View Full Version : Americas new muscle addiction
TVR IS KING
11-25-2005, 02:40 AM
I thought this deserved a thread.
America seems to be having a lot of muscle revivals, most of them I hate.
theres the...
dodge challenger
dodge charger
ford mustang (more of just a new retro model. the mustang never died)
ford shelby cobra concepts
theres more im positive, but thats just to name a few.
i dont like them. the new challenger i like...because its just like the old one, but strangly modern...
but my point is i really dont like retro cars, theyre ugly
what about you all?
Wouter Melissen
11-25-2005, 02:49 AM
Somebody should glue your enter button stuck.
Spastik_Roach
11-25-2005, 03:52 AM
Adminaowned.
TVR IS KING
11-25-2005, 04:19 AM
ok, thats unfair. i only pressed the enter button in that post when it was necessary, ill admit not absolutely necessary, but it wasn;t like that early post of mine when you commented on the same thing. that was enter after every couple of words. that was fair, but in my eyes this was not.
the main reason i pressed enter then was to make a list.
are you going to pick on me for the times i pressed enter in this post as well? twice? if i ever go back to how i was originally, shoot me or tell me so i can do it myself...but that was unfair.
Wouter Melissen
11-25-2005, 04:48 AM
ok, thats unfair. i only pressed the enter button in that post when it was necessary, ill admit not absolutely necessary, but it wasn;t like that early post of mine when you commented on the same thing. that was enter after every couple of words. that was fair, but in my eyes this was not.
the main reason i pressed enter then was to make a list.
are you going to pick on me for the times i pressed enter in this post as well? twice? if i ever go back to how i was originally, shoot me or tell me so i can do it myself...but that was unfair.
You need to work on punctuation and capitals. A sentence does not end with an enter. A paragraph ends with an enter. Your posts are hard to read. I'm not trying to bash you; it was some simple advise that make your posts easier to read. Yes both enters in the above post were also uncalled for. So to recap my advise; cut back on the enter, and instead use the shift more often!
TVR IS KING
11-25-2005, 04:53 AM
Sigh..I'll try...It's kinda my style of typing things, and it might take me a while to change, because I'm rather happy with it. But ok, I'll try..
Wouter Melissen
11-25-2005, 05:08 AM
Sigh..I'll try...It's kinda my style of typing things, and it might take me a while to change, because I'm rather happy with it. But ok, I'll try..
If my style was to yell at everybody, it would not lead to many conversations. Your style makes people want to skip your posts, so it's not very useful. Writing like you talk is never going to look good.
spi-ti-tout
11-25-2005, 07:29 AM
Wouter forgot to mention the part about making the post lively and entertaining. Here, take this for an example (and work on it!): -
"I think this deserves a thread -
America seems to be having a lot of Muscle car revivals, most of which I hate. There's the Challenger and Charger from Dodge, and then the Ford Mustang, not forgetting the Shelby Cobra concept.
I'm sure there's more, but those are a few for now. Don't really like 'em; except maybe the Challenger - looks just like the old one, but with modern touches.
Point is, I'm not too sure I like all the new "retro" cars coming into the market now, to me they're all ugly. So, what about you guys?"
Cheers
SupraMan22
11-25-2005, 07:43 AM
I thought this deserved a thread.
America seems to be having a lot of muscle revivals, most of them I hate.
theres the...
dodge challenger
dodge charger
ford mustang (more of just a new retro model. the mustang never died)
ford shelby cobra concepts
theres more im positive, but thats just to name a few.
i dont like them. the new challenger i like...because its just like the old one, but strangly modern...
but my point is i really dont like retro cars, theyre ugly
what about you all?
I am very much with you on this one. Except for I don't like the new Challenger very much. But that small portion is because they kept similar styling. I do like the Mustang GT and the Saleen though.
NSXType-R
11-25-2005, 08:09 AM
Isn't the new 300C distantly considered a musclecar as well? I definately know the Magnum is a musclecar. I know what you mean, it really gets annoying when all of these cars pop up all at once. Anyway the 300C, Magnum and Charger really don't have much to brag about because their platforms are all shared and it's origins really were in the Mercedes C class. Ditto that for the Crossfire as well, which had its platform in the old SLK.
Exotic Fan
11-25-2005, 09:52 AM
what made the old American muscles beautiful is its style... bring them back in the right direction like Stang would be great... Challenger seems to be alright... Shelby Cobra Concept looked great and I wish they'd make it.... the only mistake I see is the Charger... though it's still beautiful specially the SRT-8 but the car was a Coupe and bringing the name back as a sedan is just wrong... Look at the GTO, the 69 model was off the hock, but the current one is just stupid and all I see is a Coupe version of the sedan Lumina...
TVR IS KING
11-25-2005, 05:11 PM
Thank you for all correcting my grammer and stlye! It's good to finally get some response to the thread though.
The 300C is a muscle car, the Magnum too, because you can get them both with HEMI's! It seems that Chrysler\Dodge seem they can make a lot of money by reviving ALL the old muscle car names, and putting a HEMI in them. How do they expect to sell a bunch of very similar coupe's with HEMI's? The Shelby Cobra would've been good...put a HEMI in that!
EDIT: How's this post? I really tried, should i keep it this way?
johnnynumfiv
11-25-2005, 05:29 PM
I don't think that the engine determines if it's a muscle car or not. The magnum is a station wagon, how can that be considered a muscle car? At least these new "muscle cars" look a little different from the normal everyday sedan.
PerfAdv
11-25-2005, 05:35 PM
The born-again-Muscle-car revival is in full swing but I don't think that its a bad thing. Think about it, the Americans produce Minivans, Trucks, SUVs, but very few cars. The cars are mainly produced by the Japanese and Europeans. The Japanese dominate the bread and butter sedans, for the most part and the Euros make the higher end sedans. Even the serious sports cars are from the Alps and Mt. Fuji. :)
So the Americans turn to a strength, Muscle cars. It was a glorious genre, so why not bring it back? I think that technology should be modernized. These revivals shouldn't just be targeting the nostalgic Americans, who'd want to pretend they are back in the sixties. These cars should instead pull in a new generation, using the irresistible seduction of power.
So the revival isn't all together bad but as it stands, I see these time-machines as relics parading around pretending to be viable alternatives, which to me they are not.
TVR IS KING
11-25-2005, 05:45 PM
The Magnum is a muscle car, because it's a muscle car. It was desinged as one, and given a HEMI and bold front end and wagon shape so it would be caleld a muscle wagon. I had a small obsession with them a while ago...many many pics I have.
johnnynumfiv
11-25-2005, 05:53 PM
The Magnum is a muscle car, because it's a muscle car. It was desinged as one, and given a HEMI and bold front end and wagon shape so it would be caleld a muscle wagon. I had a small obsession with them a while ago...many many pics I have.
Maybe a new age muscle car, definetly not comparable to the true muscle cars. I don't remember any car back in the 60's being famous for the wagon version of it have a big engine under the hood.
taz_rocks_miami
11-25-2005, 06:51 PM
Maybe a new age muscle car, definetly not comparable to the true muscle cars. I don't remember any car back in the 60's being famous for the wagon version of it have a big engine under the hood.
Here is a muscle wagon from the past:
http://www.hubcapcafe.com/i/2001/all_gm/chev5601.JPG
One thing that disqualifies the Dodge Challenger, Charger and Magnum as muscle cars is the fact that they have 4 doors. The original Challenger, Charger and all the rest of the muscle cars were coupes, not sedans.
johnnynumfiv
11-25-2005, 07:03 PM
Weren't there 4 door models tho? And isn't the new challenger a 2 door?
PS, Isn't that a 283 in that nomad and isn't it a '55?
TVR IS KING
11-25-2005, 07:10 PM
Nah the Magnum isn't a new age retora muscle car in my eyes...not a remake of an old one, its just great.
johnnynumfiv
11-25-2005, 07:13 PM
Yea, it's not a remake, but it's definetly not like old school muscle, more of a new age muscle.
taz_rocks_miami
11-25-2005, 07:22 PM
Weren't there 4 door models tho?
Think so, not sure though.
And isn't the new challenger a 2 door?
Yeah, my bad.
PS, Isn't that a 283 in that nomad
Yeah, but even though it wasn't a big block, it had one of the biggest performance engines of it's day.
and isn't it a '55?
No, it's a 56. :)
spi-ti-tout
11-26-2005, 04:38 AM
EDIT: How's this post? I really tried, should i keep it this way?
Go you :)
TVR IS KING
11-26-2005, 05:04 AM
Lol You're my hero. Reading your signature...wheres slick been recently?
spi-ti-tout
11-26-2005, 09:59 AM
Spamming the Aussie forums :p
pAinTrAin
11-26-2005, 10:33 AM
what made the old American muscles beautiful is its style... bring them back in the right direction like Stang would be great... Challenger seems to be alright... Shelby Cobra Concept looked great and I wish they'd make it.... the only mistake I see is the Charger... though it's still beautiful specially the SRT-8 but the car was a Coupe and bringing the name back as a sedan is just wrong... Look at the GTO, the 69 model was off the hock, but the current one is just stupid and all I see is a Coupe version of the sedan Lumina...
In 07' the GTO is getting a face lift, The camaro is coming back and the Monte Carlo SS and Impala are going to the LS2 RWD platform.
Dan Flynn
11-26-2005, 12:19 PM
I'm conerned that U.S. manufacturers are falling for "retro" technology at just the wrong time. They got shafted in the mid-'70s building big fuel hogs when the oil embargo and a recession hit, and it could happen again if gas stays expensive. What's worse, American builders will be seen as out of touch making overpowered muscle sleds for a shrinking niche audience. And their market share will continue to decline. True, V-8s are great, but other more contemporary engines can't be ignored without peril.
TVR IS KING
11-27-2005, 12:17 AM
Thats another revival of the muscle names, the Pontiac GTO (Holden Monaro here)
just like the daytona truck
my lamborghini could take anything you have
unixrevolution
12-02-2005, 08:58 AM
The number of doors do not make a musclecar. The body style does not make a musclecar. Just ask the guys who drive '70 El Camino SS 454s and '70 Olds Vista Cruisers with the 455 option, or the guy with the 390/4 speed Mercury Marauder 4-door.
What makes a musclecar is a medium-sized car with a very big engine. Rear wheel drive is a must. This is why Chevy's Monte Carlo and Impala SS models for the '06 model year arent' muscle cars. You can't put 303HP through the front wheels with that god-awful 65/35 weight distribution and call it a performace car. Don't get me wrong, it's a start, but you're driving the wrong wheels!
The Charger and Magnum are musclecars. Rear wheel drive, big powerful V8. So what if one's a sedan and one's a wagon? I love the Magnum. THe charger...well yes it could use 2 fewer doors. i saw some photoshopped 2-door modern chargers..they were knockouts.
The 300C follows the 300's tradition (except the 2-door part.) The 300 was always the Banker's Hot Rod. Luxurious, powerful, and bloody fast. The original 300's back in the 50's turned the fastest speeds for a production car in their day.
Challenger and Mustang aren't properly musclecars, although they fit the Genre. They're ponycars. Same with the Camaro. 4-seat, fairly small, rear drive V8s. Thats why mustang sales are so strong in the US right now...it's the ONLY car in its market segment. rear-drive V8 power for under $26K? Can't find that anywhere else.
As for that '56 Nomad, the true musclecar revoution started in 1961 and 1962, with the 409 Impala and 421 Catalina, along with the '62 406 Ford Galaxie. The first true musclecar was probably the '64 GTO, as the Impala, Galaxie and Catalina were full-sized cars, and the GTO was based on the mid-sized tempest.
unixrevolution
12-02-2005, 09:01 AM
In 07' the GTO is getting a face lift, The camaro is coming back and the Monte Carlo SS and Impala are going to the LS2 RWD platform.
I read something in Motor Trend that GM abandoned its plans for a north american Rear-drive platform because it would either be too unrefined (going with the GTO's setup) or too expensive (using Cadillac's setup.) Why GM can't learn to do a little research now and then to reach a compromise i'll never know. But anyway, as such i heard the '07 and '08 would be following the FWD platform they're on now. Where'd you hear they're going RWD? It would be great if they did....
And speaking of which, where is this info on the '07 Camaro?
werty
12-02-2005, 09:45 AM
my lamborghini could take anything you have
And over here in exibit C-23, we see a fanboyish-idiotis. This nasty little creature once believed that old musclecars had no power, and that Lamborghini's owned the road. However, the fanboyish-idiotis became extinct soon after a group of old men and their old muscle violently ripped the idiotis' internals to shreads.
(History Channel, Idiots: A history of) 2005.
SolidStradale
12-02-2005, 03:02 PM
ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
Slicks
12-02-2005, 03:03 PM
I read something in Motor Trend that GM abandoned its plans for a north american Rear-drive platform because it would either be too unrefined (going with the GTO's setup) or too expensive (using Cadillac's setup.) Why GM can't learn to do a little research now and then to reach a compromise i'll never know. But anyway, as such i heard the '07 and '08 would be following the FWD platform they're on now. Where'd you hear they're going RWD? It would be great if they did....
And speaking of which, where is this info on the '07 Camaro?
Ive been hearing the same (to an extent).
GM announced that in '06 sometime you will see a concept Camaro built off a stretched Zeta platform (Solstice/Sky).
And the Impala is supposed to be RWD (powered by the LS4, NOT LS2) by 2008.
pAinTrAin
12-02-2005, 07:47 PM
And over here in exibit C-23, we see a fanboyish-idiotis. This nasty little creature once believed that old musclecars had no power, and that Lamborghini's owned the road. However, the fanboyish-idiotis became extinct soon after a group of old men and their old muscle violently ripped the idiotis' internals to shreads.
(History Channel, Idiots: A history of) 2005.
I love that:D
I read something in Motor Trend that GM abandoned its plans for a north american Rear-drive platform because it would either be too unrefined (going with the GTO's setup) or too expensive (using Cadillac's setup.) Why GM can't learn to do a little research now and then to reach a compromise i'll never know. But anyway, as such i heard the '07 and '08 would be following the FWD platform they're on now. Where'd you hear they're going RWD? It would be great if they did....
And speaking of which, where is this info on the '07 Camaro?
Well GM has been doing very poorly financially recently and although it would be a shame to see a major US RWD platform die I wouldnt be surprised.