PDA

View Full Version : Ford Australia under the FoMoCo microscope



adrenaline
10-31-2006, 08:44 AM
Ford Australia starts to feel some heat from head office

Bill Ford visits Australia. FOR THE FIRST TIME EVER.

www.goauto.com.au
http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mellor.nsf/story2/EC584FD95A6DD8B5CA25721800020E26/$file/2006.10.31_Ford.jpg?OpenElement

I can't believe he had never been to Australia. Read on for some (scarce) details about Orion!



BILL Ford may have backed Blue Oval manufacturing Down Under, but that does not mean Ford's Australian subsidiary will get a free ride.

Ford Australia president Tom Gorman has admitted Broadmeadows' performance will be examined even more closely in the wake of the Ford Motor Company's record third-quarter loss.

"It’s been a pretty challenging last couple of quarters out of the US for us and I think it just puts more focus on us to get our jobs done," Mr Gorman said.

"Given the challenges facing us in North America what's critically important for my team and all of us in Australia is to make sure we deliver on our commitments whether it is quality, profitability, consumer satisfaction.

"All of those top-line metrics become that much more important for us because, frankly, the margin for error has been diminished significantly."

Asked at Thursday’s Sydney motor show opening whether the struggling global car-maker’s poor US sales had put more pressure on Ford Australia to increase profits, Mr Gorman said:

"Yes. There's always pressure on anybody in this business. The car business is not an easy business - it's a challenging business - and for Ford at the moment I think it has just racheted up a notch or two. (But) We have a great team here and our guys are used to delivering on our commitments, so the pressure isn't new for us."

Mr Gorman said FoMoCo's examination of Ford Australia's business proposals for new homegrown and imported models has already become more thorough as a result of the company's financial crisis.

"Our development budgets are really dependent on the business opportunities we come up with and to a certain degree our ability to run our business successfully," he said.

"So the first step for us is to continue to deliver on our commitments and I think we have as much access to go back to the corporation with new business ideas as we've ever had.

"But clearly the scrutiny and the review of those opportunities are getting a closer look."

Mr Gorman defended Ford Australia's decision to cut Falcon and Territory production by 20 per cent from November as a direct result of Australia's shrinking SUV and large car segments, which was announced less than three weeks after the company revealed a $148.2 million profit for calendar year 2005 (down from $192.3 in 2004).

"It’s only a bad time to cut production if we have more demand. What we're doing is getting our production in line with where consumer demand is.

"That has nothing to do with North America at all.

"What it has to do with is the changing dynamics of the Australian marketplace - and for us to continue to produce vehicles at a level that the market is unwilling to consume is irresponsible management and we’re not going to do that."

Mr Gorman said that while it attracted more than 150,000 buyers annually, or about 15 per cent of Australia's total new-car market, its large car segment would remain "viable".


"I've said all along that what we need is somewhere around a 15 per cent segment, which would give you an industry of around 150,000 large cars. If we have that size of segment it is still a viable segment that gives us a legitimate business opportunity."

Last year Ford sold 53,080 Falcon and 23,454 Territory vehicles (more Australian-made vehicles than both Holden and Toyota) for a 33 per cent share of the large car and medium SUV segments respectively. Overall, its market share was 12.7 per cent – down from 14.2 per cent in 2004.

"We have three very strong competitors so what you'll see next year is an uptick in the size of the segment with all the new products. (Falcon) BF MkII is a great offering, VE will continue to take traction and clearly the Aurion will have some impact in terms of expanding that segment. So our view is that the segment will grow in 2007," he said.

"Our share of the large car segment is up significantly this year – the problem is the segment itself is down about three per centage points from last year.

"So even though we are performing well in that segment, the consumers are at this time choosing to buy in other segments, which is why Fiesta and Focus volume is up significantly year over year.

"But as people, at the moment anyway, are moving away from large family sedans we have to get our production in line with that."

Mr Gorman said he was excited about the prospect of Ford executive chairman Bill Ford sampling Ford's Australian wares the following weekend. Asked if was nervous, Mr Gorman said:

"No, not at all – I'm legitimately excited. Bill's going to drive a whole series of cars over the weekend. It's a great opportunity for us.

"Bill's never been to Australia before. He happens to be out in Asia and this is sort of on the way home if you will. It's a great opportunity for us to showcase what Ford Australia is capable of.

"These are difficult times for Ford Motor Co and it's against a backdrop of backing off our own production, but that's just one side of the equation.

"The other side of the equation is all this great local product we're capable of designing, building and developing here. We're really excited about showcasing our team and our capability, so no I don't get nervous about that stuff."

Mr Gorman said Mr Ford would drive at least two versions of both its current Falcon and Territory models, as well as view Ford Australia's entire line-up.

The Ford chief will also be given a sneak preview of the next-generation Falcon, codenamed Orion and due on sale in early 2008, as well as the T6 engineering program, in which Ford Australia will engineer an all-new global commercial vehicle for the brand.

"We’re at a certain stage of Orion development so he'll be taken through that in great detail - he'll see it but we do not have an Orion to drive. If we did we'll sell them. We have various levels of prototypes and he'll get exposure to that but the car's not done.

"We'll take him through a static review of the complete showroom – every vehicle that we retail in Australia - and then essentially he's going to drive every domestic product that we make.

"Part of us showing him our capability will be also going through the T6 program as well, because it's important that he understands that aspect of our business.

"Whenever someone like Bill moves around everyone's looking for the motivation for the trip, but it's quite simple.

"Bill has wanted to come down here for some time, but when he had the dual roles of chairman and CEO with the challenges it was very hard to get out of the US.

"He was kind enough to make himself available on the weekend and we have quite a busy weekend planned.

"I've worked with Bill before and I know him somewhat, but it's a great opportunity for Ford Australia to really showcase its capability and I know the entire management team is excited to show him what we can do."


I wonder if Gorman was implying that Orion's budget had taken a hit?

And again, I can't believe Ford's CEO had never been here.

syko
10-31-2006, 09:13 AM
Thats a strange way of looking at how to fix fords profitabilty issues. Instead of ford aus increasing its profits(note its already in the black) wouldn't the pressure be on ford NA to actually make some money. I don't see how ford aus can significantly increase its return with adding a few extra models or expanding their current lineup.

pimento
10-31-2006, 09:16 AM
Well, you never know.. if he likes what he sees then maybe you Americas (as in, the continents) types will see the Falcon and such heading there.. eventually. It does seem a little odd that engineering just isn't shared at all, at a time when they're looking to save costs. Seems like it's a little more than a holiday visit on the way home to me...

nota
10-31-2006, 09:45 AM
"Bill's never been to Australia before. He happens to be out in Asia and this is sort of on the way home if you will."
Just passing by and thought he'd drop in :p



In the late 1970s a young Edsel Ford was CEO of Ford Aus

SlickHolden
10-31-2006, 10:12 AM
FoMoCo reaks of GM ignorance too me. there in trouble lets get one of the smallest in the family and give them shit scare there pants off make them think there dead. Doesn't matter if they make profits and are the only ones too;)

I'm sure when they were told he was coming they shit!.

Also in one of the car mags i seen the orion under cloth with a touch of it open pretty much BA style. A couple of things i picked up if it's the real car that is, Longer wheelbase, But large overhangs front still. A touch of VE head down bum up but not too much. Some pretty big wheels.
I don't know how they don't have a car too drive yet that really does seem od a little at this stage.

fpv_gtho
10-31-2006, 05:44 PM
That'd be right, squeeze the little guys to try and make the big guys more profitable......

Maybe we'll get a Bob Lutz-esque reaction out of him, but i doubt you could get that twice in so few years.

SlickHolden
10-31-2006, 06:35 PM
Are Lutz and ford twins:p Typical American motoring industry at work. Look outside the box when the real problem is in it;).

adrenaline
10-31-2006, 09:57 PM
FoMoCo reaks of GM ignorance too me. there in trouble lets get one of the smallest in the family and give them shit scare there pants off make them think there dead. Doesn't matter if they make profits and are the only ones too;)

I'm sure when they were told he was coming they shit!.

Also in one of the car mags i seen the orion under cloth with a touch of it open pretty much BA style. A couple of things i picked up if it's the real car that is, Longer wheelbase, But large overhangs front still. A touch of VE head down bum up but not too much. Some pretty big wheels.
I don't know how they don't have a car too drive yet that really does seem od a little at this stage.

Which car mag. We get the subscription to Ford's magazine (not sure if it's only for Ford owners or not) and they had a picture of the next gen Falcon and Territory under blue cloth...but it wasn't detailed enough to extract details like wheelbase and overhangs...so if you can tell me which mag it was I'd be very interested!!

fpv_gtho
10-31-2006, 11:44 PM
It was Wheels. Slick, compare the silhouette to Iosis though and it becomes alot clearer. The long, blocky front overhang for instance compared to Iosis starts looking alot better.

fpv_gtho
11-01-2006, 04:25 AM
Recognise anything slick? http://news.windingroad.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/08/Lincoln-MKS-rendering.jpg

Thats what it looks like Wheels done it based on. Thats the Lincoln MKS concept

SlickHolden
11-01-2006, 04:42 AM
hahahaha shit yep that's the one them wheels dam there shits aren't they:mad:
It might look ok if it's not far from that and the iosis.

adrenaline
11-01-2006, 04:42 AM
OMG! I was reading the issue about 5 mins ago and looking at the windowline and last pillar, recognised it as an MKS. So I just came online to inform people and you beat me to it by 20 mins...

http://www.motorpasion.com/archivos/images/LincolnMKS_Side2.jpg

fpv_gtho
11-01-2006, 04:45 AM
For the record, thats basically a Ford Fusion which still puts the proportions at about the right level.

syko
11-01-2006, 04:45 AM
^^
that is one of the best looking lincoln's ever

adrenaline
11-01-2006, 04:45 AM
Whilst on the topic of the MKS, it's another stupid decision by Ford to have Lincoln develop an AWD/ RWD large architecture, and have Ford Oz develop another, and on top of that have Ford NA develop ANOTHER different one for the 08 Crown Vic. God they are stupid.

adrenaline
11-01-2006, 04:46 AM
For the record, thats basically a Ford Fusion which still puts the proportions at about the right level.

From my knowlegde, it's bigger than a Fusion. Well, that was the innitial NAIAS report...

EDIT:

Of course it's bigger than a Fusion, the Zephyr (MKZ) is the Fusion derived sedan...

fpv_gtho
11-01-2006, 04:50 AM
As you can see though, like Iosis the front overhang is exagerated in silhouette form as you can see how the headlights wrap around

adrenaline
11-01-2006, 04:51 AM
Those sneaky people at wheels..I brought the Mag JUST for the supposed Orion side profile...!

fpv_gtho
11-01-2006, 04:52 AM
From my knowlegde, it's bigger than a Fusion. Well, that was the innitial NAIAS report...

EDIT:

Of course it's bigger than a Fusion, the Zephyr (MKZ) is the Fusion derived sedan...

Its going to be built on Fords D3 platform, which is also shared with the 500, not Fusion sorry.

adrenaline
11-01-2006, 04:53 AM
I've heard Lincoln are doing it themselves, with the 500's current chassis getting an overhaul in 2008...

fpv_gtho
11-01-2006, 04:55 AM
That could be a possibility. D3 initially was based off a Volvo so by 2008 it could be up for some revisions.

adrenaline
11-01-2006, 04:58 AM
Well I have definately heard that MKS will have AWD, something the 500 doesn't have.

IBrake4Rainbows
11-01-2006, 05:06 AM
the 500 IS 4wd.

adrenaline
11-01-2006, 05:07 AM
I don't remember it being AWD...I'll take a look on Ford's NA website later on :D

IBrake4Rainbows
11-01-2006, 05:10 AM
500 and Freestyle were built on similar platforms and share a similar 4wd System.

research is your friend :p

adrenaline
11-01-2006, 05:11 AM
I just checked, D3 does support FF and AWD. My mistake, I haven't actually looked at a 500 spec sheet since 2005 ;)

adrenaline
11-01-2006, 05:15 AM
500 and Freestyle were built on similar platforms and share a similar 4wd System.

research is your friend :p

D3 (and variants of D3) are also used on:


Volvo S60
Volvo S80
Volvo XC90


Volvo call it P2, according to Wikipedia...

IBrake4Rainbows
11-01-2006, 05:22 AM
All three of those vehicles support 4WD.

adrenaline
11-02-2006, 04:05 AM
I just read on another forum that Orion will be 80% BFII under the skin, with the same wheelbase etc. (The person who said it was Geary, remember the popular CGI VE Commodore guy) Load of shite?

2ndclasscitizen
11-02-2006, 04:07 AM
Sharing the same wheelbase doesn't make it have BFII components.

adrenaline
11-02-2006, 04:09 AM
It won't be a fresh car, either. It'll be 80% BFII under the skin. Same wheelbase; everything.

.....

fpv_gtho
11-02-2006, 04:09 AM
Well theres going to be alot of BF2 owing to the fact the drivetrain will be largely unchanged, the rear end will be largely unchanged, the overall proportions im not too sure on, but the big differences will be the body and front suspension, but thats already in existence under the Territory. So under the skin, its going to carry over alot, but that hinges on what weighting you give the new front end. Personally, i'd say more like 60-70% as i'd rate the driveline, basic proportions, front end and rear end all about equally, and one of those is definately going to be new.

2ndclasscitizen
11-02-2006, 04:14 AM
I'd say it'd be same drivetrain, but that's no biggie as Ford's is fine. Can't see a reason for the front suspension to change from double wishbones, though it will be most likely different. Maybe slight changes to the Control Blade, nothing major though.

I do think however it will have a new chassis that's stiffer and better, just because they usually do. But I wouldn't say it'll be a heap of BFII, what'll happen is that Ford will carryover the good design elements of BFII (suspension and drivetrain) and adapt them onto the Orion

fpv_gtho
11-02-2006, 04:20 AM
Theyre under pressure to keep costs contained on it, so the big focus is really on the body and interior. BA brought alot of new stuff that wasnt needed for that type of update, which has really stolen alot of its fire. If AU wouldve been a success, we'd be seeing an Orion debuting DOHC engines, control blade IRS and maybe a few other things. They were all brought forward what will be 5.5 years. Together with the front end, Orion originally wouldve had a significantly updated chassis/floorplan, but the now carryover floorplan both relieves some stress as well as removing some thunder from the hype.

The big thing with the front end is the lower wishbones, which are really 2 piece so theyve got double joints or something, alot like VE's front end IIRC. Also has the forward mounted steering rack and the hubs have the space for AWD.

SlickHolden
11-02-2006, 06:37 AM
Please everyone tell me honest here. On another forum i got canned for saying this but tell me am i wrong or stupid or biased.
This was some time ago.

I said when the orion comes it wont kill the VE. Reason being the VE is now on a new path it's very good and has plenty of life in it being so new. That doesn't mean the orion wont be better chances are it might only just scrap ahead if it does, It might go head too head and the only thing that splits them might be a feel or one thing that was better over the other.
Because the orion might be new but it's going too carry some familiar characteristics in it. And that is what will keep the VE and Orion closer then ever before. For the first time they will go head too head with pretty much the same arsenal. Because of the AU's failure it brought many new things too the BA which might have been planed for BF or MKII just before the orion,
As i write i have just looked up and seen FPV_GTHO has already said what i am writing:p. It's the AU that brought this new gear too early, But at least there is no testing needed it's been tested now since 2002 in the real world day too day, So that is a plus.

But i was given some pretty heavy shit for saying that:D Ok i said it on a ford forum but it's really right and it's not insulting anything.

adrenaline
11-02-2006, 07:30 AM
That's why I hate single brand forums. There is nobody that will tell it like it is. And they are a fanboy magnet.

fpv_gtho
11-02-2006, 08:19 AM
Please everyone tell me honest here. On another forum i got canned for saying this but tell me am i wrong or stupid or biased.
This was some time ago.

I said when the orion comes it wont kill the VE. Reason being the VE is now on a new path it's very good and has plenty of life in it being so new. That doesn't mean the orion wont be better chances are it might only just scrap ahead if it does, It might go head too head and the only thing that splits them might be a feel or one thing that was better over the other.
Because the orion might be new but it's going too carry some familiar characteristics in it. And that is what will keep the VE and Orion closer then ever before. For the first time they will go head too head with pretty much the same arsenal. Because of the AU's failure it brought many new things too the BA which might have been planed for BF or MKII just before the orion,
As i write i have just looked up and seen FPV_GTHO has already said what i am writing:p. It's the AU that brought this new gear too early, But at least there is no testing needed it's been tested now since 2002 in the real world day too day, So that is a plus.

But i was given some pretty heavy shit for saying that:D Ok i said it on a ford forum but it's really right and it's not insulting anything.

Well it depends on alot of factors, but namely what the market is reacting to in 2 years and what Holden will do to VE in 2 years to distance itself from the VZ/VE similarity. Yes, due to Orion having alot of familiarity mechanically with BF2 there wont be a sense of newness in particular areas, but its still going to be all new sheetmetal and interior, and those are really the big issues where VE has jumped BF.

I personally expect Orion to jump VE moreso than VE jumped BF, but Holden will make up some of that ground with VF. The problem with VE is its a whole lot of stuff thats really already available. Hopefully Orion brings something new to the table, and VF as well with the possibility of DOD and DI.

SlickHolden
11-02-2006, 09:48 AM
That's why I hate single brand forums. There is nobody that will tell it like it is. And they are a fanboy magnet.
Number 1 reason why i don't go too ls1 forum. I have been told too piss of too there:p But i like too ad comments on other forums be that voice from the outer that has a different side of the conversation.

Well it depends on alot of factors, but namely what the market is reacting to in 2 years and what Holden will do to VE in 2 years to distance itself from the VZ/VE similarity. Yes, due to Orion having alot of familiarity mechanically with BF2 there wont be a sense of newness in particular areas, but its still going to be all new sheetmetal and interior, and those are really the big issues where VE has jumped BF.

I personally expect Orion to jump VE moreso than VE jumped BF, but Holden will make up some of that ground with VF. The problem with VE is its a whole lot of stuff thats really already available. Hopefully Orion brings something new to the table, and VF as well with the possibility of DOD and DI.
I hope they both ad DI becasuse it will walk over the Aurion's fuel economy and leave the 4cyl camry in nowhere land. And that should be great for comepetition again because they will respond:).

2ndclasscitizen
11-02-2006, 10:39 PM
I agree with fpv on the Orion there. The VE isn't a huge jump over the BF, but it was a huge jump over the VZ. The BF is a thoroughly modern, very good car, aso any changes will just be a leap frog over the VE, and then Holden will reply with update to the VE etc. Now that Holden is at the same level as Ford with a modern, stiff body and non-1978 based IRS they'll be closer than ever. (Also now that the Commy is as heavy as the Falc as well :p_

fpv_gtho
11-03-2006, 03:49 AM
Chris Bath and the rest of the CH7 crew have been up to their regular idiocy with lines like this during the news update

"Ford announce over 600 job cuts in line with billion dollar losses"