PDA

View Full Version : VE on track despite job cuts



fpv_gtho
08-31-2005, 12:57 AM
http://goauto.carsales.com.au/mellor/mellor.nsf/story2/FF6E23007C376F19CA25706E00045D71


VE Commodore on track, says Holden

Biggest launch since FX: The VE Commodore is understood to have design features in common with GM’s Saturn Aura concept.

Holden’s crucial next-generation Commodore will arrive on time: Mooney

By MARTON PETTENDY 31 August 2005

advertisement HOLDEN is insistent that its decision to axe 1400 jobs and reduce vehicle production to 2003 levels will not affect the launch timing of next year’s crucial new VE Commodore.

The first all-new large car for Holden since the VT model launched in September 1997, the VE has already been pushed back from its planned launch as early as April next year until the second half of 2006 (as late as September, according to one well-placed source).

But GM Holden chairman and managing director, Denny Mooney, said last week the downsizing decision would not mean further onsale delays for Holden’s most important model.

"I’ve said before, mid-next-year is when we plan on introducing that new product," he told ABC radio last Friday. "What we’re announcing today really is not going to have any impact on the timing of that program."

Mr Mooney said the VE Commodore would be Holden’s biggest launch since its first model – the 48-215 "FX" Holden released almost 60 years ago.

"This new model, which we think is going to be a great product, is probably our biggest launch maybe since 1948," he said. "It’s a huge launch for us."

It is believed Holden will spend up to $A1 billion to develop the new VE range, setting a new benchmark for an Australian-built vehicle.

At a reported development cost of between $900 and $950 million, the VE will easily eclipse the VT at $600m, while the previous VN Commodore redesign in 1988 cost $360m.

By comparison, Ford Australia spent $700m to develop both the EA and AU, while $500m was spent to produce the BA Falcon and SX Territory.

Based on GM’s Holden-developed Zeta chassis architecture, VE Commodore is a cleansheet design that will comprise a lower level of Australian content.

Holden told GoAuto this week that this year’s build forecast would reduce from 183,000 to 164,000 vehicles and that exports would remain static at around 52,000. It would not confirm production targets for 2006, however GoAuto understands that figure will be down to around 135,000 units.

For the moment, it is unclear how the forthcoming cuts to vehicle production will affect traditional Commodore derivatives such as the long-wheelbase Statesman/Caprice and utilities, and all-wheel drive models.

However, given Mr Mooney’s stated desire to reduce plant complexity – and the confirmed release next year of a Daewoo-sourced medium 4WD to rival Ford’s successful Territory – the future of the Commodore wagon-based Adventra crossover, and any other Holden-built 4WD wagon for that matter, seems more in doubt than ever.

Similarly, despite the Zeta platform’s capability to be built in both rear- and all-wheel drive configurations, slow sales of the Cross6/8 utility models reduce their chances of entering into a second generation.

Question marks remain over other Commodore derivatives, including the Monaro coupe.

Holden is yet to confirm a two-door VE-based replacement, and given Holden is expected to supply expected to supply Pontiac with left-hand drive versions of the current Monaro until well into the VE Commodore’s lifecycle - some reports suggest GTO exports will continue until 2007 - a VE Monaro is unlikely to appear before 2008.

That’s if GM doesn’t decide to produce Monaro in the US instead.

With the overall decline in large-car sales in Australia this year at least part of the reason for Holden’s reduced future production forecast, it is also possible a diesel variant of the VE Commodore will be fast-tracked.

Holden has confirmed VE will be the first Commodore to be offered with turbo-diesel technology, most likely in the shape of a VM Motori-built 162kW/500Nm 3.0-litre V6.

What's coming from Holden:
Tigra TwinTop (Opel) cabrio - late Sep
Astra (Opel) wagon - Fourth quarter
TK Barina (Daewoo) light car - Fourth quarter
JF Viva (Daewoo) small car - Fourth quarter
Astra SRi Turbo (Opel) coupe - Fourth quarter
Vectra replacement (Daewoo) - 2006
Medium 4WD (Daewoo) - mid-2006
All-new VE (Holden) Commodore - Third quarter 2006
All-new WM (Holden) Statesman - Fourth quarter 2006
All-new VE-based HSV range - Fourth quarter 2006
Astra TwinTop (Opel) cabrio - Fourth quarter 2006
All-new VE (Holden) utility - First quarter 2007
Small (Daewoo) 4WD - 2007
All-new VE (Holden) Monaro - 2008?

syko
08-31-2005, 03:18 AM
i wonder if there sales will suffer due to a large amount of there products being daewoo derived

fpv_gtho
08-31-2005, 03:20 AM
I think the initial integration into the market will have its ups and downs, as the products will still be familiar as Daewoos, especially with how much press theyre getting. Realistically, with the small cars at least, they should do alright as they'll have the Euro AH Astra then the cheaper $18K Viva

SlickHolden
08-31-2005, 08:44 AM
Most people won't know what the dapoos are really most won't care much.

And based on designed fetures with saturn aura? I think it might be the Aura was based off the VE:D As i read somewhere the VE was built in 2003 to show some big wigs in GM what they did. This was maybe how the global zeta come along to?

2ndclasscitizen
08-31-2005, 09:40 PM
i've already seen one of those astra wagons, and why is it taking so long for the astra twintop, thats already out in europe isn't it?

syko
08-31-2005, 09:51 PM
surely people aren't that stupid not to no where a car really comes from? or are they:D

fpv_gtho
08-31-2005, 10:19 PM
You'd be surprised how many people think more than the Commodore is made locally by Holden...

Well that Saturn Aura is really just the next gen Vectra with the Astra nose, the one that Holden wont bring over.

SlickHolden
09-01-2005, 04:20 AM
Untill 1998 i thought the Vectra and Barina Astra were Aussie made.
The internet is a great tool to find out heaps of info.
And also 90% wouldnt have known about the Opel connection with the Commodore.
I only found out 3 years ago the internet is great as i said:).

syko
09-01-2005, 04:55 AM
well its our job to let people know :p

SlickHolden
09-01-2005, 09:11 AM
Other then the overseas cars which they do tell people more about where they come from now, the Opel really is a distant memory now in the Commodore.
My brother and i were reading up about how it started out.
The VB-VH were identical the VK was just slighty more Plastic. But it was the VL that was not really based on the Opel it is maybe why so many still to this day have a huge love for them. But i think it wasn't until the VT that holden really got into the car and started to go away from the opel.

fpv_gtho
09-01-2005, 06:22 PM
Well around 1998, the Vectra wouldve been locally made as Holden had a 2nd production line at Elizabeth for them, but that ended so they switched that line to Commodores and got serious about exports.

I think the VL is loved simply for the Nissan motors. Most genuine Holden lovers will take any VB-VL, its the backwards wearing baseball cap clowns that only know the VL's

SlickHolden
09-02-2005, 12:56 AM
I wanted to keep the VB but it's out of reg and the VP is in doubt now so i'm shitty with the VP right now i would have loved to use the VB to get around in even with the prob's it's got i know it will get me from A-B-C-Z even:D.
But now it's to late and i'm stuck with the VP only.
I had the chance to get a VL but choise to go more modern as much as i could. I hope i don't regreat it now. I guess i'm moaning it might be nothing at all with it? It was used to tow heavy shit around and it's way over the 200,000k's mark wihtout being looked after till me maybe i just got to take some bad with the good:).
Get over this shudder problem and i'll get back to the fuel comsuption.

Blue Supra
09-02-2005, 01:05 AM
t3h VL i5 t3h s1ck35t c4r 3V4 Y0!!!

yeh pretty much only clown in backwards caps and the seat rolled all the way down know holden ONLY for the VL.

It hurts Slick, i know. My cars needed nothing but love and S**Tloads of money since i bought it :(

fpv_gtho
09-02-2005, 01:19 AM
just think how nice it would go with $5K on the engine :p

Blue Supra
09-02-2005, 01:21 AM
m0nst4 51cK Uleh!!!

:D

fpv_gtho
09-02-2005, 01:22 AM
would you spend it all on the engine though, or take the chance to get a kit and play with the suspension

SlickHolden
09-02-2005, 01:26 AM
t3h VL i5 t3h s1ck35t c4r 3V4 Y0!!!

yeh pretty much only clown in backwards caps and the seat rolled all the way down know holden ONLY for the VL.

It hurts Slick, i know. My cars needed nothing but love and S**Tloads of money since i bought it :(
Something i don't have really. It took allmost all i had to buy it and RWC it. And what i was hoping was only fuel issues could turn nasty.
I have wallpaper of my car on the screen and i had to remove it cause i can't stand to look at it right now:D.. But it will go back up soon i hope.
I hope it's done a tailshaft so i can just get that done sounds better then the diff or tranny gone:D

Blue Supra
09-02-2005, 01:48 AM
yeh a tailshaft is pretty generic and should be easily sourcable.

With 5k i'f dump in a turbo and FMIC, 3 inch exhaust and thatd prolly be my 5k gone.

fpv_gtho
09-02-2005, 01:50 AM
might want to squeeze in an ECU tune or Unichip there as well..

tailshafts usually let go from high velocities though, its why Ford limit their one tonners to 180km/h as they still have the 1 piece unit whilst the sedans have a 2 piece

Blue Supra
09-02-2005, 01:54 AM
an average family owned VP tailshaft should be fine to throw in though. Seeing how the cars been used to tow a fair bit its not suprising SOMETHING in the driveline gave out.

fpv_gtho
09-02-2005, 01:56 AM
i wouldve expected the diff or torque converter to go first though, but hey thats what happens i guess

Blue Supra
09-02-2005, 02:04 AM
true, but theres always exceptions.

fpv_gtho
09-02-2005, 02:06 AM
yeah, any weak spot can be targeted and with mass produced cars, theres so much variances in the tolerances that you wont get 2 identical cars.

Blue Supra
09-02-2005, 02:11 AM
Yeh, the odds are you wont get ANOTHER dodgey shaft.

fpv_gtho
09-02-2005, 02:15 AM
anything could happen, slick might get lucky and it wont require a new tailshaft, just recalibration etc or it might be unbalanced

SlickHolden
09-02-2005, 03:13 AM
I feel it is unbalnaced when driving sometimes it's got a little vibration in accelarating which my brothers does also, He told me cold be the years of towing huge weights like his, But he went on to say that the VP would tow the work trailer with all that stuff they take on. It also towed his bloody boat which just fit in the garage and ad on to all this he drove it in some ruff places on worl sight low to the ground pot holes bumps and all. When you think about it he really treated it like shit for 16 months when useing it as the worl car. Before that it wasn't really used in that way the big boss smashed the VP calais they used to tow all the stuff, Then smashed the Ford Wagon. So they were without a car and they called on him cause he had the heavy duty tow bar and suspension set-up to handle heavy weight. It would have been 2 and a half years if they didnt find a new car to tow there crap. Maybe thank christ the injectors and this and that went and it was costing them almost $50 per day in petrol:eek:.
So the Boss bought a EB Falcon it leaks all over the place but runs good and it's got LSD which he loves to light them up:D

fpv_gtho
09-02-2005, 03:36 AM
if its unbalanced, it should be easy enough to fix, it might just take a while for them to find out where to add any weight etc, but for wheels its simple enough

nota
09-02-2005, 04:44 AM
Is the tailshaft centre bearing ok or not? With all that enthusiastic driving, I wouldn't be surprised. Simple to check, just crawl under & try lifting the shaft where the bearing is. Any play present and there's your answer. Cheap to fix too. I chewed out a CB in my new VK V8 in under 20,000kms

SlickHolden
09-02-2005, 08:54 AM
There is a 1in10 chance of me getting under the car:p.. But i hope they guy thats looking at it monday or sometime next week will find it if it's not much to fix.
I will need some ramps one day:)

Blue Supra
09-02-2005, 06:11 PM
dont buy ramps theyre frustrating as hell, you can get a 1300kg jack from autoBarn atm for $30. or a pack with a 1600kg jack and 2 stands for 65 bucks from autopro i think. theyre well worth it mate, ive got 4 stands and that little jack get the car up enough for me to put it up on stands and crawl under easy.

fpv_gtho
09-02-2005, 09:16 PM
you could balance the VP on the 1600kg jack, let alone lift up one end/corner

Blue Supra
09-02-2005, 09:36 PM
exactly, theyre bloody good value.

Im sure you know better then to get under a car solely supported by a jack though.:)

fpv_gtho
09-02-2005, 09:49 PM
well some people wouldnt suggest doing it with only 2 stands and a jack...but i suppose in a way thats still safer than one end up in the air on the jack and the other 2 wheels still on the road

SlickHolden
09-03-2005, 02:44 AM
I'll tell you how light the VP is. It's raining now and before i droped it back @ 60kp/h:eek: wheelspin heaven:p But not sideways at all just wheelspin.
And that hole drive was shutter free;).. It's starting to piss me off now and my brother says i worry to much... This is comming from the guy who herd a mouse creak in the rear and paid $700 to have all new rubbers done on the rear + 2 new pedders sports ryder shocks $200;). Who worrys to much:p.

fpv_gtho
09-03-2005, 04:42 AM
yeah unless your going around a corner or have an LSD, an open diff will just spin rather than kick out as that wheel thats not getting any power will keep the other one in place

SlickHolden
09-03-2005, 05:20 AM
No fun:D.. I was thinking of getting LS in the centre of my diff but wasn's sure if they can do it or not or how much it would cost. Might be cheaper for the hole thing?.
Atleast with a LSD you know it will kick out left or right, 99% of the time it's left. But it's predictiable so you know it. If a open single goes sideways it bites fast and hard and there isnt much chance of getting it back as i found out not to long ago. It could go left right how the hell knows with them.
I would like a LSD for grip not the fun side like most have. I would really wan't better traction more power down.