racer. Alfa Romeo has had success in every type of road racing, winning LeMans, F1 championships and multiple touring car championships. Ferrari has managed to use their racing successes as a marketing tool best of all manufacturers.
The E-type wasn't the most successful racer, but has to be one of the best looking.

John Coombs built 12 E-Type Lightweights with factory backing. Several of them were later converted to Low drag Coupes.

Unfortunately the E-Type's main rival on the track was the Ferrari 250GTO, no wonder it wasn't a regular winner, although it clawed a few heroic victories back form Ferrari.

Aside from the E-Type, other prominent Jaguar race cars include:
SS100, XK120, C-Type, D-Type, MkI, MkII, MkVII, Group 44 XJS, TWR XKS, XJR5, XJR9, XJR13, XJR14, XJ220C and now with F1
Winning since 1936.
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Old 07-06-2004, 07:51 AM
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you included 'diversity' in the list of attributes.

So by definition that will knock out a lot of the one or 2 event type achievers.
Ferrari, Aston Martin, Bugatti, Jaguar all going, gone.
and the specialists in drag, Nascar etc

I think you end up having to let this go to Fiat, Renault or Ford.

I think Renault would be the ultimate winner as I cannot think of ANY maker who has succeeded in every form of motor racing out there. By this I am by necessity grouping similar classes otherwise it becomes fragmeneted eg Renualt have never done NASCAR, but have done modified saloon.

Rally, open wheel racing, closed, GT, prototypes, Renault have been world winners in all classes.

If and when Ford manage to win the pinnacle of open wheel single seaters then the debate could start, but until then. Allez France
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Old 07-06-2004, 08:06 PM
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I think it's a three-way tie between Ferrari, Ford, and Porsche.

Porsche's dominance of Le Mans is legendary (their marketing people won't let us forget, either), and they've even gone outside their car's core competency (i.e. road racing) into other forms, such as the Paris-Dakkar rally with a 959 no less! Ford has also competed (and won) just about everything.

Ford is tied with Ferrari as the F1 engine manufacturer with the most wins, and for a spell in the 60's and early 70's, if your Grand Prix car didn't have a Ford engine, you were going to have a very difficult afternoon. They've also won rallies, stock car, touring car, and Le Mans.

Ferrari is probably the most passionate manufacturer when it comes to racing, and if you see racing success as part of a commercial strategy, then they have hit a home run. No car manufacturer on earth is more associated with racing than Ferrari. This metric might be able to nudge them onto the top rung of the ladder, although the call is a tough (and subjective) one.

Honourable mentions: McLaren, Renault, Honda, Lotus
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Old 07-06-2004, 08:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matra et Alpine
If and when Ford manage to win the pinnacle of open wheel single seaters then the debate could start, but until then. Allez France

Hopefully they get serious with Jaguar in F1. Even though Webbers sure to go to Williams, it would be a big dissapointment if Ford pulled out of F1 for good.
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Old 07-06-2004, 08:22 PM
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I'd have to go with Ford. Remember, Ford badged Cosworth engines absolutely dominated Formula One from the late 60s to the early 80s. And Ford Cosworth engines powered Schumacher's championship in 94. So, Ford qualifies on the count of its F1 success.
Also, Ford has won (either in its own right or as an engine supplier) NASCAR, Indycar, all types of touring cars (ETCC, BTCC, V8 Supercar, Group N, etc), Le Mans and WRC.

Also, on the qualification that diversity has to be considered, then BMW and Porsche also must be mentioned. Both have won in Le Mans and sports car racing, F1 and occasionally in the WRC. Porsche also has Paris-Dakar victories and Indycar victories. BMW has an impeccable touring car record with wins in every touring car catagory they allowed to compete in. But no NASCAR for either BMW or Porsche.

And Renault is my number 4 for the reasons Matra mentioned. However, they biggest successes have been in F1 and WRC. Their touring car and sports car successes have not been over a sustained period like Ford, BMW and Porsche.

Also, Fiat by itself doesn't have much of a heritage. No F1 for example. But the Fiat group companies combined are a different story - Ferrari, Lancia, Alfa Romeo, Maserati. But I have to consider one company.

So due to their US success (mainly due to NASCAR been an American only zone), I have to put Ford at no 1, followed by BMW, Porsche, Renault.

Last edited by motorsportnerd; 07-06-2004 at 08:26 PM.
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Old 07-06-2004, 08:53 PM
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Porsche, they won everything (cept f1) and they've gone where ferrari haven't, rallying.
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Old 07-07-2004, 03:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerx
Porsche, they won everything (cept f1) and they've gone where ferrari haven't, rallying.
Ferrari won the Tour de France nine times in a row.
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