Super car parts list

[kko]

Post your parts here (that we have confirmed)with price and weight if possible.
these parts are assuming that we will be using the LS1
# LPP ALUMINUM PRO Ultra Duty Radiators $479.00USD 22 lb
97-04 Corvette JET HOT Coated Headers (with H pipe) $679.00USD 6 lb
(2) Magnaflow High Flow Cat's (street leagal) 75 dollars usd 11 lb

(2) Borla ProXS Single/Dual muffler with 3" inlet. $109.99 Cant find weight.

[Matra et Alpine]

how can we be buying radiators and headers when the engine isn't chosen ?

[kko]

I thought we decided on an Ls1
did we not?

[PsychoChimp22]

The LS1 seems to be winning the debate, but its surly not chosen yet. But no need to wait, put together some plans so that if they do decide on it you well already have lots for it.

[Coventrysucks]

I'm still holding out on the Powertech V8

[Matra et Alpine]

yah are we buiklding a supercar or a cheap bunch of so-so bits ??

I'm struggling to see how to walk away from the Powertec and Quaiffe trannie all up 130kg weight.

"design in lightness"

and it's bloody small

[jcp123]

Originally Posted by kko

I thought we decided on an Ls1
did we not?

I thought so too...

I'd have to say no on the "Power"tec V8. For a car that onle gets raced occasionally (and is driven to and fro the rest of the time), that dang thing is way too peaky.

LS1 is decent, I'm okay with it.

[Matra et Alpine]

Originally Posted by jcp123

that dang thing is way too peaky.

WHAT. Did you look at the power and torque curve posted ?
not the highs of a tuned LS1 for sure, but it will need the guidance of E-N on whether he's wanting "desinged in lightness" or "power to overcome weight"

LS1 is decent, I'm okay with it.

Hard to beat on price in stock, but are we tuning it ??

[Egg Nog]

Originally Posted by Matra et Alpine

not the highs of a tuned LS1 for sure, but it will need the guidance of E-N on whether he's wanting "desinged in lightness" or "power to overcome weight"

What do you think I'm going to choose?

My choice of the LS1 (very lightly tuned, for sure less than 500hp) was because of cost and reliability. The car is supposed to be very light overall, so we don't really need all that power, but hey, its supposed to be a supercar!

My biggest concern with the Radical Powertrain is how much it would cost and how dependable it is. I must admit that I don't really know either of these things, but if you'd like to enlighten me, that would be great. All I've heard about it so far is a "30 hour race period" before a rebuild is recommended. - I'm not sure if that's the standard engine or a racing version, but it certainly didn't sound good for a roadgoing car like ours.

It's definitely an option if its sensible enough.

[Coventrysucks]

Originally Posted by Egg Nog

My biggest concern with the Radical Powertrain is how much it would cost and how dependable it is. I must admit that I don't really know either of these things, but if you'd like to enlighten me, that would be great. All I've heard about it so far is a "30 hour race period" before a rebuild is recommended. - I'm not sure if that's the standard engine or a racing version, but it certainly didn't sound good for a roadgoing car like ours.

It's definitely an option if its sensible enough.

The RST V8 (another bike derived V8) seems to be much more of a road engine, but a little down on power compared to the Powertech.

[kko]

SHould we make a poll for the engine?

[jcp123]

Originally Posted by Matra et Alpine

WHAT. Did you look at the power and torque curve posted ?
not the highs of a tuned LS1 for sure, but it will need the guidance of E-N on whether he's wanting "desinged in lightness" or "power to overcome weight"


Hard to beat on price in stock, but are we tuning it ??

No, actually I didn't look at the curves. I just saw power and torque peaks at 10.5k and 12.5k and figured since I have a hard time revving anything over 5k, it was too peaky at least for me, and probably would not have much going for it down low with a mere 2.0l. Most car drivers will probably unused to revving anything that high as well, though for the sportbike guys it'll be a walk in the park .

LS/1 is hard to beat on bang for the buck (though it could be done), with the added benefit that it's reasonably small and light for its power and displacement. Shouldn't need tuning in a small car like this, but should it become necessary, while not the cheapest engine to mod, there is a decent selection of parts out there, and it's extremely easy to work on compared to more complicated engines.

Others I'd consider? Well I realize that carb'd engines just won't fly here so I chose some later model ones:
GM 3800 Series II Supercharged V6 (240hp, 280lb-ft)
GM LT/1 5.7l V8 (285hp, 335lb-ft)
Ford 302HO/5.0l (215hp, 285lb-ft, but the most easily and effectively modded)
Cadillac Northstar 4.6l V8 (300hp, 295lb-ft)
Ford 4.6 DOHC (305hp, 315lb-ft in Mach 1 guise, 390hp, 390lb-ft in s/c Cobra guise)
Ford 5.4 SOHC Supercharged (360/380hp, 440lb-ft)
Toyota 3.0l TT I6 (~320hp, ?lb-ft)
GM Ramjet 350 (300hp, 400ft-lbs, a GMPP crate moter in Jeg's so probably not smog legal though)

[Matra et Alpine]

Originally Posted by Egg Nog

My biggest concern with the Radical Powertrain is how much it would cost and how dependable it is. I must admit that I don't really know either of these things, but if you'd like to enlighten me, that would be great. All I've heard about it so far is a "30 hour race period" before a rebuild is recommended. - I'm not sure if that's the standard engine or a racing version, but it certainly didn't sound good for a roadgoing car like ours.

It's definitely an option if its sensible enough.

Well the 30hour rebuild will be in race trim for sure.

When racing an engine typically spends 30% of the time in the peak revs ( and peak wear period ).
Away from those peaks it typically won't wear badly at all.
So for example a BDA would last a full season if revved to 7500, revved to 8500 and it need a rebuild every 3-4 events if it was capable of revving to 9000 ( fully lightened and balanced ) then it was fine for a couple of hundred miles !!!. They also used to say that a full on 1380 Mini engine was good for 90 seconds of max revs For some that coudl be a year. For others it was an event

As Powertec have said they will develop a tuned version for hill climbers then the stock engine is well short of worrying for a 'supercar'.

So another Q from me on the project guidelines. How often do we expect customers to service the car ? eg Ferrari's are VERY strict on service intervals and they get VERY short if you push them on track !!! How about replacement ? Friends Ferrari did in a set of rotors in about 5000 miles - a lot of it track time !!

[Matra et Alpine]

Originally Posted by jcp123

No, actually I didn't look at the curves. I just saw power and torque peaks at 10.5k and 12.5k and figured since I have a hard time revving anything over 5k, it was too peaky at least for me, and probably would not have much going for it down low with a mere 2.0l.

flat torque from 4,500 to 10,000 at 200lb/ft
From 2.8l

Most car drivers will probably unused to revving anything that high as well, though for the sportbike guys it'll be a walk in the park .

So who is our target market ?
Most 'supercar' owners will be used to revs
Even the Vipers and 'vettes get tuned UP the rev range don't they ???

LS/1 is hard to beat on bang for the buck (though it could be done), with the added benefit that it's reasonably small and light for its power and displacement.

With the ancillaries the Powertec is only 130kg including all the transmission !!
I've not seen an LS1 with 'box' and transaxle to compare. Got them anywhere ??

Others I'd consider?

What no diesels ?
Or what about hybrid ?
Come on E-N it needs management input on preferred target market
Opel/Vauxhall have shown that diesel sportscars can do the business !!!

[jcp123]

We're "selling" it?!? Nobody told me that...that does change the picture a bit now.

Never occurred to me to use a diesel of a hybrid in there (hey, I'm an old-schooler. Old schoolers never had either of those.). I thought we were going for somewhat higher HP numbers and less weight than hybrids could produce - and a diesel with ~300hp is not exactly going to be light, either. I'm highly intrigued by the diesel though, with its torquey, low-revving nature and low fuel consumption.

130kg is pretty dang light for any powerplant, but the LS/1 is not a heavyweight for all it does, really. With its mass-production background, it would seriously be less risky than going with a pretty unknown powerplant (i had definitely never heard of it). Plus, on the street, I'm still not completely convinced that it would have the grunt needed to move it at more than economy car pace off the line. Though it is bigger than the one I saw on the internet that was only 2.0l, I'd like to see some figures on what it can do from idle to maybe 3k or so, right where you use it on the street, if indeed it is to see any decent amount of street time. Though I would never in my wildest dreams get such a high revving engine for my own street car (I consider revving over 6500 to be extremely high), I'm open to this if there's some decent numbers on this one.

P.S. 4500rpm is low end?!? Hell, my car shifts at 4400!