Aussie BMW M car scandal unvieled!

[Falcon500]

Sorry for the dramatic name i just really wanted attention :p (j/K) but the other day i bought and old issue of wheels magazine (August 1993) and it has an interesting article about BMW australia idea for acar

M-CAR LOOKS without M-car prices-or preformance-is BMW Australia's plan for a proposed rangeof sporty 3 and 5 series models.
Topping the mock M-cars is an exclusive-to-Australia 540iS featuring manual transmission and M5 body kit, interior, wheels and possibly suspension. BMW Australia is also finialising specifications of an M-kitted 318iS and an M3-style 325iS, both due later this year.
The 540iS is awaiting approval from Munich, which is also considering BMW Australia request to allow its S range to wear the exclusive M badge. Non-Motorsport models masquerading as M-cars is a sensative issue at BMW HQ, which has just reorganised BMW Motorsport and renamed it M GmbH.
"it's a real problem for BMW to badge a car M when it's not," says former BMW australia managing director Ron Meathchem.
Meathchem, 62, hatched the local M-car plan in the months leading up tohis depature. Long term, he plans to turn BMW Australia's race base-training centre at Norwell on the Goald Coast into M's Asia-Pacific branch.
"We want to cater for people who cant afford an M3or M5, but want something that looks like them at an affordable price," he says. "So, initally, mainly cosmetics, and then maybey as we get older and better, we can do engines."
Meathchem believes a cut-price, M-look 540iS would go close to matching the performance of the M5 now only available here only to special order. "It would be a model specific toAustralia, built for usby Motorsport. I think it'd br a fabulous car, nearly as quick as the M5. We're thinking of $140,000 versus $195,000."
If it goes ahead, the 540iS will be available next year, coinciding with the 5-speed manual 540i.
An interesting explination to som,ething i have been wondering myself and no doubt FPV with what up with his old mans car.

[fpv_gtho]

this is actually the first ive heard of such a thing, but ive always been under the impression that in the way of bodykits, suspension and brakes etc for those wanting more out of their BMW but dont want to pay for an M model can get M sport upgrades......

[Falcon500]

Well its the first i have heard of it too but it all makes snese all consdiering how bland there were top drive still. Also the point ios its good pose value my car looks more expensive then it really is and not many people really need the extra mods.
Them old mags really unearth some interesting facts like how their treating the then new VR as the best commo holden ever made and its getting praise much like the BA falcon did in 03. And the proposed VT sucked! It looked like a ford scropio or something (a bland family sedan from pommyland) and holden wanted to use the old auroa engine rather then the proposed genIII as it was old technology....

[fpv_gtho]

well didnt the Gen3 come like 2 years late or something? ive heard Holden wanted it for the VT in 1997 but they finally got it 1999....

if you can you should check out some wheels mags from 1978 and see how close they got to the XD with the drawings, its freakish lol. also ive seen some pictures of what they thought the EF was going to look like and they were pretty far off, same with one pic of what they thought the BA (at the time they were callign it the AV) was going to look like in a special they done, september 2001

[Falcon500]

well didnt the Gen3 come like 2 years late or something? ive heard Holden wanted it for the VT in 1997 but they finally got it 1999....

if you can you should check out some wheels mags from 1978 and see how close they got to the XD with the drawings, its freakish lol. also ive seen some pictures of what they thought the EF was going to look like and they were pretty far off, same with one pic of what they thought the BA (at the time they were callign it the AV) was going to look like in a special they done, september 2001
I dont know the full sotry its from over then fence and i dont go looking for that info specifcly (but i will look on in intrest if layedin front ofme) butit came out in the VT statesmandearlier then anything else and was later joined by the rest of the range when the stock pile driedup. I got the entier publication on the EA26 project and the concepts were no where near as good looking as the finished product. And spy photosof the EL and stuff are ineresting not to mention the soon to be restlyedmustang and other such...more interesting read then the new ones if you ask me...they didnt winge as much and offerd moreinfo.

[fpv_gtho]

im pissed off with wheels at the moment, theyre screwing me around. every day since wednesday ive been walking to the local shops in 40 degree heat to see if the newsagency has the new wheels magazine and they havent got it!!!! none of them!!!!! because of this im thinking its a supply problem or theyve purposely held the issue back. someones suggested that theyre holding out for a story on something, but the only thing at the moment i could think of was they had a late inclusion for something about the typhoon, in which case it would be easier to do a full coverage of it from MMS for next months mag

[Falcon500]

I save my money and just read what i find interesting at the newsagency i only buy AMC, performance ford and street machine.

[fpv_gtho]

ive never really been big on those 3 to be honest. street machine to me is severly holden biased (the proofs in their street commodores specials), performance ford focus too much on tuned fords for my liking and well australian muscle car, theyve never really had an issue thats made me pick it up wanting to read it cover to cover

wheels provides a pretty good global aspect on most things so theyre alright if you can get around all their whinging about the smallest of things. i'd probably rather motor but they can really have a negative attitude towards some thigns

[Falcon500]

Wheelshave proven to make some of the stupidest decision as well picking such car of the years as the VN commaodore, A camira (which was a flop world wide),leyland p76 and other such lemons and they cant admit when there wrong too. Motor when they dont take a shine to something theymake it clear and sually change there minds makeing them look like arse's also they can display some very dodgy jornalisum (eg chageing mind mid sentence and not comming to any solid conclusions) at least with mags likeperformance ford and AMC there notcomparing cars and justraging on a car because they can...i have no comments to be made on street machine though....they claim not to be biased but i just exclaimed bull shit when i read that.

[fpv_gtho]

how can a magazine that goes off and has another magazine called "street machine: street commodores" say that theyre not biased, its pretty stupid...

for now though i'll keep reading wheels until they really piss me off about something, they may do it with the next mag with the 5 way local test by giving the avalon 1st place

[Falcon500]

how can a magazine that goes off and has another magazine called "street machine: street commodores" say that theyre not biased, its pretty stupid...

for now though i'll keep reading wheels until they really piss me off about something, they may do it with the next mag with the 5 way local test by giving the avalon 1st place Well dont forget theyhave had a ford special edeition recently...and hell when the mag was at its peak it had several annauls likeengine mods (when the tech was still decent) and brand specific annaul they even had one for mopar!
I used to read wheels all the time...the reason a very unpopular kid done me a favor and stole them from the libery for me....i have only bought 1 since i finished school.

[fpv_gtho]

well the street commodores comes out liek monthly or something as well as a yearly special so its an ongoing commitment of street machines. wheels say the results of this 5 way local test will leave you shocked. im thinking every test the BA's been in its come out the better overall car and even the VY2 hasnt changed that so i think its gunna win. maybe they mean the VY2 wont come 2nd or something, who knows, i'll find out tomorrow

[Falcon500]

Well their still whatpulls in the croud at one stage i got a double issue of a performance commadores NOT tech what so ever! in the first one and in the second one they talked about carbon fibre rocker covers! and the cars were hardly any diffrent from each other they noly thing they all ahd diffrent was that they all had diffrent exteior interior colours, diffrent sound systems and diffrent people building the engines....very sad magazines.
Wheels do what ever they can to make a quick buck thats more then likly the reason they dubbed the BA car of the year because itll stir people up!

[fpv_gtho]

well i think the BA honestly deserved it. it beat the honda jazz and mazda 6 which have been recieving endless applause for their design and ergonomics etc. and the BA could be considered a new model based on the AU's floorplan and front suspension, the rear end was completely hacked away at and redone for the control blade IRS to fit in perfectly

[Falcon500]

Well true enough but they are also in the buiness of selling mags and while most mags worth their salt would of coverd up the fact they crashed a lambo wheelsused the shock value to sell they now are more intrested in market share then cars themselves.

[fpv_gtho]

well next month wheels are changing their layout, so hopefully with that they'll give a rethink to some of their attitudes that will benefit the public

[Falcon500]

well next month wheels are changing their layout, so hopefully with that they'll give a rethink to some of their attitudes that will benefit the public
i doubt that for some odd reason..most thing nowdays are run by the might green back.

[fpv_gtho]

well luckily their opinions havent clouded us from the sheer facts yet, people are still writing in commending them for what theyre providing us with. maybe its just the local's that theyre whinging too much about after driving all the new mid size cars to make the category explode with action (new liberty, accord euro{not the other one}, mazda 6, in ways the new vectra etc). just as long as they keep providing the performance figures and describe how the car drives before complaining, i'll keep happy for some time yet

[Falcon500]

Well the biggest problem about their wingeing is most of the time its niggling and most of them niggles are pointed at a car because it isnt jap crap or euro trash! i never saw them niggle the aston martin like they have other cars...the aston martin DB7 GT has rear seats as useless as a crewmans, the seat adjustments cannot be acsessed without the door open and lets not forget some cheap looking switch and gauges for such an expensive car and the poor visability out of the especially the back and again with the door you clash your hand against it while makeing a lunge for the handbreak..and last but notleast the bonnet catch is over the other side....now this is just an example of what they leave out on such a car while family cars which are more likly to be sold get ripped to shreads.

[fpv_gtho]

well theres always a question of bias with the journo's, so they may be picking apart all the local cars in a hope the manufacturers are listening and trying to get tips for improving the cars

[Falcon500]

Wellthats all well and true and i think in most cases that works....but they pass off anything that is european or an exotic or a sports gt etc etc as damn nearperfect if there was that form of consistancey in their niggles like they used to have (in the 60s they ripped everything for more realistic problems too) then my complaints would gently coast to a stop....Those niggles i got came from a classic car magazine and quite frankly i though his opions where great...while he prefers things i prefer eg road feel as he said that aston while not my cup of tea was a fantastic car and only those little niggles stopped it from being perfect....still ive seen peoplein these forums who said they would want a aston martin like i was talking about yet ripped the mustang and camaro forits lack of room in the back whichi view quite comical when the astons rear seat is basicly a leather wrapped parcelshelf! this is where selective niggling can give people false ideas and make people think that our products are shit. Thats my point and more then likly my strongest point on this subject.

[fpv_gtho]

there definately is a lack of consistency in all the whinging. crisis brought up ages ago with motor's PCOTY that all they were doing was whinging about the smallest of things with the XR6 Turbo and just months before after the cars release they were praising it for its dynamics, quality, technology etc. Wheels though are waking up to the idea that the europeans dont make the best cars anymore. MB say ever since inventing the car theyve continually been imporiving it, Ford say that whilst MB were the first to make the car, we revolutionised it whilst Toyota must be thinking we're making better cars than the both of you and its only because our economy got 200 million after we got hit from 2 nuclear bombs

[Falcon500]

[QUOTE=fpv_gtho] Wheels though are waking up to the idea that the europeans dont make the best cars anymore. MB say ever since inventing the car theyve continually been imporiving it,
Well mercades Benz are full of it it was oldsmobile that made the first car! first built and produced they even had that plasterd across the old website (probly still do if they still have the page) As for the build quality issues whats to say the euros so called higher quality is better....ive seen BMWs that break down like a manic depressant where i know people who own a lada nivia and its never missed a beat! this so called refinement and quality is all wank! just an excuse for a excluse price on a more exclusive car! as i said i found nearlyall the BMWs i drove incredibly dull...i found the hyundai Excell we had there even more fun (hell it was responsive and faster then any beemer 4 id ever driven there..its even ate the dull 6s) and while magazines are harping on they neglect to talk about the usually worse fuel ecconmy of such cars as well....
I am not opposed to euro cars there good and all they have their place and its not on a pedistal likemost mags have been putting them on. Things need to be perspective i think...
Well that said withour ford cars would more then likly be so so quality and excedingly expensive for the rich and very welloff only.
Without mb and other such brand snobs would be more freindly when in comes to cars. (I really despised being looked down upon by byers because i washed the Beemers like i was a peasent or something)
And with out toyota and other such brands ecconmy carsprobly wouldent be quite so ecconmical.

[fpv_gtho]

well with the new bangled beemers, Wheels have been quick to point out the fall in quality and Robbo said it best for COTY by saying the 5 Series had $13,990 driveaway plastics.

The Japanese although being famous for economy cars are quickly building the reputation for the worlds best quality and have well and truly knocked Germany off the top spot. It was evident though in the Euro tour of the XR6T: the Italians and French though the suspension was too soft, the Germans thought it was good for an Australian car, but i reckon they still woudve snubbed it behind Robbo's back and realistically the Poms were the only ones to really take to it. When they then took one to the US everyone stared, pointed, gasped etc at something wearing a Ford badge and was actually a quality product. In Europe Robbo noted that only 1 person actually stared at it

[Falcon500]

Personally i view it no less quality just cheezy looking...also most people dont seem to think of the performance advantages to bangals slipprier designs....oh well i never bother mentioning it because of the wineing pursits here "BAGALL RUIENED BMWS DESIGNS" (which where dated in the late 80s and are selling just as good as the new ones another detail they missed) we need a crying face here too.
Well ecconmy doesnt neciserly mean shit...no frills maybey but if its jap and ecconmy expect it though decent price and yeah ecconmy. (if we were a larger country the parts price might be more ecconmoical too....) Itais wouldent of liked it beacause they couldent feeltheir cobble stone paths through the deack chairs they call seat in most of there cars :D but yeah itais are miore used to little cars with stiff suspension why i do not know just one of them things. French PFFFFFFT. Germans i think their cars are poor for the pediatal most people put them on that being said i think they would of had a medicore response tothe car sort of a not bad but i wouldent want it (Beauty is onto the eyes of the beholder styling wont be their cue on this car) and they no doubt would of made unfair comparisons to their own cars too.
the poms they really do love big cars problem big cars big $$$ to them if the tazxes lightened up we could have a field day selling our cars to them (IMO)
They yanks i think thats an exaguration and the quality product thing would of been "We Dun alway thooough arzzies made crap atoomoobilllles" i got that feeling when i read about their views on the monaro in popular hot rodding a big queastion about warrenty that actually made me quite mad and i said some very nasty things to the magazine something like ******* YANKS WE USE YOUR ***** MOTORS WHICH BREAK DOWN LIKE A MOODY ******* WOMAN AND WE HAVE MORE STRINGENT RULES ON ******* EVERYTHING AND STATISICLY OUR CARS BREAK DOWN LESS AND YOUR ****** QEUATIONG OUR QUALITY!?!? (and yes i have been suggested to anger managment classes....im not going though to young for 1 on 1 over 20 and dont want to doa public one....)

[fpv_gtho]

well chris bangle is highly rumoured to be leaving BMW after the 1, 3 and 4 series go on sale so obviously some people inside BMW have had enough but i dont know of any manufacturer who would want to risk bangle heading their design department after what hes turned BMW into

[Egg Nog]

This thread is somewhat eerie... all it is so far is fpv_gtho and Falcon500 going back and forth! This post signifies the third member to post in this thread, and its already chock full of text! ;)

Anyway fpv, a buddy and I tried to con our way into test-driving an M3 last week at a dealership in downtown Vancouver. No luck, of course, but at least we got to talk to a reprasentative. When we were talking about the new 5-series (which he thought was hideous, by the way) he mentioned that BMW will be getting rid of Bangle as soon as his contract is up. I think he said 2005... I hope he doesn't get to the M3 by then...

[fpv_gtho]

well im not quite sure when the new 3 series is coming, i'm guessing later this year but it will be some time after that id say that the new m3 will come. we almost had a similar situation here with holden like whats going on with BMW and Bangle, when holden released the VY commodore at the end of 2002, everyone was pointing the finger at mike simcoe at its controversial looks. but mike simcoe was the same person to design the monaro so i guess we had alot more sympathy and faith in his designs

[Falcon500]

Well While at the dealership i never got to drive the (we only had one) M3 though i did get a lift to the deatailing shed across the road (i was the used detailer) and on a slight spin me and one of the salesman took i got a quick spin of aZ4....my hands where shakeing that car was worth roughly 4 and a half years of my wages and it was a more bland model too.
I detailed a few 5 series only a few new ones and while i was not overly impressed with it i still dont see why all the wingeing is going on!
And i though the euro car fans didnt come in here :D this thread really only intrest people who have/had something to do with BMWs I was an ex detailer for rolfes and fpvs oldman owns one of the cars in queastion...i posted this thread because it answers the queastion we couldent answer "Whats upwith the aussie M car?" also that being said we do get genuine M cars M3s are a perminet model on the lists though somewhat overly expensive and M5s are specailorder only.

[fpv_gtho]

we may get the M3 as a permanent model, but we still get jipped, my dads model is an australian 96 model but its the equivalent of a euro 94 model cause until 96 we still got the 3.0L motor when everyone else got the 3.2L

[Falcon500]

Yeah well australias not a big market and BMW as a bi product dont reallycare sad but true they do things like that to make our small market as profitable for them as possible.... isnt it funny how they jip us like that and still charge an arm and a leg...good cars could be slightly better if they were up with the times.

[fpv_gtho]

the problem is we dont get thought of as a land mass, rather just for our population. our land space rivals that of the US yet we've got 1/10th the populatino of Indonesia.....

luckily though we've got a few M3 CSL's, 911 GT3 RS's, 360 CS's and some other exclusive cars headed our way and MG Rover have announced they will start importing the Noble Supercar and the Pagani Zonda C12S

[Falcon500]

Yeah but where twice as productive as indonesia and our country has a stronger ecconmy and more money. It can safely be said in most cases in australia we at least have one.

[fpv_gtho]

well each country has its head in different industries, i'd say rice exports are pretty serious stuff in indonesia and we just happen to have out heads stuck in the car industry......but i guess its cars where talking about here so it doesnt matter who can grow and export X amount of rice for Y price with Z profit