Modern Muscle Cars

["Clevor" Angel]

Unless you've been in some dark cave for the past 12 years, you've seen that the "musclecar era" is "back". I'm sorry but as an avid classic musclecar fanatic and walking encyclopedia on the subject I can't stand the way the car companies parade the once proud musclecar nameplates on newer sheetmetal. I'm happy the hemi came back, but in a 345 horse 5.7 liter truck and sedan engine? The 6.1 srt 8 is an improvement but its not the same. Ford came out with classic styling for 05' which I love, but they're dropping the cobra mustang and calling it the new Shelby. Ok, I'm all for Hipo mustangs, especially supercharged DOHC 5.4 450 horse ones. But dropping the cobra nameplate for a "shelby cobra"? I saw the first charger concept as a two door, beautiful and practical, but now its a fastback 300C... on a good day. I now hear of a new challenger and camaro, bring the camaro back definetly, dropping that is what made GM's sales drop, but the classic E-body Challenger was disgraced enough when they tried to revive it in the 80's, same with the charger and charger daytona. You'd think the top brass at the big three... I mean Big 2 american car companies could come up with something better or new, once again Ford had it with the cobra. Just venting, anyone else feel the same?

[d-quik]

1. get with the times
2. dropping the camaro wasn't what made GM sales drop

[spi-ti-tout]

You are so right. And I agree. Don't bother too much about me though, I'm usually not into American car politics. So I pick up whatever I can. I like your stuff.

["Clevor" Angel]

I'm with the times, trust me if only you could see what me and my dad are working on you'd crap yourself. Look for a white 66 mustang coupe at the 08 or 09 Autorama competing for the Riddler, est. 980 bhp 1090 tq. I just can't hardly stand to see how chryslers' new german owners ruined the charger, its a great car now but back then it could optioned like a monster. Now its a just some sedan with a v8. I'm alittle disheartened to hear of a new challenger. Like I said, just venting.

[spi-ti-tout]

I just can't hardly stand to see how chryslers' new german owners ruined the charger, its a great car now but back then it could optioned like a monster.
How could you say Mercedes did it??
Be resonable. Mercedes has been in the car business for definetly more than a 100 years and I think they have some sense as to not meddle too much with the Americans. Dodge had been given an entirely seperate factory and all that lot for Dodge to work out themselves. Because *IF* Mercedes had too much involvment we definetly would have seen better powered engines in thsoe cars. German beats American engine tech like rubbish. I'm not claming I have too much knowledge but we have to think behind the scenes. No doubt Mercedes doesn't want Dodge to fail but I think they've let them in their own hands for now.

["Clevor" Angel]

I think I talked myself into a hole here so please don't get me wrong, I didn't exactly mean it was Mercedes fault, although it sounded so. Mercedes is one of my favorite car makers. I love the amg's and the SL 65 AMG is one of my top ten favorites. And I definetly agree that if Mercedes had anything to do with it they'd be more powerful, but more expensive. But you have to admit ever since the merger Daimler-Chrysler has come out with less than dazzling cars, all of which are comfortable, "pretty" cars, but lack performance.

And I'm glad to see newer, more powerful v8 powered cars coming out, I'm just not thrilled they use classic nameplates on cars that don't live up to the reputation it has. The shelby probably will I have to admit, but to turn the charger into a 4 door sedan with "optional" v8 power?

And again, I was just venting. The entire point of this whole post was this from the above paragraph:

I'm glad to see newer, more powerful v8 powered cars coming out, I'm just not thrilled they use classic nameplates on cars that don't live up to the reputation the name has.

[Smokescreen]

I don't think any of the Big 3 will do anyhthing that will blow anyone out of the water unless the make something new. Inspiration from the past is a wonderful thing, but trying to recreate it is not. I would like the new "Challenger" to be something different. Not a Challenger, but a different nameplate, and a different look. I don't at all mind what Ford has done with the Mustang, mostly because it is the only car other than the Corvette to survive this long, and continually evolved. Look at the last Charger, and now this one. Big jump, right? I would think that if Chrylser made the 300/Charger/Magnum from a Mercedes-derived platform, they could have just as easily used a coupe platform. I really don't see a problem with the Charger, just the name. I would doubt to believe that the Charger turned into a 4 door, but Dodge's 4 door turned into a Charger. At least there's at least one hot car in the midsize sedan class.

[taz_rocks_miami]

I agree with you about the "Charger". Seems to me that the people calling the shots in Detroit are too young to realize what the muscle cars of the past mean to some of us. I guess that's what happens when car companies are run by pencil pushers and not car enthusiasts.

I'm sorry Ford droped the Cobra out of the line up. It would have been nice to see the Mustang GT, Cobra and Shelby GT 500 all offered at the same time. Kinda like back in the 1960s when you had a whole bunch of trim and performance levels to choose from.

I hope GM brings back the Camaro in the shape of something worthy of it's roots.

[ScionDriver]

I agree with his point; Retro looking cars with new practical V8s are great, but why not use new nameplates rather than revive old ones and taint their truly muscle car memory.

And honestly, who here likes the Ram Daytona Edition? That is truly just a marketing ploy. That car is truly just Dodge trying to live off of the HEMI and Daytona nameplates.

["Clevor" Angel]

I don't think any of the Big 3 will do anyhthing that will blow anyone out of the water unless the make something new. Inspiration from the past is a wonderful thing, but trying to recreate it is not. I would like the new "Challenger" to be something different. Not a Challenger, but a different nameplate, and a different look. I don't at all mind what Ford has done with the Mustang, mostly because it is the only car other than the Corvette to survive this long, and continually evolved. Look at the last Charger, and now this one. Big jump, right? I would think that if Chrylser made the 300/Charger/Magnum from a Mercedes-derived platform, they could have just as easily used a coupe platform. I really don't see a problem with the Charger, just the name. I would doubt to believe that the Charger turned into a 4 door, but Dodge's 4 door turned into a Charger. At least there's at least one hot car in the midsize sedan class.

Exactly. Not that all this musclecar hype is bad, it finally takes the focus off 4 cylinder imports. Ford's coming out with a new "Cammer" 5.0 which isn't all that impressive, but they have 400+ci one in the works. The 5.7 hemi is nice to have, but again, it by itself is not to outstanding, but the 6.1 srt8 is going to be awesome. GM with the new LS2 and the new Z06 not to mention the Blue Devil Vette. The stuff they've got in the works is pretty cool and some even awesome, but they're dropping some of the wrong things and recreating some of the wrong things. I really hope the challenger and camaro are at least in a small way tributes to the origionals.

[LSC Rider]

Here's the deal. I'm all for a true modern day musclecar revival but as a true muscle carr buff it must be done correctly. I'm sorry but with the exception of the all new Mustang the currently staple of muscle car entries do not pay homage to their earlier ancestors/namesake. At least make a GTO resemble its earlier brethren.

[rev440]

The LS7 which is a 427 is a pretty sweet engine. Chevy is trying to come out with a new camaro its debuting at Detroit this year. I hope the new one isnt retro the only old camaro I liked was the 1967-1969 the last generation(4th gen) was awesome I liked the way it looked.

[nota]

Here's the deal. I'm all for a true modern day musclecar revival but as a true muscle carr buff it must be done correctly. I'm sorry but with the exception of the all new Mustang the currently staple of muscle car entries do not pay homage to their earlier ancestors/namesake. At least make a GTO resemble its earlier brethren.
I agree re Mustang, also 300C imo

Admittedly from afar but it seems to me there's altogether too much of an obsession in the US with 'badge homage'

Its like both the customer & manufacturer's principal concern is a manic drive to revive these image-badges - as some superficial retro-cool fashion statement, like women's handbags - and slap it onto anything at hand so long as the result might stand a chance of being remotely convincing, and is quick and cheap to engineer & bring to market - eg Charger

Scoops and stripes are all the go, so 'perceived attitude' rules. But the production realities onto which these 'sacred' labels are eventually attached appears to run a definite second in all this fantasy imagery - badgework being the prime consideration with the resultant vehicle almost secondary, an afterthought. Almost like a 'virtual' vehicle ... an internet special

Rather than a rabid obsession to reincarnate those 'legendary' monikers through plonking them onto whatever product that can cheaply & rapidly modified to (temporarily) delude the punters, maybe concentrate on 'product first' and let the vehicle underneath the badges 'do the talking' and speak for itself and build its own legend?

Are we doomed to recycle badges into dust?

(just a late-night muse) :)

[Matra et Alpine]

Are we doomed to recycle badges into dust?

(just a late-night muse) :)
and another one spot on :)

It's nto jsut limited to "muscle" though as the rumoured re-entry of "Alpine" is going to be on a restyled Nissan 350Z platform. Alpines are ONLY Alpines if they're ideal balance, mid engine rear drive and VERY fast if a little hairy at the limit on corners :D

[scottie300z]

I can't stand the way the car companies parade the once proud musclecar nameplates on newer sheetmetal.


But dropping the cobra nameplate for a "shelby cobra"?

you contradict yourself. and they dropped the camaro b/c the camaro's sells were dropping, its not like they just didnt want to make it anymore, they had their reasons.

and sure you like the classic muscle cars better b/c of their two doors and everything but people want more out of cars these days and the car companies are just trying to accomadate that. You may not like it, but if there arent enough of "you" then that doesnt help them any.

i agree w/ everything smokescreen said.

[Falcon500]

and another one spot on :)

It's nto jsut limited to "muscle" though as the rumoured re-entry of "Alpine" is going to be on a restyled Nissan 350Z platform. Alpines are ONLY Alpines if they're ideal balance, mid engine rear drive and VERY fast if a little hairy at the limit on corners :D
Well the its sad when they hammer this kind of stuff into the ground....we should be doing something orignoal not copying the past.

[ElC81]

I'm all for the revival of the Camaro and the Challenger. But I do have a significant problem with what GM has done with its other storied muscle cars. Look at the Impala and Monte Carlo. Sure GM decided to put V8s in both this model year, but on a FWD platform. I think there are some good ideas in legendary car revival, but for every good one there is a bad one.

[PerfAdv]

At least the new muscle cars have some muscle to go with the revived names. I remember when GM took a Corolla and rebadged it a Nova. This was in the eighties so the death of the original Nova was still fresh. That was shocking! :eek:

I don't mind the revival as long as the cars are RWD and V8. Performance upgrades can come later and they will. Teh aftermarket is full of performance parts for imports. I don't see why it'd be any different for the revived Muscle cars.

[pAinTrAin]

At least the new muscle cars have some muscle to go with the revived names. I remember when GM took a Corolla and rebadged it a Nova. This was in the eighties so the death of the original Nova was still fresh. That was shocking! :eek:

I don't mind the revival as long as the cars are RWD and V8. Performance upgrades can come later and they will. Teh aftermarket is full of performance parts for imports. I don't see why it'd be any different for the revived Muscle cars.


I don't remember the death of the Nova....still to young I guess!

[PerfAdv]

I don't remember the death of the Nova....still to young I guess!
Click here and go down to "1985 Revival", after the '79 model the Nova name came back as a Corolla.
Nova (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontiac_Ventura)

[pAinTrAin]

Click here and go down to "1985 Revival", after the '79 model the Nova name came back as a Corolla.
Nova (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontiac_Ventura)


That makes my cry almost...just said, to see a muscle car die like that. Reading that just got me thinking, my next muscle project is going to be a Nova...and I'm going to give it 500+ HP:D

[sunk]

and another one spot on :)

It's nto jsut limited to "muscle" though as the rumoured re-entry of "Alpine" is going to be on a restyled Nissan 350Z platform. Alpines are ONLY Alpines if they're ideal balance, mid engine rear drive and VERY fast if a little hairy at the limit on corners :D
So its really the car's character that differenciates them, isn't it? Tell this to GM who just change the badge to create a new 'car'.
But still i would this as a charger.

[sunk]

Well the its sad when they hammer this kind of stuff into the ground....we should be doing something orignoal not copying the past.
Take a drive in the original charger. Then take a look at the new one.
You will BARF on it.
This 'original' stuff isn't even 25% as good as the old things.

[Viper007]

I personally see the Viper as a modern day muscle car. A huge engine, no TC, and abs was a recent addition. This car is so raw, it might as well be sushi.

[Blitz_]

im not too worried, imho americans are doing it wrong in many respects with the re-invigoration of the muscle car sector. Call me stupidly proud but im damned happy with the HSV's and FPV's down under, they are terrific "muscle cars" and true grand tourers. For christ's sakes Ford US, take a look over at FPV and see how shit your own sedans are...

[pAinTrAin]

The LS7 which is a 427 is a pretty sweet engine. Chevy is trying to come out with a new camaro its debuting at Detroit this year. I hope the new one isnt retro the only old camaro I liked was the 1967-1969 the last generation(4th gen) was awesome I liked the way it looked.


Funny I like the 67-69 Camaros also but find the stock look of the 4th gen to be ugly, but you toss a ram-air hood on with some nice rims they start to look good!, Im more of a 1st and 3rd gen guy:D

[ANDREW G]

MY wife bought 2006 Dodge Charger hEMI DAYTONA IT CLAIMS TO HAVE 10 MORE HP BECAUSE OF EXAUST&INTAKE UPGRADES DOES THIS GIVE IT BETTER 1/4 MILE TIME THAN BASIC R/T MODEL??

[NickHaug]

I love the idea of celebrating the classics by remaking them in today's "language"
But the classics have to be left in the past and now american muscle has to now be athletic and dynamic. The new challenger and camaro would be utterly fantastic if they combined the classic elements of the oldies and the ultimate drivers car.


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