FPV F6 Typhoon

[fpv_gtho]

FPV plans to take the MMS by storm with the F6 Typhoon Concept, making approximately 280kw and if they use the tremec manual, more than 500nm. so far only drawings have been issued but what can be seen is the basics of the bodykit similar to that of the V8 models, different alloy wheels, no bonnet bulge and possibly a smaller rear spoiler. HSV wont be sitting around doing nothing either and with rumours of a 320kw GTS, to a GTSX arriving its anyones guess what they'll show. Maybe a 6.0L GTS stroker?

[crisis]

FPV plans to take the MMS by storm with the F6 Typhoon Concept, making approximately 280kw and if they use the tremec manual, more than 500nm. so far only drawings have been issued but what can be seen is the basics of the bodykit similar to that of the V8 models, different alloy wheels, no bonnet bulge and possibly a smaller rear spoiler. HSV wont be sitting around doing nothing either and with rumours of a 320kw GTS, to a GTSX arriving its anyones guess what they'll show. Maybe a 6.0L GTS stroker?
Its about time. I was starting to get bored.

[Wouter Melissen]

The press release:

This dynamic new production concept will add another dimension to the exciting evolution of FPV and build on the success it has generated since the launch of the GT, GT-P and Pursuit ute last year.

“This is the beginning of a new era for Ford Performance Vehicles,” says David Flint, Managing Director of Ford Performance Vehicles.

“When we announced the formation of Ford Performance Vehicles we promised to create the broadest range of locally-developed high-performance vehicles in Australia. We believe the exciting F6 Typhoon is the next step in delivering that promise – but certainly not the last.”

“We raised the bar in the V8 segment with the GT, and we believe the F6 Typhoon will further strengthen our position as the technical leaders in the tribal high-performance vehicle market. It will demonstrate our commitment to providing a family of cars that offer a Total Performance package.”

The F6 Typhoon will be powered by a high-performance turbo-charged and intercooled 4.0-litre six cylinder engine that is certain to provide exhilarating performance. More information, including power and torque outputs, will be released at the Melbourne Motor Show on February 27.

[fpv_gtho]

with a starting price at around $55K this will probably sell like hotcakes. this is proof enough for me something like the GTHO's going to be released again, cause i think FPV would want their V8 back as their fastest model. first the XR6T beat the XR8 now this is gunna wipe the floor clean with the GT and give the clubby a real challenge in the performance stakes. just hope ford are trying to get around their problems with launching

[SHAKER]

you got to question whehter a v8 will be viable now though, with only its second upgrade and a 40 kw boost, thats pretty impressive, although i think Ford should keep the xr6, xr6t, xr8, gt, gtp and with the typhoon(first ive heard of it today actually) bump it up as THE high performace turbo ...(not that the xr6t is any slouch). They should make a GTHO and it should be a thorobread racer to race in GT Perfomance catagory and the nations cup series aswell...(aka bathurst 24 hour!) It should be light weight, and have minimal features (delete such features as air, elecy windows etc) and make it a true high horsepower limited edition weapon. I think itll be very important to keep the weight down though, and make it as light as possible, as i feel the falcons are getting to heavy to be considering a real threat to the evos and wrxs let alone the GTS and the clubsport.

[fpv_gtho]

well comparing the XR6T and the triton V8, the V8's got torque going for it and a much stronger transmission range.

if the GTHO comes out, it may have to be put in nations cup if it needs things like 1500kg, AWD, 6 speed, 400kw, 6 piston calipers, 200L fuel tank.....all that crap to make it faster than its turbo brothers. that'll be too much for GT Performance to handle, but maybe not quite enough for Nations Cup.

ive also heard somewhere that the TR-3650 tranny doesnt fit on the 6 cylinder as its a one piece bell housing and transmission housing

[Falcon500]

I dont know about that personally theyll more then likly hobble it to keep it in gt-p or they wont allow the proclaimed ho to race unless its invitational (why do you think they let the 427 race? proclaimed low numbers with a price tag to match and proven performance from the 24 hour corvettes)...i doubt theyll put AWD on it yet....i hope they dont anyways 6 gears would be ok 1500kg weight would be great (how they would achive that with out exotic materials is beyond me) 6 piston calipers wouldbe nice although a 200liter fuel tank might be a bit of overkill unless its enduro raceing.
as far as the typhoon is concerned all the power to them fpv has already sold 1300 vehicals this year and looks like they want to expand give them a few more years and i think theyll seriously be sticking it to "australia 6th biggest manufactuor" (HSV)

[crisis]

They should make a GTHO and it should be a thorobread racer to race in GT Perfomance catagory and the nations cup series aswell...(aka bathurst 24 hour!) It should be light weight, and have minimal features (delete such features as air, elecy windows etc) and make it a true high horsepower limited edition weapon. I think itll be very important to keep the weight down though, and make it as light as possible, as i feel the falcons are getting to heavy to be considering a real threat to the evos and wrxs let alone the GTS and the clubsport.
Most people want all of those goodies when they pay in excess of $60000 for a car ( which is what something like this would cost ). A lot of people like to show them off to their freinds and dont want to hear things like "what no electric windows, my BMW has them". The assumption that FPV will wipe the floor with HSV is interesting. FPV severely undercut the price of comparitive HSVs but HSV responded by upping the output and matching the price ie R8 vs GT. The GT has the engine numbers but performance wise they are line ball. FPV has to win sales , HSV only has to retain them so the balls stil a little in HSVs court. This and the fact that HSV have added the Coupe 4 and Avalanche kind of shores them up by weight of product range alone. FPV is great for Ford fans and indirectly a bonus for Holden fans by way of lighting the fire under HSVs arse to ensure they dont get complacent. FPV hinging their hopes on a turbo 6 is also interesting with the traditional Aussie supercar market being V8 focussed.

[fpv_gtho]

FPV hinging their hopes on a turbo 6 is also interesting with the traditional Aussie supercar market being V8 focussed.


FPV realise this and thats their plan. they want to sell V8's but they dont want to limit themselves to V8's and have indirectly mentioned they dont want to follow HSV's path in that sense. If David Flint got the developmetn money and the go ahead, thered be FPV Fiesta's, Focus's, Falcons, Fairlanes, Territory's but i dont think he'd touch the Explorer, Courier or F series.

maybe a hint to what is instore for the GTHO, someone inside FPV, i think one of the chief technical guru's said on the possibility of a supercharger sitting atop the BOSS's vee that it would be a backwards step in technology, and FPV want to move forward. with that i guess the only forced induction possibilities are a vortec type centrifugal supercharger, as i highly doubt theres room for a couple of snails hanging off the block or a side block mounted supercharger.

but then again, its the heads that have the most trouble finding room so something like twin turbo might not be out of the equation

[crisis]

Do these guys know where their market is? Or are they trying to creat a new one. All that you have said is great. Traditionally though, Ford and Holden fans have wanted V8s. We'll see how it gos.

[fpv_gtho]

australians do want V8's, thats right. perhaps thats why the GT is supposedly still going to be 10kw more powerful than the Typhoon, but that wont be enough to keep it quicker, it has enough trouble staying just quicker than the 240kw XR6T and even then more often then not the XR6T is faster.

also dont forget that cars like the VL Turbo, XU-1 torana and the old chargers havent gone down as hated cars as a result of their 6 cylinder power. with the release of the Typhoon though, it would be nice to see the GT crack 300kw. FPV can do it regardless of all theyre comments of the BOSS 290 being against the wall in terms of efficiency, its only been since the Y series 2, DJR HP320 and the Typhoon that theyve needed a reason for more power

[SHAKER]

Most people want all of those goodies when they pay in excess of $60000 for a car ( which is what something like this would cost ). A lot of people like to show them off to their freinds and dont want to hear things like "what no electric windows, my BMW has them". The assumption that FPV will wipe the floor with HSV is interesting. FPV severely undercut the price of comparitive HSVs but HSV responded by upping the output and matching the price ie R8 vs GT. The GT has the engine numbers but performance wise they are line ball. FPV has to win sales , HSV only has to retain them so the balls stil a little in HSVs court. This and the fact that HSV have added the Coupe 4 and Avalanche kind of shores them up by weight of product range alone. FPV is great for Ford fans and indirectly a bonus for Holden fans by way of lighting the fire under HSVs arse to ensure they dont get complacent. FPV hinging their hopes on a turbo 6 is also interesting with the traditional Aussie supercar market being V8 focussed.

People do expect extra options on a car if they WANT extra options, as the GTHO should be kept to a limited number(say 500) It wouldnt be a profitable car for Ford, it would prob cost them money as it did withthe PHASE 3, but it would showcase there ability to produce a race/road car and enter it in either gtp or nations cup series.....If you want the extras you would buy a GTP. The GTHO would be a thorobread racer (such as the gt porsches in europe) and i believe should have minimal features as most of them would be bought buy people in the motor racing fraternity anyway, it would be more of a bragging rights car than a car for an average jo blo.

[fpv_gtho]

its a hard debate about what ford should do for a BA GTHO. everyones got their opinion based on what the original cars were, but more often then not their vision is clouded. most people think the GTHO's were stripped out racers specifically for the track with a rumbling V8. well thats only because when the PH1, 2 and 3 came out, what the GTHO provided was a luxury filled track car.

because of this, i believe that any attempt at a BA GTHO should be based off the GT-P. stiffen and lower the suspension as well as anything else ol' Johnny Bowe reckons needs doing, stick a V8 engine with far more power than 290kw, 6 speed transmission, be it auto or manual just have some manual mode on it and sell that to the public.

Then, in the options list, have things like replacing the leather, 6/8 way electric sports seats with fixed carbon fibre buckets, removal of audio system, removal of air con, removal of back seats, removal of 90% of sound deadening, all things people want done to it to have it a pure track car, all as delete options and without telling anyone except the buyer offer some rebate for getting rid of such luxury options.

on top of that, perhaps even offer options such as weight reduction of bodypanels including such methods of removing the ribbing from the bonnet and boot etc, foam filling doors after theve been stripped and fitting some sort of roll cage. have the option to blue print the motor as well i reckon, HSV done it with the GTS-R so why shouldnt fpv do it?? for those exclusive buyers who posess a CAMS motorsport license, offer to remove the speed and possibly even rev limiter completely.

the only problem with all that of course, is who would offer warranty on such a beast

[SHAKER]

its a hard debate about what ford should do for a BA GTHO. everyones got their opinion based on what the original cars were, but more often then not their vision is clouded. most people think the GTHO's were stripped out racers specifically for the track with a rumbling V8. well thats only because when the PH1, 2 and 3 came out, what the GTHO provided was a luxury filled track car.

because of this, i believe that any attempt at a BA GTHO should be based off the GT-P. stiffen and lower the suspension as well as anything else ol' Johnny Bowe reckons needs doing, stick a V8 engine with far more power than 290kw, 6 speed transmission, be it auto or manual just have some manual mode on it and sell that to the public.

Then, in the options list, have things like replacing the leather, 6/8 way electric sports seats with fixed carbon fibre buckets, removal of audio system, removal of air con, removal of back seats, removal of 90% of sound deadening, all things people want done to it to have it a pure track car, all as delete options and without telling anyone except the buyer offer some rebate for getting rid of such luxury options.

on top of that, perhaps even offer options such as weight reduction of bodypanels including such methods of removing the ribbing from the bonnet and boot etc, foam filling doors after theve been stripped and fitting some sort of roll cage. have the option to blue print the motor as well i reckon, HSV done it with the GTS-R so why shouldnt fpv do it?? for those exclusive buyers who posess a CAMS motorsport license, offer to remove the speed and possibly even rev limiter completely.

the only problem with all that of course, is who would offer warranty on such a beast

I wish i knew how to just paste the peice of print i wanted to.......But anyway, what you say about the GTHO(phase 1,2 and 3) isnt completely true fpv, although they were given extra items, most of these items were for safety more than luxury, as they did not have aircon or power steering or a moon roof as an option(as was optional on the standard GT).They did how ever come out with beefed up suspension,bigger brakes, extra driving lights, bonnet pins,front and rear spoilers, sports tacho (not to mention the mechanical performance upgrade). Most of these items that were put on the car did serve as a purpose, mainly to make the cars safer at high speed(although the spoilers are debatable and they do look better without them)!!

[fpv_gtho]

well the front spoiler at least restricted cooling and the rear spoiler had no purpose. but my original point was the original HO's werent built the way they were just simply to win bathurst or anything. ford built them off the fairmont with luxury AND sports equipment, and yet everyone it seems who wants the GTHO to return wants it as a bare bones racer. i just think the buying public should be given the option of both

[Falcon500]

well the front spoiler at least restricted cooling and the rear spoiler had no purpose. but my original point was the original HO's werent built the way they were just simply to win bathurst or anything. ford built them off the fairmont with luxury AND sports equipment, and yet everyone it seems who wants the GTHO to return wants it as a bare bones racer. i just think the buying public should be given the option of both Yeah but they were bare bones in ways... i lead you to these examples GTs came standard with radios Hos didnt have them at all...hos didnt have body deadener GTs did HOs had slightly better tyers (huge for the day) and so on and so forth. It still had the nice Bucket seats and the fairmont door trims (hell they couldent really put the scabby looking scat pack stuff my car has now could they? that and the fact the bench and the scat door trims were actually heavier moor wood in the doors keeps them stiff and more of a seat)

[fpv_gtho]

lol, it seems every time i say something on this topic i get proven wrong about something. i may be repeating myself my now but i just dont see why people wan a new GTHO to keep to tradition AND be a bare bones racer, when i dont see the original as being one. thats why i like my idea of basing the new car on the GT-P and having all the luxury items a delete option and have race options like a roll cage, no speed limiter and a blueprinted engine

[Falcon500]

Well i just done that to put you dead straight yuo wernt far off. :D
As for the bare bones...i dont care ford knows what they and the public want and ill just happilyabide by any decision theymake.

[crisis]

also dont forget that cars like the VL Turbo, XU-1 torana and the old chargers havent gone down as hated cars as a result of their 6 cylinder power. with the release of the Typhoon though, it would be nice to see the GT crack 300kw. FPV can do it regardless of all theyre comments of the BOSS 290 being against the wall in terms of efficiency, its only been since the Y series 2, DJR HP320 and the Typhoon that theyve needed a reason for more power
I dont say that a 6 will be "hated". It will undoubtably sell as the XR6T has shown a market for this. In many ways I imagine a more sophisticated buyer going down this path for some reason. My interest is that FPV cannot afford to do too much wrong in the way of spending developement money. So I think they would be wise to appeal to the lowest common denominator , a known market, before getting too clever. I agree with your comments about how the series II Y series has kicked them along. Ironically the BA kicked along the Y series. Keep kicking I rekon.

[crisis]

People do expect extra options on a car if they WANT extra options, as the GTHO should be kept to a limited number(say 500) It wouldnt be a profitable car for Ford, it would prob cost them money as it did withthe PHASE 3, but it would showcase there ability to produce a race/road car and enter it in either gtp or nations cup series would be more of a bragging rights car than a car for an average jo blo.
Businesses get twitchy when things arent profitable. Its the reason they exist. I understand your philosophy but like HSV and the HRT427, companies dont like risking money on dodgy bets.

[crisis]

they did not have aircon or power steering or a moon roof as an option(as was optional on the standard GT).
In those days most cars didnt come with air conditioning or power steering. Moon roofs were called sun roofs and were the domain of panel vans. Many cars didnt have radios, AM only of course.

[SHAKER]

Power steering and aircon were standard equipment on fairmonts. mY XR FAIRMONT HAD POWER STEERING FROM THE FACTORY AND THAT WAS IN 1966! sorry about ths caps,although Im not sure when aircon became standard equipment on the fairmonts, but id say it was probarbly in the xa series.

[fpv_gtho]

when i first look at the prospect of an XR-XY fairmont coming standard with air con, its a bit daunting, but then i remember my dads 66 impala has factory power windows...........

[Falcon500]

The air conditiong was standard by XD but was the most popular delete option the offer for deletion wasnt availble by XF. I actually got the air con from my Grandfathers XA fairmont (now belongs to my uncle when they bought a new dawoo of all things) sititng in the back shed interchangeable through out the falcon series they had options of it since the XP i think (my sources are sketchy on anything before XR)

[SHAKER]

I know for sure aircon was available on the xy series.(the fairlanes would of had aircon standard when air became available!), as i saw a mint vermillion fire red at the GT Nationals in adelaide in 1999, he drove it from Melbourne and he had all the options under the sun, 8 track casette player, moon roof, aircon and power steering, it was the nicest GT i had ever seen in my life, and i had mine parked next to his(same colour and model), but it made mine look pretty ordinary, even though mine was a nice car, his was just immaculate!

[Falcon500]

It sure was available but the GTs only cameout with such items with a specail number for examle myold mans one off colour.

[fpv_gtho]

it sounds like the whole XA RPO ordeal where they chucked a limited number of certain parts on XA GT's, in an attempt to vent their anger towards the government at the time, coughphase4cough

[SHAKER]

it sounds like the whole XA RPO ordeal where they chucked a limited number of certain parts on XA GT's, in an attempt to vent their anger towards the government at the time, coughphase4cough

It wasnt so much to show there anger to the government as it was to get rid of the parts they had already purchased for the production of the H.O without making a phase 4. Ive heard tales of fairlaines with phase 4 parts aswell, but its probarbly all just hooha. Most of the RPOs where sold to people in the motor racing industry as Ford didnt want to advertise Falcons with the Phase 4 parts on them, for obvious reasons.

[fpv_gtho]

well you could probably find at least 1 351 Landau whith RPO parts, but the story ive heard was ford secretly threw specialty parts on selected XA GT's, and just slipped the word to the buyer. either way the government had no idea what was going on at the time, they just though they stopped 400hp race cars making their way onto the streets

[Falcon500]

They actually came out in Landaus ive talked to a gentalman whoowns a yellow ford landau with a phase 4 engine in it. Ford even from the factory has been known to put phase 4 engines in XDs the parts stuck around and rpos all but about 3 offically came out in full spec the rest had random parts thrown at them some getting a bit of this and bit off that while missing out on the large majority.

[fpv_gtho]

fords books say that the RPO's got the phase 3's 780cfm carb and larger extractors, which gave the 351 about 350hp. pretty much the only phase 3 parts that didnt get included was the cam and cam gears, which allowed free-er revving above 6000rpm. they couldve kept adding them until the XD cause with the XA RPO, although the phase 4 as a car couldnt be homologated, the bigger extractors, bigger carbie could

[Falcon500]

Well if you lookedmore closely restoration books state that restoring a RPO is not suggested unless all origonal parts are still there as they were a mongrel breed of car other then a small handfull no 2 were identical.

[fpv_gtho]

its too bad tthey, or at least the ones ive seen, still kept the 14x6 inch wheels, like the ph4 was supposed to get 15x7 bathurst globes.....

[Falcon500]

Thats just one example of the variations they have...some even came out with the chrome ones like they had on the XR GT.

[fpv_gtho]

well ive read from an article shaker gave me that the 15x7's compared to the 14x6's were worlds apart in grip and handling. also, they went on to explain that it was a good thing to soften up the rear suspension and remove the rear antiroll bar.

[crisis]

when i first look at the prospect of an XR-XY fairmont coming standard with air con, its a bit daunting, but then i remember my dads 66 impala has factory power windows...........
Sorry, I wasnt really reffering to Fairmonts etc. More the base model Falcons etc.

[fpv_gtho]

well i was basing what i said mroeso on what shaker had said. as for standard falcons coming with air, i think that one goes to the AU or maybe AU2

[SHAKER]

with the canning of the phase 4 ford had to revert back to the phase 3 for bathurst in 72, so ford gave everyone who purchased the phase three , the phase 4 globe mags free so ford could race the phase 3 with the phase 4 rims at bathurst, it was reported that it could cut down brake tempertaures by 50%(because of the extra airflow thru the design of the rims and because alloy dispenses heat quicker than steel).

[fpv_gtho]

yeah i heard about that, apparently the design was patented to the ferrari daytona as well. the issue of collings been arisen on the current V8 Supercars as well.

i'd say if you wanted some of the best cooling though, go for alluminium wheels as they spread all the heat over the surface or magnesium wheels and carbon fibre discs. but thats going a bit far

[SHAKER]

apparantly magnesium wheels were available in australia as many cars raced with them in different classes around the country , but they were not suitable for road cars because they were to soft for the ausy roads(this was back in the 70s)

[fpv_gtho]

well im sure its safe to say magnesium wheels and australian roads have progressed quite a bit in the last 3 decades, but easily the wheels are ahead lol. im considering getting magnesium wheels on a car but that depends on if whats in the wallet allows it. my plan is to eventually get a stripped out drag type car thats also got good handling and a cruising car that'll have the aircon, 8 way power seats and 15 speaker stereo lol

[fpv_gtho]

Who likes the sound of 270kw and 550nm?

[SHAKER]

i like what i see but didnt hear anything, so this is the new Typhoon?...it has the GT bumper, it looks pretty nice, any more info on it?

[fpv_gtho]

Basically it will be trimmed like the GT. It will come standard with the performance brake package optional on the XR6T and come optional with the Brembo brake package. with 550nm theres no way its still using the T5 and its definately got the TR-3650. some people over at www.fordaustraliaforum.com seem to think that 550nm will put the tremec to its limits like 450nm did for the XR6T but im not believing them as dick johnson had no worries not upgrading the transmission on the HP320

[fpv_gtho]

if you look closely at the first picture you;ll notice the XR6T's black intercoler replaced with a silver unit and i believe the grill mesh is different to the GT's

[SHAKER]

Any stats/specs on the performance times of the typhoon? With 550 nm of torque and prob much much lighter than a GT it would be in the high 13 sec bracket and possibly high 5s for 0-100kph?Im only hoping this is the case!What will this do to Holdens supercharged 6?The new Ford Turbo 6 is certainly making it look more and more of a dinasour! Its an exciting time for Ford fans, I cant ever remember Ford getting so serious about performance cars, looks like they've got there passion back as it is remenicent of the early 70s, when the HOs were released, lets hope they keep it going and claw there way back to the top of the sales chart, there certainly going in the right direction !

[fpv_gtho]

Its not as good times as you would expect SHAKER. The Typhoon will ultimately be quicker than the GT at a less price and be better equiped (it comes standard with side airbags), but i dont think by much, Maybe around 5.5 0-100 compared to 5.8 for the GT. The XR6T is not really that much lighter than most people would expect, whilst on its Euro tour it was weighed at 1775kg, but im not certain on the conditioins of that but 1725kg has been quoted elsewhere. The Typhoon will more than likely edge up to over 1750kg but its still not as front heavy as the V8 which is its biggest upbringing. FPV havent played all of their cards yet also, and with the Typhoon set for BA2, thers more power to be put into the GT and possibly a GTHO to be brought out if FPV can agree on the right formula

[FoMoCo90ºV]

As you eluded to FPV, the Typhoon will be released under BA Series II guise, which from what I have read will be somewhat lighter than the current series. If this is the case, then with the gobs of torque this brute puts out, it should supply a right royal kick in the pants to most V8's going around....

[SHAKER]

Not as exciting as id excpect?I guess ur talking in a sales point of view as i know Toyota and Holden are a mile ahead in that respect, but in terms of model options and designs, its certainly looking better than 4 years ago with the release of the AU series, youve got to admit.

[Falcon500]

Well with this car getting lighter hopefull will mean a lighter GT and also this car being so fast will also more then liklymean that ford willmake the GT faster more out of princabel!....just one Q does the typhoon have the 6 speecder that was proposed for the BAII models?

[fpv_gtho]

the concept has a 5 speed manual, but anyone with knowledge of the T5 transmission would know that its definately been kicked out between the transition from XR6T to T6 Typhoon. Some tuners have said that by putting the power on after say 3500rpm you can keep the T5, but FPV completely ignored this and have about 540nm at 1750rpm coming from the straight six.

i actually read somewhere, that geoff polites himself said that the weight reduction program was unlikely to appear for BA2 and that ford would just focus its resources on making the straight 6 more economical

[Falcon500]

Well the way im looking atthatis thats very well worded "FORD will focus on makeing the 6 more economical" and with FPVs proclomation of total performance i think theyll be focusing on the v8s....just the way i see it.

[fpv_gtho]

or FORD will focus on pulling everything from the VCT they can to save as much fuel as they can whilst FPV go and pull as much metal out of the car as they can and either just leave it be or do a replacement job on some parts with either alluminium (in suspension maybe) or some exotic materials in say the roof panel, bonnet and boot

we also shouldnt forget that FPV have openly hinted that they havent left the V8 alone outside of the GT's development

[Falcon500]

Give them a fewmodel revisions and the fuel ecconmy shouldbe pretty good and not to mention the v8s will be faster.

[fpv_gtho]

well yeah, with time ford will stumble across new developments in the engine, nothing as sever as the 25kw jump BA took but still things like when they first introduced the dual stage plenum to enhance the power and torque curves. in a lighter car, ford will be able to let the VCT create some power as now its the revised block making all the power and the VCT keeping the fuel consumption under control

[Falcon500]

Well as i said after a few year refinement on this already good vehical will come in and make it even better! and as you said the engine will be changed with demands of the people who always want more performance or ecconmy...and they always want both! And soon holden will be intorucing a new vehical which will be a world product (so its designed by someone else :D and being a world car will be incredabily adaptable) which means it will be a good base to work off and hopefully they both willbe in the game of outoding eachother again (circa EB VP to EL VS that was the last time they were playing off each other the most through either refinement or priceing)

[fpv_gtho]

well im sure fords stretched more than 300hp naturally aspirated out of the 6 but the 1700kg weight of the BA chassis with a 300hp 6 would be using more fuel than the Boss V8

the next models to come from ford and holden though, from what ive heard, they'll have as much contrast as the AU and VT did. whilst the EA and VN mightve had their similarities same with the EF and VR, Holden are following the direction of the vectra and the chev ss concept, ford are chasing the 427 concept

[Falcon500]

Thats more then lily the case but the aforementioned lightening and the already bland ecconmy (well compred to previous models) will probly make ford do some fairly drastic work to at least keepit the same...and i think theyll hold off 300+ hpfor at least a time.
Well EA and vn as far as im concerned the only similaritys they had where price and they both had problems! Holden are chaseing stabilising saleswhile ford are chaseing image...both are succeding at the moment but something will have to give...wonder which one will?

[fpv_gtho]

yeah 300hp out of the standard 6 is a while off....but one day it will come. i'd almost think about bringing back the 3.3L straight 6, like im sure some people think that 182kw is more power than what they'll ever need and a smaller, less powerful engine could bring a cheaper base model falcon

[Falcon500]

Well likemy falcon a range of 6s 200 cube =taxi 250=average family car and i guess the 2v would be like the xr6...the coppas even used the 2v versions in sydney and crouded places v8couldent wind out in their crouded streets maeking the sligtly moreagile 6s seem better. But yeah smaller less powerful 6s would appeal more to the taxi brigage a wozers who are econmicaly minded.
An interesting point that ever since the EF they have only had 2 size engines 4 liter 6 and 5 liter v8 (still the same now with samesize 6 and 5.4 v8) i wonder what ford would think of that for an idea....i wouldent want a small banger but the idea sounds very viable.

[fpv_gtho]

well powerwise, i guess the dedicated LGP 6 would cater for those who dont need all the power of the normal six but it brings a price increase rather than a price decrease. also something to note is ford doesnt have 2 different V8's available with the 302 and 351 gone. possibly now they could do the 3 and 4 valve 5.4

[Falcon500]

Well ill count the boss and the 220 engines as being diffrent aninmals to be honest. But thats is also true ford used to have numerous v8s and options 302 2 barral/4barral carbie a/c or not you get the pic...i still think say a 3.2 liter gas powerd 6 sounds like a great idea for the taxis an govo vehicals.

[fpv_gtho]

well to be honest a 3.3/3.2 dedicated gas powered straight 6 although having a healthy torque figure would be pretty gutless and would more than likely attract its fair share of whinging and criticism from wheels' direction, but still its an opportunity left open on a lighter car.

If not privide say 2/3 6 cylinders and 2 V8's in the XT, perhaps space the engines out, like have a higher power 6 in the XR6 and the Ghia's, and a more powerful SOHC V8 in a lower level XR8 and the Ghia's again so the fairmont/fairlane ghia could walk away with a 240kw V8 and 200kw 6 thats also shared with teh XR6

[XW Futura]

FPV plans to take the MMS by storm with the F6 Typhoon Concept, making approximately 280kw and if they use the tremec manual, more than 500nm. so far only drawings have been issued but what can be seen is the basics of the bodykit similar to that of the V8 models, different alloy wheels, no bonnet bulge and possibly a smaller rear spoiler. HSV wont be sitting around doing nothing either and with rumours of a 320kw GTS, to a GTSX arriving its anyones guess what they'll show. Maybe a 6.0L GTS stroker?

Heard a rumor the Typhoon would have been well over 300KW, but Ford hasn't got a drive train for the 6 that will hold up to it, when they do, watch out, finally an Aussie turbo Jap killer

[fpv_gtho]

well that was a fiarly exxagerated rumour. everything ive heard has said it will definately stay less than the GT in terms of power. the only rumours ive heard mentioning "over 300kw" have been those suggesting the original numbers first pushed out of the engine when ford first fitted the garret GT40 turbo after the Gt35 made too much lag......

interestingly, the power increase didnt directly come from a boost increase, rather a bigger intercooler and higher flow intake making the turbo work more efficiently

for the drivetrain though, ford have access to the ZF 6 speed transmission with a torque capacity somewhere around 630nm, but i dont think Dana could make a diff to handle all of that power and torque

[Falcon500]

Dont they use Borg warner diffs? bothholden and ford and even in their top preformers? And daana could they used to make them for claimed 425 hp hemis i think they could brew something up....
Well the gas 3.2 was a fleet idea something intended for the goverment/taxis and onlyavailable to the public upon requeast (and other then the goverment and other driving jobs i doubt many people wouldtouch them with a 10 foot pole) Well a more powerful engine in the G220 and something thats a slightly more sporty XT wouldent hurt either.

[fpv_gtho]

its definately Dana, i read a short bit in a recent wheels magazine saying that Dana was going to increase their production capacity to over 100,000 units a year to accomodate approximately 70,000 falcons and 30,000 territory's

its really just in your perception how you could see the XT. Ford made the base model alot more sporty with the BA but perhaps its just the steel wheels with hubcaps holding the package back....

for me the G220 is nice, but still too subtle. after seeing the FPV Galaxie540, i really think FPV should have another attempt at the LWB market. i never thought the dipped headlights and bonnet bulge would work on the fairlane body, but they gel brilliantly

[Falcon500]

Fair enough then...I was sure BW made the difffs but i have been known to be wrong in the past.
Well that is quite posssbile but the sprint didnt really sell terribly well and it was a stripped down EB GT (it sold ok) prehaps...they should step a little all round maybey....or maybey not. Either way it was just a suggestion.
Well its likea shaker and a spiler on a ZG fairlane...it workd quite well.

[fpv_gtho]

well i think i heard somewhere that Borg Warner and BTR were the same company or something, so you could have something there with Dana and BTR both being local engineering shops.

well holden seem to successfly be selling a striped SS in the SV8 but i think the position their in, makes it so the things you would option on the SV8 would make it almost more reasonable to take the SS. Ford recently added the luxury pack on the that for about $5K you can get the fairmont ghia dash and leather seats in the XR6T and XR8 and rear power windows and traction control added to that in the XR6. perhaps if the XR8 had this standard and a base model went back to the XT interior there would be success there

FPV though would be extremely scared of entering the LWB market after the severe failure of the T3 TL50, i think they sold 3!

[crisis]

well i think i heard somewhere that Borg Warner and BTR were the same company or something, so you could have something there with Dana and BTR both being local engineering shops.

well holden seem to successfly be selling a striped SS in the SV8 but i think the position their in, makes it so the things you would option on the SV8 would make it almost more reasonable to take the SS.
Actually the series II SV8 has cruise control and electric windows as standard (spewing) so it represents even better value along side the SS. All(!) you miss out on is 18" wheels ( the way Ive gone through them Id be broke if I had 18s) SS body kit (which is pretty sweet) SS interior (nice , but you can do without) CD stacker (CD players are shit anyway), a few more colours and a couple of drink holders.

[fpv_gtho]

well holden usually go pretty troppo when it comes to cup holders, i think they stick 4 in the SS ute lol.

well pretty much the VY2 was so much of an upgrade because of how much the sales of the BA shook the commodore. ford ending the 6 year #1 sales of the commodore wouldve been a harsh blow and i'd say holden just reacted whilst it was still worth their trouble. also i wouldnt be too surprised if with the series 2 SV8 they were trying to take some attention away from the XR6T

[puthpaul]

FPV plans to take the MMS by storm with the F6 Typhoon Concept, making approximately 280kw and if they use the tremec manual, more than 500nm. so far only drawings have been issued but what can be seen is the basics of the bodykit similar to that of the V8 models, different alloy wheels, no bonnet bulge and possibly a smaller rear spoiler. HSV wont be sitting around doing nothing either and with rumours of a 320kw GTS, to a GTSX arriving its anyones guess what they'll show. Maybe a 6.0L GTS stroker?
270kw actually but if they can make 2.5 litre skyline up to 1000hp how about 4 litre xr6

[fpv_gtho]

i know its 270kw, but at the time the rumour was "approximately" 280kw, as i stated. theoretically, i guess the straight six could hold around 1000hp, being a cast iron block, but you wouldnt want to push a stock engine too much farther over that. plust it would be pretty quick aslo, if a 400rwkw XR6T runs 10.98 then whats a 750kw one gunna run

[Nildo]

The XR 6 turbo wouldn't be able to withstand as much as a GTR block if both are left standard. The Falcon is too long in the stroke. Modified, as with most turbos, the limits come down to turbos size, cooling and airflow.

[fpv_gtho]

well the stroke would become a definate problem at around the 1000hp mark, but anyone who didnt invest in any serious mods and wanted their 1000hp XR6T or GTR to last any more than 6 seconds would really be an idiot in my books

[Holden]

;) HRT (Holden Racing Team) are bringing out the HRT 427 with a whopping 417.8kw no %$#@ (Ford) will be able to keep up with this buty of a machine

[crisis]

;) HRT (Holden Racing Team) are bringing out the HRT 427 with a whopping 417.8kw no %$#@ (Ford) will be able to keep up with this buty of a machine
Welcome back from Mars. Did you find any water? The HRT 427 got canned a few months back. Sorry to be the bearer of ill tidings.

[fpv_gtho]

its probably getting close to a year actually since it got dropped, its only appearances where Sydney 2002 and Melbourne 2003. Either way with a 7.0L engine, race inspired mechanics and $220K sticker price it was competing with a completely different audience to your usual FPV and HSV buyer

[Falcon500]

;) HRT (Holden Racing Team) are bringing out the HRT 427 with a whopping 417.8kw no %$#@ (Ford) will be able to keep up with this buty of a machine
I think he didnt find water on mars...thats why hes delirous and talking in tounges.....

And wouldyou mind telling us what a Buty is :p

[DarkPhenix]

Ford Performance Vehicles will re-write the rules in the Australian high-performance car segment with its first turbo-charged production concept car - the F6 Typhoon.

Unveiled today at the Melbourne Motor Show, the F6 Typhoon is certain to establish FPV as the technical leaders in the tribal high-performance market and reinforce the six-cylinder engine as a worthy alternative to FPV's class-leading Boss 290 V8 engine.

The F6 270 Turbo is a turbo charged and intercooled 4.0-litre in-line six-cylinder powerplant with double overhead camshafts and a four-valve aluminium cylinder head. It produces its maximum power of 270kW at 5250rpm while its maximum torque of 550Nm is on tap from 2000rpm and remains constant all the way through to 4250rpm.

It produces more than 80 per cent of its maximum torque at 1500 rpm and over 98 per cent at 1750rpm, ensuring exhilarating performance while also providing an extremely flexible and relaxed nature for everyday city driving.

The F6 Typhoon will join the GT, GT-P and Pursuit Ute as part of the FPV range with production scheduled to commence in the fourth quarter of 2004.

It is expected to retail between $56,000 and $59,000 when it goes on sale, further emphasizing FPV's philosophy of providing outstanding value and performance. It is anticipated that all F6 Typhoon owners will also experience the benefits of the FPV Performance Driving Course. FPV is the only manufacturer in Australia to offer a defensive driver training course with every new vehicle purchased.

The F6 Typhoon production concept is instantly recognizable as part of the FPV family with its standout styling. However, it has a range of unique styling cues, including pewter highlights on the front and rear bumpers, high-tech mesh grille inserts and a rear bootlid spoiler with FPV's trademark three-pillar design.

Inside the cockpit, the car has sports seats with a technical design, suede bolsters and FPV identification in the headrests. It also features aluminium pedals and interior highlights and the unique FPV dash-mounted starter button.

Additional product information will be released closer to the final launch date.

Story by Ford Performance Vehicles Pty Ltd (http://www.supercars.net/cars/2004@$FPV@$F6%20Typhoon%20Conceptg.html)

[DarkPhenix]

FPV F6 Typhoon #2

[SlickHolden]

Good news for ford fans holden will not build turbo in this vz. And if they do it might only be a single not twin. There has been a 3.6lt v6 twin turbo built at 350kw but it's not for holden :(

[fpv_gtho]

If they were smart in capitalising on niche markets (which theyre keen on at the moment) they'd release a turbo model, whether its for VZ or VE. The XR6T is on the market stealing sales from both the XR8 and SS, with the SV8 on a lower level with its more entry spec interior. If and when they release a turbo V6, it should be easier to go twin turbo, with each turbo going off each bank of cylinders to avoid any complications with the plumbing.

[SlickHolden]

As a big fan of the VL Calais turbo i really like these Turbos that ford has made, Fast and handle great nothing better then a turbo passing a V8 hahahahahaha they get the shits to it's tops. Get to the lights and do them again hehehehehe. :D

[fpv_gtho]

well, the XR6T's handling prowess isnt down to the engineering of the turbo kit, but because of the truck design of the 5.4L and the engineering gone into the rear end of the car. the XR6T is only about 50kg lighter than the XR8, but its better balanced as the engine isnt front and top heavy

[Falcon500]

They actually dont handel an incredable ammount better....both cars handel well although the XR6T has a slight advantage...dont forget that it also lacks the poke of the v8 models...

[fpv_gtho]

I think alot of the people who have driven both an XR8 and XR6T would easily take the XR6T. Better price, same equipment, less weight. The XR6T goes faster in a straight line and around a track than the XR8, has more tuning potential fromt he factory turbo kit and doesnt suffer understeer anywhere near as bad as the XR8. When the XR8 was released, alot of people were complaining about the understeer of the XR8

[Falcon500]

The XR6T is slower in a straight line...idont know where you keep getting this from?
But there are also other fact....if the turbo gos bang its alotmore expensive to fix...and also ford is building them in much more limited numbers and they depricaite faster in price....
The XR8 understears more...if you look at the GT whichis what people are raceing the onlything the XR6T beat it in was Targa Tasmanina....

[fpv_gtho]

All the performance tests from both Motor and Wheels have the XR6T about 0.2 seconds faster accelerating than the XR8. Motor has recorded the best times from both of them at a 6.13 and 5.9 for the XR8 and XR6T, but i think their quarter mile times are about 0.1 different. Then again, i dont think the XR8 is offered with the 3.45 diff either.

The GT is proof that the V8 can handle quite well, but the suspension package on the XR8 i think is too close to the XR6T's settings so the understeer isnt hidden by any means.

[SlickHolden]

I read in a car book they had a VYII SS ute and BA XR8 and XR6T utes, Performence wise the SS and XR6T really gave the XR8 a bath in there time testing, The coment from the tester was he wasnt that impressed with it the XR8's engine, But did think it had the best rumble he has herd for a long time.

And i dont think holden likes to turbo since the VL, They have had there chances to turbo but went supercharging, if they do turbo it might be VE with the new rear end. But then again they could surprise us with a turbo or supercharge again ? I kmow this guy that knows a guy that works in holden he has said the first VZ has come of the line with the 3.6lt and said the big change is the engine bay it's differnt not the engine, And body is minor like VT-VX

[fpv_gtho]

yeah that was a motor mag from only a couple of months ago, i think ive got it at my dads. the SS was ahead by about 0.2 of a second over the XR6T but the XR8 in that particular test suffered at about 0.5 seconds behind. Even with the dual exhaust some people are still saying the commodores V8 doesnt sound like a V8.

Neither the RB30DET or the Buick based supercharged V6 were initiatives of Holden. Holden held the rights to use the turbo Nissan motor, thats why the R31 GTS Skyline is naturally aspirated, and the supercharged motor was a unit GM developed stateside for some models they had dropped the V8 from like the Monte Carlo

[SlickHolden]

True about the ls1 it doesnt have a a loud or mean sounding V8 sound, Oi have herd heaps of them and only the GTS has a nice sound little louder, But the good on them is they are soft spoken but carry a big stick lol. A VT commodore ss 5lt kicks but in sound around the corner from my house this guy has a standard exec with all the series 2 lights on it 19" gts rims lowerd 100mm almost hits the ground and his had HDT go over the donk and it punches out 260kw respectable that is but it's the sound of the thing hear it from 5 streets away, If holden can get that sound which they can't or won't they would make young men happy. :D

[fpv_gtho]

Holden and HSV have restrictions like EPA limits and such that they have to follow, and the usual case is the louder the exhaust, the better it usually is. the hard part is engineering a good sound. i think its mainly down to a unique firing order in the LS-1 as opposed to other V8's. most LS-1's ive heard sound pretty good above 4500rpm, but theres still alot of V8's that will kick in with the noise at about 1500rpm. I've only heard a GTS's note a couple of times, and on one occasion it was really terrible, ive told this story here a couple of times, but the car as it went past be sounded pretty damn near to the Buick V6 holden use now, maybe he really had it up just past 6000rpm or something

[Falcon500]

I kmow this guy that knows a guy that works in holden he has said the first VZ has come of the line with the 3.6lt and said the big change is the engine bay it's differnt not the engine, And body is minor like VT-VX
Why am i thinking pato all over again?

And FPV the buick 87 Grand national (GN) engine was a turbocharged lump not supercharged and isa more erstwile engine then holdens supercharged engine could ever hope to be.....and it doesnt carry the phenomial price for a rebuild the rb series engine the VL holdens use.....

Also noise doesnt mean fast.....history in drag raceing has proven it...and hell even v8 supercars does too....have you ever heard a HRT car? quitest car in the field....and im serious there...But the GTS i ehar (incidently the only one the dealership has sold) sounded very meaty...only ls1 ive heard in a long time (and ever stock) that got a second look! still the thing about good sound is it draws attention and fills the owner with more confidence...

[fpv_gtho]

And FPV the buick 87 Grand national (GN) engine was a turbocharged lump not supercharged and isa more erstwile engine then holdens supercharged engine could ever hope to be.....and it doesnt carry the phenomial price for a rebuild the rb series engine the VL holdens use......


i havent said anything about the Grand National, teh only thing Buick ive been talking about is the current V6 Holden have been using since the VN (updated for VS) thats highly based off Buicks V6

[Falcon500]

i havent said anything about the Grand National, teh only thing Buick ive been talking about is the current V6 Holden have been using since the VN (updated for VS) thats highly based off Buicks V6
IS a buick v6 is the operational word...they even had the harmonic balancer issues and the dodgy block angle (60' which seems is not optimal forthe application) the buick engine had...these problems have been remadyed and bandaided over their use though.....

[fpv_gtho]

it may just be a plueprint of the engine and built here. i dont know what the Ecotec upgrade brought in 1996 though, it would be interesting also if the dampolator fitted to the supercharger models is doing anything as well

[Falcon500]

Well i think ecotech was a emission upgrade with a minimal hp increse...i dont really know...what i do know initial gains driveability wise where less noticable then the badge....
All i have to say about the dampilator is they dont seem to brak...i havent seen any...and i have my doubts they have a part number either...personally i will not make any comments on it untill i get some solid evidence on it much like gmh and the energy polariser thing....

[SlickHolden]

As a person who has driven both VR v6 and VS v6 in the vr i got wheelspin on take off the engine was loud on a big foot in it loud out side from the front also It sounded like a hissing sound when it went up a gear from 1st, But the ecotec was slower off the mark hardley any wheel spin at all smoother not as loud as above but the differnece was i seen a performence difference at speeds 25-35kp/h and above that a drivers view only, My bro's 95 fairmont ghia beats vs-vy v6 easy but he said he has trouble with the vn-vr v6 that from standing starts only,

[fpv_gtho]

the only differences i can tell are the visual difference from the engine bay, the Ecotec engine seems to be presented better than the old 3.8L. The mother of one of my friends has an ex police VS and when ive been it and my friends planted the accelerator, it sounds pretty harsh, yet i think my friend and his brother take it as a good thing. ive heard stories though that the original 3.8L's in the VN had to be detuned to stop people spinning the wheels when they took off from the lights etc

[Falcon500]

Well presentation is all unto the eyes of the beholder...theres alot more polishing that can be done on a VN-VR lump...i have drivan a VN (auntys) and a VR (test drivewith a frind) and found the suprsingly similar in take off...they both spun the wheels really easy...the first time i done it in my auntys car made me sit up right...i didnt expect it and it was with very little to provoke it either! i found the vr just as easy to get the same reaction out of.....so wether they detuned it or not is another thing....
Prehaps the Harshness is from the engine that coverd a million miles as cop cars do? just to add another angle....

[fpv_gtho]

well me personally, a car that spun the wheels too easily wouldnt be something i'd go after. sure i'd like a car that i knew could spin the wheels when i planted it, but i'd want grip for the take off, i wouldnt want to waste the power when i could be trying to snap the passengers neck :p

well i think it may have been a detectives car or at least an unmarked car. the car is white and all with the lowered suspension, but its also got a rear spoiler, but i suppose typical of all cop cars, there was a bit of tape over the interior light switches on the doors when it was bought

[Falcon500]

Well the AUdone it easly too...its all a balencing act :) i can spin the tyres in my gutless sunny if i really want too its not like its hard or anything :rolleyes: ....
Either way it would of cloked a few million miles...i wouldent touch an ex govo car EPECIALLY cop cars and taxis with anything but a cricket bat...and then it would be repeted many times over to stop some poor sould frombuying it....

[fpv_gtho]

well im surprised any new fords like the AU, EL and BA would do it because first gear is geared to top 80km/h. whether thats to keep economy down or to stop people hooning around. well a couple of million kays would be a but of an exageration, theres been EF taxi's that only have half a millioni kays on the odometer and still run fine, but either way i'll have to ask about it

[Falcon500]

well im surprised any new fords like the AU, EL and BA would do it because first gear is geared to top 80km/h. whether thats to keep economy down or to stop people hooning around. well a couple of million kays would be a but of an exageration, theres been EF taxi's that only have half a millioni kays on the odometer and still run fine, but either way i'll have to ask about it
a couple is but 1 million is not unheard of...as for the gearing...thats not what i got into trouble for at the bmw dealership...granted the tyres where sopping wet...i went and done it again ont he drive back from the depot :) and they where dry as i am :p...
Still run fine...but for how long? as i said i wouldent trust them...cop cars=HARD miles even if only a few and taxis...possiblity the odomiter has clicked over at least once....

[fpv_gtho]

a million, even half a million kays is still alot of work though. my dads 1990 cressida which has been driven quite regularly has just clicked over 250K i think and thats for nearly 15 years of driving. i wouldnt expect a VS ex cop car to be too much more than that. the falcon bottom ends though have been known to push more than a million kays pretty easily so i wouldnt worry about their reliability

[SlickHolden]

Yes they did detune the V6 ecotec on take off to the point it's almost flat, Now drive it with a/c on full and guess what happens you got a slug arse 3 tonne feeling car till the revs get up