What a crock of ****!

[Blue Supra]

went and spoke with the NRMA yesterday about the fella i rolled.

my educated guesstimate appears to have been waaaaaaaaay off. Basically they reckon over 12k to repair the thing... my thoughts...

a) the things worth half that to buy, redbook.com.au values it roughly 6-7k
b) theres not THAT much damage anyway, panel and side mirror...
c) why wasnt i allowed to see the damage report?
d) why dont i get a say in where its repaired?
e) thank God Just Cars backdated my insurance coverage. :cool:

so how can an insurance company claim double what a cars worth? shouldnt it be a write off, i dont reckin it is anyway... that thing drove away with panel damage and a missising mirror... how is that 12k of damage...?!??!?

[pimento]

For one thing, repairers charge more when it's an insurance job. You don't get to see the damage report because then you'd know that you're getting rorted, and.. well, there may have been suspension/drivetrain damage.

[drakkie]

SUE THEM :D You might get millions if yu fake a trauma after the report :p

[fpv_gtho]

I think NRMA are dodgy full stop...

Mum had an insurance claim with them after someone ran into her a few years ago, and they done possibly the worst respray job possible.

Sounds like it could be an uphill battle ahead of you though

[adrenaline]

That sucks. LOL 12k damage on a 6k vehicle...thats bullshit

[matek]

:eek:

WOW slash theyre tires ahh nah thats bad :p

[SlickHolden]

$12,000:eek: Bluey roll me i might get $10,000.

That's so wrong it's a right off if it will cost more then the car, They will give him the money to the cars value, And you should be allowed to see all reports of the repairers to, Contact them and demand it it's a crock.

[nota]

a) the things worth half that to buy, redbook.com.au values it roughly 6-7k
b) theres not THAT much damage anyway, panel and side mirror...
Blue I am sorry to hear this ..

I worried that a rollover wouldn't prove to be cheap, even though Cruisers have a bolt-together cab, not welded

c) why wasnt i allowed to see the damage report?
d) why dont i get a say in where its repaired?
Perhaps it's a good time to consult ACT govt Legal Aid or Citizens Advice Bureau, or a lawyer, to establish your position? In past years they proved helpful to me

e) thank God Just Cars backdated my insurance coverage. :cool:
If you managed to jag retrospective insurance (?) I hope you considered any 'Reasonable Disclosure' clauses & obligations before signing

[PerfAdv]

It is easy to have more damage ($wise) than a car is worth. It should be your choice whether to repair or take car's dollar value. If the car is badly damaged and repairing will cause it to have a reconditioned title, definitely better to take the cash and walk. But if the car isn't payed off and the bank wants you to repair it, then you don't really have a choice. :(

Sorry to hear, is this your 200 SX we're talking about??

[Blue Supra]

nah the cruiser i hit.

my insurance came through as it expired like a week before the accident and i was away on holiday when it expired, smashed the car the day after i came home and didnt renew as i didnt think that much damage was done to the other car. explained that to them and they were happy to reinsure me, thank goodness.

[SlickHolden]

**** thats all good then mate, Maybe the insurance will get smart and say we wont repair the car just hand him the cars market value worth.
I had my mum and 2 niece's in the car tonight taking my mums friend home. We got 2 lanes I'm in the left the car in the right lane was over in my lane so i wouldn't go up past. But i sat on the left with my right light in the passengers window you couldn't miss me. So the drive finally as we come to the corner with still the same 2 lanes finally moves into the right lane finally, As i get to the corner we slowed down to about 15kp/h the dip pulled straight over into my lane i was 70% of the way up the inside, Hit the brake and horn that worked, I could have had my right side fixed with ease then but the old foot stops me every-time:D, I pulled down the windows and told the driver to pay more attention to the road and use your ****en head check and mirrors for god sake, The passenger gave me the finger:eek: I think thats how road rage starts. But stuff it i hit go button and pissed off.

[fpv_gtho]

Its times like that you want a bullbar....

[Blue Supra]

no you dont, i wouldve died from a bullbar to the head if id pulled out a second earlier...

[fpv_gtho]

I meant in Slick's case. Its highly dangerous, but if the sheer site doesnt intimidate, but give them a lil tap.

[thatdbeme]

when someone hit me last year they gave the agreed value i had with my insurance company, which was a few grand more than the market value, my current car is insured for about 8 grand more than the amount i paid for it

[SlickHolden]

Its times like that you want a bullbar....
I know but it would look so ugly:D I can use my face that will scare them more:p

[fpv_gtho]

Its too bad the police, and society, look down on suburban uses for bullbars though :p well not really, theres too many idiots out there to justify it all of course

[nota]

A couple of years ago I came very close to being cleaned up by a bullbar equipped .. TAXI .. that's right, and in the centre of Canberra's CBD on a pedestrian mall, while leaving the flicks

No I'm not a fan of suburban bullbars :mad:

[IBrake4Rainbows]

Bullbars are ridiculous for all vehicles except those who regularly travel in the country. plain and simple.

if you need a metal appendage to make up for your lack of driving skizzils, you shouldn't be on the road.

[fpv_gtho]

Well i certainly cant argue with either of those 2 comments, especially in Nota's case

[Sauc3]

Bullbars are ridiculous for all vehicles except those who regularly travel in the country. plain and simple.

if you need a metal appendage to make up for your lack of driving skizzils, you shouldn't be on the road.
We've got one on our Land Rover only for the reason to minimalize the damage if a 'roo or something similar jumps out at us on our frequent treks between Byron Bay and Melbourne. If we weren't on these trips we'd never have considered a bullbar, but it seems justifiable enough for long cross country trips.

What I personally find the worst is the small Ford and Holden utes with every single type of add-on possible, including a bullbar that looks out of place on anything with less than 18 wheels. Looks absolutely shite.

[Blue Supra]

i feel justified in saying surburban 4WDing should be banned. how many kids are killed/hit by 4WDs every year because of their height/bullbars etc? check the stats, its quite bad actually.

[Matra et Alpine]

Ther was a big negative publicity in teh UK a few years back about bull bars.

YES .. in Britain some folks were driving around with huge bullbars on ...... well not many 'roos around here !!

Makes sense in Aussie land -- and maybe JUST in the highlands of Scotland ( we get lots of deer -- but due for another huge cull so it'll get better :) )

[IBrake4Rainbows]

I've got to step in here - I drive a 4WD (no Bullbar) and I think blanket banning 4WD's is a dumb idea. (NO hint of bias whatsoever :p)

Do I think extra training is required for their users? Yes.

Stat's can be stretched to suit needs - more people are hit by Cars than 4WD's because there are more of them, but of course car's aren't getting banned.

There big, visible targets for Road-Safety Zealots looking to control what we drive, where and how, because we can't think for ourselves.

Do I think Bullbars are dangerous? Yes. There only justifiable use is to protect Country vehicles on country roads. I personally think detachable ones would be a better solution, but I'm sure there are huge engineering challenges to make it happen.

[fpv_gtho]

Maybe someone needs to put some development into plastic-metal imitation bullbars. Ford figured out over 10 years ago how to get the airbags to still go off with their bullbar on the Falcon

[Volvoman]

i feel justified in saying surburban 4WDing should be banned. how many kids are killed/hit by 4WDs every year because of their height/bullbars etc? check the stats, its quite bad actually.

It's all well and good saying this but where do you stop? You say ban all 4WD's and I'm sure you mean Landcruiser/Patrol/Pajero and the large 4WD. But when it comes down to it, if the government wants to ban ALL
4WD's, then they wil ban ALL OF THEM! This include RAV4/CRV/Vitara. Basically this is as ludicrous as the NSW P-Plate driver law. Banning all 4WD, does this include AWD?
Are we banning these vehicles because they are big and hard to see out of, or hard to see past for other cars? If this is the case, what about commercial vans and MPV's? What about semi's and buses? I don't think there are any other vehicles harder to see around than these. I very rarely drive a 4WD, in this case my parents Hilux. Yes it has a bullbar. Yes it probably will do more damage than the same car without a bar.

What this country needs is a better driver education system. It seems that everytime there is a child knocked down by a 4WD it makes the news. 4WD's then get the much undeserved rap they already have. What the media doesn't say is that the idiot behind the wheel wasn't looking.

There is a saying, "Guns Kill People". This can also be said of 4WD's. "4WD's Kill People". This isn't true. A 4WD vehicle, like a handgun, is a machine. A machine has to be operated by a thinking, living human before it can do anything. Therefore, a 4WD cannot kill a person of it's own free will. That saying should be "4WD' don't kill people, people kill people"

Sorry to have gone on so long like I did but this is a point that I feel VERY strongly about. People should be entitled to drive whatever vehicle they desire. BUT, due care should be taken when driving ANY vehicle, and especially any vehicle that is hard to see out of or that harnesses a lot of power.

And please, if you drive a 4WD, don't drive it like a 2 tonne sports car. They are not made to be sports cars. If you want to drive like you own a sports car, BUY A SPORTS CAR. You are NOT king of the road. Please respect every other driver as you would want them to respect you.

Right, I'm finished now.

[nota]

There is a saying, "Guns Kill People". This can also be said of 4WD's. "4WD's Kill People". This isn't true. A 4WD vehicle, like a handgun, is a machine. A machine has to be operated by a thinking, living human before it can do anything. Therefore, a 4WD cannot kill a person of it's own free will. That saying should be "4WD' don't kill people, people kill people"
I don't buy that tired NRA argument. Guns DO kill people, it is true and a fact

As for bullbars, by extension of your logic, what if some fool attached a huge set of cars-that ate-paris spikes to the front of their vehicle? But I suppose spikes don't kill people (according to the National Spike Association) so it's all ok and kosher eh?



If bullbar-equipped vehicles are indeed involved in 20% of pedestrian fatalities, then that is an apalling statistic. Roobars do have their place, but that place is not on suburban-domiciled vehicles .. including city taxis wtf :rolleyes:
http://www.walk.com.au/pedestriancouncil/Page.asp?PageID=127

[clutch-monkey]

I don't buy that tired NRA argument. Guns DO kill people, it is true and a fact
my guns haven't killed anything yet :rolleyes: but i have almost killed someone in a commodore:o

[fpv_gtho]

VN strikes again?

[clutch-monkey]

yes...and a VT once too :eek: while driving sensibly too before anyone asks :p

[Blue Supra]

guns kill people, what about kids who find them in their parents drawer? "hey lets play cowboys and indians!" :eek: many guns are banned in australia for the reason they are dangerous and not neccesary, why not the same for bull bars? personally i find pajeros and cruisers annoying when they block my vision and nearly kill me but its the bar on the front that makes them lethal not potentially harmful.

Simple, Ban bullbars to be on registered vehicles within 50km of a city. If you are coming into the city from the country, remove it.

[clutch-monkey]

^ it's why we have stoarage laws :p 328 road deaths in QLD alone last year.... 43 firearm related deaths since 1998 (and that's an increase since 1992). fact is more idiots have access to cars than guns thank god, at least they do a background check when you get a firearms license

[Volvoman]

If bullbar-equipped vehicles are indeed involved in 20% of pedestrian fatalities, then that is an apalling statistic. Roobars do have their place, but that place is not on suburban-domiciled vehicles .. including city taxis wtf :rolleyes:
http://www.walk.com.au/pedestriancouncil/Page.asp?PageID=127

I never said anything about banning bullbars. I fact I said that my parents 4WD has one and that it will probably do more damage if it hits something that if it didn't have a bulbar. What I was saying was that we cannot put a blanket ban on 4WD's because different people class different vehicles as 4WD (as rediculous as that sounds). I also don't agree with put in this ban on 4WD's. Last time I looked, we lived in a democracy where freedom of speach and freedom of choice is encouraged. So by this right people should be allowed to drive whatever vehicle they so choose. They should just be more careful when that vehicle of choice is harder to see out of.
Although I do agree with the fact that a sydney taxi would not need a bullbar.


If you are coming into the city from the country, remove it.

It isn't that simple. I don't know about the cars but I do know that with a lot of the 4WD's out there, you can't just remove the bullbar. It takes a great amount of work to get the bullbar off. Have you ever taken the front of your car apart? If so you will know that to get a headlight out, you have to remove the bumper etc. You end up having to take the whole front end off. At least that has been the case with both of the cars that I have owned. Also, the bullbar REPLACES the bumper. So if you were to take off the bullbar then you would have brackets and exposed sharp edges which could be potentially worse than getting hit with a bullbar. I know what I would prefer to get hit by.


guns kill people, what about kids who find them in their parents drawer?

In this case I have proven my point. Was it the gun that killed the kid, or the kid that pulled the trigger? You may come back to say that the kid didn't know what he was doing an yes, that may be true. But the simple fact is that the kis should NOT have gone searching through the fathers(or mothers) drawer. If the kid hadn't pulled the gun out of the drawer then it would have stayed silent in the drawer. I don't know much about firearms but I'm pretty sure you have to pull the trigger to fire a bullet. I can go further than that by saying that it could be the gun owners fault. If he (or she) didn't have a LOADED gun then the kids may still have found it but nothing would have happened. Still no fault of the gun.

[2ndclasscitizen]

I think the solution is to not allow people with residential addresses to register their car with a bull bar on it, and spot police rego checks.

[kingofthering]

GUNS DON'T Kill PEOPLE, People do. Guns don't just jump up and shoot someone.

[Volvoman]

Thank you Kingofthering. I think you are the first person to understand what I was trying to say.

You theory is a good one as well 2ndclasscitizen. That is one that could actually work. Are you a politician by any chance? Too bad if not. Although I doubt our government would go for than anyway.

If I offended anyone by saying what I said earlier, then I am truly sorry. My aim was not to offend although I know differing opinions can. I was not out to verbally bash anyone.

[Matra et Alpine]

GUNS DON'T Kill PEOPLE, People do. Guns don't just jump up and shoot someone.
Without weapons it's actually quite hard to kill someone.
Guns make it easy and able to be done from a distance and quickly with no effort.
Guns CONTRIBUTE to killing people.
Still a valid reason for banning them and removing them from circulation so NOBODY has them -- honest joes AND criminals.

[clutch-monkey]

^ hooray for the death of self responisbility...... enter the nanny state.

[Matra et Alpine]

^ hooray for the death of self responisbility...... enter the nanny state.
bend over you're getting reamed ...


ooooh, who's crying for the "nanny state" NOW :D

[clutch-monkey]

:D
i'm gonna take your fast cars off you, cos you might drive them fast away from the track :p
it's ironic that all the P-platers here whine and moan about the engine power restrictions, because suddenly it's something that they do that is effected...

[whiteballz]

Basically this is as ludicrous as the NSW P-Plate driver law. Banning all 4WD, does this include AWD?

Do you know ANYTHING about the new laws for the P plates?
banning all 4wd's? I dont know where you have been but I live in NSW and recently aquired my P1 licence, I know the rules and regulations, and banning P1 licence holders from driving a 4WD IS NOT one of them.


And please, if you drive a 4WD, don't drive it like a 2 tonne sports car. They are not made to be sports cars. If you want to drive like you own a sports car, BUY A SPORTS CAR. You are NOT king of the road. Please respect every other driver as you would want them to respect you.

People with small cars are just as likely to drive what they have like a sports car. I have friends with late 80's civics that still drive it like it is stolen, as said before, by another member, cars hit more people and children then 4WD's, its just the fact that the lovely idiots that control the flow of information to the public want to create an enemy.

I am curious as to What The Hell you think the NSW government could do to ban P1 / P2 drivers from driving 4WD's.

[whiteballz]

In this case I have proven my point. Was it the gun that killed the kid, or the kid that pulled the trigger? You may come back to say that the kid didn't know what he was doing an yes, that may be true. But the simple fact is that the kis should NOT have gone searching through the fathers(or mothers) drawer. If the kid hadn't pulled the gun out of the drawer then it would have stayed silent in the drawer. I don't know much about firearms but I'm pretty sure you have to pull the trigger to fire a bullet. I can go further than that by saying that it could be the gun owners fault. If he (or she) didn't have a LOADED gun then the kids may still have found it but nothing would have happened. Still no fault of the gun.


If there was no gun, there would be no death (in this situation).

[fpv_gtho]

Obviously theres no quick fix to ANY of this, youve really got to go back and revise the whole driver training issue, and you almost fix every damn problem with drivers and the roads these days. My brother for instance, he lives in a residential area and drives a Discovery, but he shouldnt have to be stuck removing his bull bar because of that. The fact is he DOES use the car for 4x4ing, he bought the car specifically for that. He's got a GSXR1000 for day to day. Hes also lifted the suspension to about 4" over stock, better shocks and 31" tyres on new 15" rims (stockers were 16"). Hes wasted probably a good few grand upgrading the car for 4x4ing if a regulation was to pass that would make it illegal to have a bullbar on in suburban areas, as it would become too much of a nuisance to keep changing over, and he'd end up selling the car.

Again, go back and reform the driver training. Perhaps the problem's getting people to learn in cars that are too small, not too big. Ive learnt in LandCruisers, Discovery's, HiLux's, Camry's...a fairly wide variety. The Hilux by far was the smallest, and its surprising how much your boundaries feel theyve been stretched in something that feels so small...

[Matra et Alpine]

In the UK they've finally realised that bikers are better trained and safer then car drivers and are going to review the training and availability of "performance" cars to new drivers.

'course it will likely JUST end up a p-plate scheme copied from someone else and not ACTUALLy go to the efforts of the better training and test that a biker goes through.

[nota]

GUNS DON'T Kill PEOPLE, People do. Guns don't just jump up and shoot someone.
Why am I not surprised to hear this supercilious gibberish coming via a society that has chosen to worship the gun and its resultant violence & death? Guns & gun-violence pervades throughout US language, entertainment & culture

Every year there are approximately 30,000 American people who disprove your fatous claim that guns don't kill people. That is the number of people in the US who are killed by guns annually in the US. About 12,000 are homicides, 1000 are accidents, and 17,000 are suicides.
This figure excludes the 200,000 or so non-fatal gun injuries, again in one single year

There is a clear and undeniable correlation between the percentage-number of guns within a society, and the ensuing percentage-number of its people killed (or injured) by guns. 11,504 or 71.1% of total American murders in 2002 were commited by firearms

Contrast this with the corresponding statistic for gun-restricted Australia, which was 27 people for 14% of total homicides

Btw: Per capita in 2002, a person living in the gun-lovin' USA was TWENTY EIGHT TIMES more likely to be murdered by a firearm than someone within Australia

My sources:
FBI -Crime in the USA, 2002
Australian Murders 2001/2002: Australian Institute of Criminology

[clutch-monkey]

and yet since the restrictions in Australia firearm crime has increased..including 8 deaths last year from gang warfare, police unable to explain where the gangs got semi-automatice carbines... :rolleyes:
imo america has such high firearm crime/deaths because they have lax storage laws...and they carry them in public. that's unheard of here

[kingofthering]

Without weapons it's actually quite hard to kill someone.
Guns make it easy and able to be done from a distance and quickly with no effort.
Guns CONTRIBUTE to killing people.
Still a valid reason for banning them and removing them from circulation so NOBODY has them -- honest joes AND criminals.
wellll..... you could always kill someone with martial arts, office supplies,electronics, beverages, food, basically anything except air.
This ban guns shit was what San Francisco said when they banned handguns.

[fpv_gtho]

wellll..... you could always kill someone with martial arts

So something youre given alot of training for, unlike guns


office supplies,electronics, beverages, food, basically anything except air.

Something probably large, slow moving and easy enough to dodge provided your not already beaten to a pulp, or tied down like a rat. Unlike guns

[Volvoman]

People with small cars are just as likely to drive what they have like a sports car.

I am curious as to What The Hell you think the NSW government could do to ban P1 / P2 drivers from driving 4WD's.

Yes, that is true. But I find that people with small cars s don't drive to drive over the top of everyone else if they can't get through. Most of the 4WDers out there try to run you over if you don't get out of their way, no matter what lane you're in, or whatever speed your doing or even how big your car is. I drive a large car (Volvo 240) and get terrorised by even small 4WD's.

As for the 2nd sentence there, I don't want to ban P-Platers from driving 4WD's. I never said that. It seems people like to misquote everyone else on this forum. What I said was that banning 4WD's was a ludicrous as the new P-Plate laws. I think everyone, including P-Platers, should be allowed to drive whatever vehicle they so choose, whether it be a 1L 3cyl Suzuki Cino or a 6L V8 Commodore.


If there was no gun, there would be no death (in this situation)

True, but as the story went, there was a gun and did it take itself out of the drawer? No. The simple fact is that the kid took it out of the drawer. He may not have known what it was or what he was doing, but the matter is that the gun went off because someone pulled the trigger. The gun did not fire itself.

[kingofthering]

so.... how's the repair going?

[Blue Supra]

ordered my headlights and parkers, got a bonnet and guards coming soon. new sideskirts and indicators too. nose cut is in sydney and is being shipped shortly.

waiting for my tax return to get it all put together :)

[SlickHolden]

Isn't this why we made the sticky thread? the sessions:D




wellll..... you could always kill someone with martial arts, office supplies,electronics, beverages, food, basically anything except air.
This ban guns shit was what San Francisco said when they banned handguns.
Killing someone with a gun is just easier, Once you pull the trigger there is no going back, I'll take my chances with the office supplies:p

[2ndclasscitizen]

ordered my headlights and parkers, got a bonnet and guards coming soon. new sideskirts and indicators too. nose cut is in sydney and is being shipped shortly.

waiting for my tax return to get it all put together :)
I meant to let you know about this yesterday but forgot, but no harm anyway. There's an S14 at Pickles. No obvioius damage on the front, didn't get a chance to have a closer look as I was dopping of some stuff for work for auction, but the front right wheel didn't seem to be sitting quite straight.

[Blue Supra]

dude, get on msn so we can talk please!

[2ndclasscitizen]

It's not on their webiste, and I think the auction may have been today. www.picklesauctions.com.au has their contact details, giev them or call. Also, they're in Gladstone st. in fyshwick