2008 24 Hours of Le Mans Entry List

[Wouter Melissen]

The ACO have just published the list of 55 accepted entries and 8 reserve entries. Interesting to note is the Vitaphone Aston Martin, Tafel Ferrari and the absolutely massive LMP1 field.

[faksta]

Do I have a deja-vu, or you have already posted it?

[Wouter Melissen]

Do I have a deja-vu, or you have already posted it?

It was published less than an hour ago. The only other list we have is the Le Mans Series entry list.

[faksta]

It was published less than an hour ago. The only other list we have is the Le Mans Series entry list.

Oh, yes... Seems that I've confused them with each other..

[Wouter Melissen]

It is also interesting to note that WR have not received an entry.

[DasModell]

which is a shame i was hoping to see it live this year.. but i can't say who i would've liked it to replace ..

[Wouter Melissen]

which is a shame i was hoping to see it live this year.. but i can't say who i would've liked it to replace ..

It reflects the raised level of endurance racing. The ACO can no longer justify offering teams like WR an automatic entry.

[Dantera22B]

I've always admired the WR team if they were British they'd definately be called the 'Plucky Brits.' I went to Le Sarthe way back in 2000 and 2001 in a Marcos Mantara LM400 Spyder and I loved every minute of it. Will definately be going back very soon.

[Kitdy]

There is an awful lot of Ferraris.

[Kitdy]

Peugeot has officially announced it's drivers for Le Mans.

Marc Gene, Christian Klien, Pedro Lamy, Franck Montagny, Nicolas Minassian, Stephane Sarrazin, Jacques Villeneuve, Alex Wurz, and Ricardo Zonta.

That is a crapload of F1 talent. Too bad no Sebastien...

[fisetdavid26]

There is an awful lot of Ferraris.
Le Mans has always been notorious for its awful lot of Porsche 911 entries...


Peugeot has officially announced it's drivers for Le Mans.

Marc Gene, Christian Klien, Pedro Lamy, Franck Montagny, Nicolas Minassian, Stephane Sarrazin, Jacques Villeneuve, Alex Wurz, and Ricardo Zonta.

That is a crapload of F1 talent. Too bad no Sebastien...
All those pilots have experience at Le Mans and/or in Formula 1. Peugeot went the experience way. Can't wait to see those three 908's against those three R10's!

[RacingManiac]

I wonder how the RS Spyder will do for 24 hours race.....

I thought Acura was planning to do this race in 2008.....I guess not...

[Turbo.Jenkens]

Le Mans has always been notorious for its awful lot of Porsche 911 entries...


Oddly there is only one less Spyker than 911... weird.

[NicFromLA]

Oddly there is only one less Spyker than 911... weird.

Not to mention only two RS Spyders after they made such a big deal the RS Spyder was going to be there. LeMans used to be Porsche's race, but it almost seems as if they don't care anymore.

[RacingManiac]

not until they can figure out how to beat the diesel car without using a diesel....

[The_Canuck]

I really hope the Acuras get in somehow, no matter how unlikely it is lol. I was really looking forward to seeing them compete.

[Kitdy]

I really hope the Acuras get in somehow, no matter how unlikely it is lol. I was really looking forward to seeing them compete.

That would be nice, to be honest, I was more looking forward to see the Spyders there for some reason.

[Wouter Melissen]

Oddly there is only one less Spyker than 911... weird.

The first 997 GT3 RSR wasn't very good and several teams switched to the Ferrari. There are two teams in the entry list with a Ferrari that campaigned a Porsche last year. The Ferrari was the car to beat, although it did not win the two 24 hours races. Porsche has made a big deal about launching a new version of their car, but Ferrari has also made quite some revisions to the F430, so it is still uncertain if the 2008 Porsche will have what it takes. Hopefully the new Aston Martin and new Spyker can add further competition in anticipation of BMW's entry.


Not to mention only two RS Spyders after they made such a big deal the RS Spyder was going to be there. LeMans used to be Porsche's race, but it almost seems as if they don't care anymore.

I believe the two European teams were assigned by Porsche to test the water. Both teams have class winning potential, so it is not that they have no chance. It must be said that the LMP2 class is very unpredictable as the cars struggle with reliability. A high revving V8 is a disaster weighting to happen. This was the case when the Cosworth DFV was tried at Le Mans and it is still the case with Porsche's V8. It vibrates itself and the rest of the car to pieces.

[2ndclasscitizen]

Hopefully the new Aston Martin and new Spyker can add further competition in anticipation of BMW's entry.

What are BMW going to be running? An M3?

[Wouter Melissen]

What are BMW going to be running? An M3?

BMW E92 M3 GTR - Ultimatecarpage.com - Images, Specifications and Information (http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/car/3594/BMW-E92-M3-GTR.html)

[Ferrer]

I believe the two European teams were assigned by Porsche to test the water. Both teams have class winning potential, so it is not that they have no chance. It must be said that the LMP2 class is very unpredictable as the cars struggle with reliability. A high revving V8 is a disaster weighting to happen. This was the case when the Cosworth DFV was tried at Le Mans and it is still the case with Porsche's V8. It vibrates itself and the rest of the car to pieces.
Didn't the DFV win in the end though? In a Mirage or something? in the mid 70's? Or maybe I'm completely wrong...

[Wouter Melissen]

Didn't the DFV win in the end though? In a Mirage or something? in the mid 70's? Or maybe I'm completely wrong...

It won twice actually; in 1975 and also in the back of a Rondeau in 1979 or 1980. Exceptions to the rule though.

Both Acura and Porsche have asked for a higher displacement limit, so they don't have to rev the engine as much.

[Kitdy]

A high revving V8 is a disaster weighting to happen. This was the case when the Cosworth DFV was tried at Le Mans and it is still the case with Porsche's V8. It vibrates itself and the rest of the car to pieces.

Is there the same problem with the 2L turbos?

[Wouter Melissen]

Is there the same problem with the 2L turbos?

No it's a high revving V8 problem specifically. The four cylinder engines are much more reliable.

[KFA-R]

Not to mention only two RS Spyders after they made such a big deal the RS Spyder was going to be there. LeMans used to be Porsche's race, but it almost seems as if they don't care anymore.

and to add, they not even factory run... i'm sure they will have huge factory backing but no Team Porsche.

GT1 still seems the class to watch, 3 DB9's and 4 C6-R's however only 1 saleen? did they not do as well this year?

[henk4]

and to add, they not even factory run... i'm sure they will have huge factory backing but no Team Porsche.

GT1 still seems the class to watch, 3 DB9's and 4 C6-R's however only 1 saleen? did they not do as well this year?
At any LMS race with Porsche participation, there is always the Porsche Sport Truck in the paddock....

[Wouter Melissen]

and to add, they not even factory run... i'm sure they will have huge factory backing but no Team Porsche.

Factory teams are not allowed in LMP2.

[KFA-R]

At any LMS race with Porsche participation, there is always the Porsche Sport Truck in the paddock....

as i figured


Factory teams are not allowed in LMP2.

hmmm, thats very interesting... the concept of LM racing is very cloudy to us australians, you can only get very limited coverage of the races on Pay TV, other than that not a word. so is LMP2 the only class with this rule? i gather LMP1 and GT1 are not like this as Aston Martin Racing and Team Audi running.

[henk4]

as i figured



hmmm, thats very interesting... the concept of LM racing is very cloudy to us australians, you can only get very limited coverage of the races on Pay TV, other than that not a word. so is LMP2 the only class with this rule? i gather LMP1 and GT1 are not like this as Aston Martin Racing and Team Audi running.

Correct, The "2" classes (LMP2 and GT2) are intended for privateers. In principle, an LMP2 car should also only have one pro driver, accompanied by one or two "gentleman" drivers. In ALMS Porsche and Acura have made a mockery of this "spirit"...

[Ferrer]

Correct, The "2" classes (LMP2 and GT2) are intended for privateers. In principle, an LMP2 car should also only have one pro driver, accompanied by one or two "gentleman" drivers. In ALMS Porsche and Acura have made a mockery of this "spirit"...
What about the GT2 Spykers?

[KFA-R]

Correct, The "2" classes (LMP2 and GT2) are intended for privateers. In principle, an LMP2 car should also only have one pro driver, accompanied by one or two "gentleman" drivers. In ALMS Porsche and Acura have made a mockery of this "spirit"...

ok... sounds like a good way of getting started into the enduro race world really if the whole thing was played in the true spirit in which it is intended.

did i hear correctly, Porsche only built the spyder for the LMP2 class because the new rules for LMP1 "lean towards" the diesel powered vehicles? (i do say that very loosly, i dont want to start an argument:p)

so Porsche and Acura are doing something very similar to F1, like a costomer car thing, its their full spec car just under a different name.

[henk4]

What about the GT2 Spykers?
the organisers gave them a break......

[Wouter Melissen]

What about the GT2 Spykers?

They are run by a different company. Of course they are related, but strictly speaking it is not a Works team.

[henk4]

did i hear correctly, Porsche only built the spyder for the LMP2 class because the new rules for LMP1 "lean towards" the diesel powered vehicles? (i do say that very loosly, i dont want to start an argument:p)


Porsche's supremo Wiedeking hates diesel engines....and now he is an awkward position as Porsche controls VAG/Audi and hence HIS diesel powered cars win...:).

[KFA-R]

Porsche's supremo Wiedeking hates diesel engines....and now he is an awkward position as Porsche controls VAG/Audi and hence HIS diesel powered cars win...:).


whoops! :rolleyes: i'm sure if they continue to win they will stay powered by the oil burner! hehe

will we ever see a full on assult at LMP1 by Porsche with these current rules? the spyder could very well be the testing ground for the larger car... i say this because they have been quiet for a long time, that is very unusal for them.

[Wouter Melissen]

whoops! :rolleyes: i'm sure if they continue to win they will stay powered by the oil burner! hehe

will we ever see a full on assult at LMP1 by Porsche with these current rules? the spyder could very well be the testing ground for the larger car... i say this because they have been quiet for a long time, that is very unusal for them.

It is expected that both Porsche and Acura will launch a LMP1 campaign in the next few years. There are two important decisions expected from the ACO for the future. Firstly the ACO is talking to the teams about the lap times in the race. They want cars not to lap faster than 3:30 and last year the diesels dipped well below that and with Peugeot having sorted the problems, the times could be even quicker. So the ACO is already talking to the teams / manufacturers about measures to slow the cars down for 2009. Whether this will involve both diesel and petrol engines, I do not know.

A bigger issue is the prospected new LMP1 regulations for 2010. The ACO has made clear that they want prototypes that look more like production cars than the current cars. The information has been sketchy (literally) and include nothing more than a sketch of a car that looks like a DP, which was not received very. Nothing is certain right now and that is a stumbling block for manufacturers to develop brand new cars, which might be obsolete from 2010 onwards.

It is believed that Audi, Peugeot, Porsche and Acura will be joined by Aston Martin, Corvette and Toyota at the turn of the decade. It looks set to become a very interesting period for endurance racing, which might get the FIA worried again like Group C did some 20 years ago.

[Kitdy]

It is believed that Audi, Peugeot, Porsche and Acura will be joined by Aston Martin, Corvette and Toyota at the turn of the decade. It looks set to become a very interesting period for endurance racing, which might get the FIA worried again like Group C did some 20 years ago.

It could get really interesting with all those manufacturers - it's what I like to see.

Why would the FIA get worried?

[KFA-R]

It is expected that both Porsche and Acura will launch a LMP1 campaign in the next few years. There are two important decisions expected from the ACO for the future. Firstly the ACO is talking to the teams about the lap times in the race. They want cars not to lap faster than 3:30 and last year the diesels dipped well below that and with Peugeot having sorted the problems, the times could be even quicker. So the ACO is already talking to the teams / manufacturers about measures to slow the cars down for 2009. Whether this will involve both diesel and petrol engines, I do not know.

A bigger issue is the prospected new LMP1 regulations for 2010. The ACO has made clear that they want prototypes that look more like production cars than the current cars. The information has been sketchy (literally) and include nothing more than a sketch of a car that looks like a DP, which was not received very. Nothing is certain right now and that is a stumbling block for manufacturers to develop brand new cars, which might be obsolete from 2010 onwards.

It is believed that Audi, Peugeot, Porsche and Acura will be joined by Aston Martin, Corvette and Toyota at the turn of the decade. It looks set to become a very interesting period for endurance racing, which might get the FIA worried again like Group C did some 20 years ago.

yes, i can see a repeat of the group C situation myself.

personally it would be nice to see the prototype cars look more like a road going vehicle, its been done before, the Merc (i wont mention the fact it flipped several times :p) looked very much like the road going car and was able to keep up with the likes of the BMW and the Toyota that it was racing against, not to mention it was clearly beeting the audi R8R. however as soon as the R8 was born, it has (as we can all clearly see) changed it forever. i would like to see a change back to more road going cars for the LMP1 class but the catch would be (as you have already mentioned) development would basically stop! i am seeing this in F1 and i dont want it to happen in LM racing. however, another catch is, they sisnt stop the development in Group C, that leads me back to the first point. its all a big circle!

Toyota? you saying that gives me the impression you think their F1 days are limited. i dont think we can rule them out of F1 just yet, give them this year, if they fail again then we can start talking about them pulling out more seriously.

for the deisel engines in this class, the organisers wanted to see a competitive car, they got it in the first year and now have 2... might this rule change you speek of mean the end of the deisel advantage?

[Ferrer]

It could get really interesting with all those manufacturers - it's what I like to see.

Why would the FIA get worried?
Becuase it might be more popular than F1. And FIA doesn't want that.

It has happened several times in the past. So far they ruined the ETCC in 1987, the BPR in the late 90's or the WRC in the early 00's.

[Kitdy]

Does anyone know of any betting odds for Le Mans 2008 or any other year? Is there any online betting source that has the odds for winning the race? I Googled it and failed.

[Kitdy]

It is believed that Audi, Peugeot, Porsche and Acura will be joined by Aston Martin, Corvette and Toyota at the turn of the decade. It looks set to become a very interesting period for endurance racing, which might get the FIA worried again like Group C did some 20 years ago.

I heard that the Corvette LMP Evo plan died a matter of days ago, haven't heard anything about AM's plan, but Acura, Renault, Peugeot, Audi, and BMW are all supposedly working on LMP Evo programs according to some dude online.

Whether it's true or not remains to be seen.

[Zytek_Fan]

I heard that the Corvette LMP Evo plan died a matter of days ago, haven't heard anything about AM's plan, but Acura, Renault, Peugeot, Audi, and BMW are all supposedly working on LMP Evo programs according to some dude online.

Whether it's true or not remains to be seen.

Corvette LMP program is an "okay" away from initiated.

[Kitdy]

Corvette LMP program is an "okay" away from initiated.

I heard it was scrapped. I actually heard LMP Evo was scrapped but then may yet be alive or some crap like that, and the reason GM killed the Corvette LMP was because it was no longer relevant to the roadcar in that they decided to go to a front-engined format for the C7 and the Corvette LMP would be midengined.

I would question what relevance racing a Corvette at all has to the image of selling Corvettes - one, The ALMS and Le Mans is not that popular with the main market of Corvette - America, and two, people that are Corvette fans are I would say generally well established and don't need to see a car racing to gain popularity. In F1, I see the same problem with racing other than in new markets - I read Ferrari sold tons more cars in China after the years following the inaugural Chinese Grand Prix.

I truly don't understand why Toyota races, but I enjoy that they do.

[Kitdy]

Got a question that doesn't deserve another thread, who has been the sanctioning body of Le Mans in the past? I know that the CSI was in charge in the past, was it then FISA and then the ACO? What are the dates for transfer of power?

[togos452]

Corvette engineers did "discover" dry-sump engine lubrication with the aluminum Z06.

[Zytek_Fan]

Got a question that doesn't deserve another thread, who has been the sanctioning body of Le Mans in the past? I know that the CSI was in charge in the past, was it then FISA and then the ACO? What are the dates for transfer of power?

Don't know the exact dates, but here's what I found


restructuring of the FIA in 1993 lead to the disappearance of the FISA, putting motor racing under direct management of the FIA.


The Automobile Club de l'Ouest (Automobile Club of the West - referring to the western region of France), sometimes abbreviated to ACO, is the largest automotive group in France. It was founded in 1906 by car building and racing enthusiasts, and is most famous for being the organising entity behind the annual Le Mans 24 Hours race. The ACO also lobbies on behalf of French drivers on such issues as road building and maintenance, the availability of driving schools and road safety classes, and the incorporation of technical innovations into new vehicles. It also runs a roadside assistance service for its members.

[Kitdy]

Don't know the exact dates, but here's what I found

I've actually read those exact phrases off Wiki. Thanks anyways Z_F.

Maybe W or henk will know.

[Matra et Alpine]

IIRC the Le Mans 24h has ALWAYS been ACO and hence why it's got it's own regulations and often in conflict with FIA/FISA ones :) Will do some research in the museum.

btw ... re betting .... I checked and the UK based ones won't be putting odds up for anotehr 2-3 weeks. bet365.com have confirmed this with me. If I get time, I'll look around the French car forums and sites and see if I can find any over there.

[Kitdy]

IIRC the Le Mans 24h has ALWAYS been ACO and hence why it's got it's own regulations and often in conflict with FIA/FISA ones :) Will do some research in the museum.

btw ... re betting .... I checked and the UK based ones won't be putting odds up for anotehr 2-3 weeks. bet365.com have confirmed this with me. If I get time, I'll look around the French car forums and sites and see if I can find any over there.

Thanks a bunch Matra. Some of the older regulations were determined by the CSI I think as I read on Wiki and here on UCP.

I hope I'll remember looking up the odds for Le Mans - I think it'll be quite interesting.