New M5

[RacingManiac]

So someone has to make a thread, might as well be me....

2011 BMW M5: Yes, this is it (http://jalopnik.com/5812005/2012-bmw-m5-yes-this-is-it)

Twin-Turbo V8, 552bhp...blah blah....

More interesting just as an observation, this is the first M car IIRC with a multi-piston, fixed caliper brake.....something I always find oddball about the BMW M cars....

I supposed they don't really "lack" braking power before, but floating calipers are typically steel, and have more potential for braking system compliance...not to mention they don't look as nice...lol

[pimento]

Actually I heard a few times about various M cars that the brakes weren't as good as maybe they should be, and that they'd put racing pads in the press cars. That was always a bit [citation needed] but I guess this one might address that.

Autoblog's version (http://www.autoblog.com/2011/06/15/first-official-2012-bmw-m5-shots-hit-the-web/). Talk of US version having proper manual option again.

[Ferrer]

It is indeed ironic that the US may get the manual and Europe doesn't. Seems like the world is upside down.

Bah, who cares. Everyone knows that sports saloon perfection was achieved with the E39 M5.

[Commodore GS/E]

This is the E39 with more power. Looks nicely understated and has bags of power. Maybe not as much as the CTS-V, but it's enough in my eyes.
The only thing I'll miss here is the V10.

[Badsight]

only M5 ive had a ride in was an E34 that was getting on in k's. i thought the 6 cylinder was great

[Ferrer]

This is the E39 with more power.
Nah, it's far too powerful, complex, showy and ugly. ;)

[thebrochureman]

I'm kind of pleased that the new M5 will be a Twin Turbo V8, I'll miss the V10 but the BMW M engines were getting to big. The M3 are V8 and i missed the I6's. I think it's good that the next gen M5 will be a V8 and the New M3 will be a Twin Turbo I6. Like other car magazines said the M cars engine size has been restored.

[Badsight]

I'll miss the V10 but the BMW M engines were getting to big.

ok so its not the older 5.0 v8 - but with the turbos & intercoolers it probablly weighs more & takes up more room

without them there was only a 20 kg differance

[thebrochureman]

^^^ When i mean too big i mean the number of cylinders, not weight. I can't weight for the next gen M3 because that will be a Twin Turbo I6, The V8 M3 was good but i'd rather have the V8 in the M5 form.

[pimento]

Given this engine is a 4.4 it shouldn't be too much heavier than the old 5.0s if it is at all. Google-fu is failing me on finding engine masses at the moment, but it's worth pursuing if someone can find them.

Personally I always felt the S85 had too little torque for the old M5. It was a heavy car with a power biased engine, and from all reports it suffered for that. This should bring it back to a more grunty setup that seems to me to suit the M5's nature. In saying that, the M3 suits a rev happy screamer so I was happy to see the S65 in there.

[culver]

I don't quite know what to think of the new car. It's OK looking but still a step down from the E39 M5. Is the engine that unique or just a turbo version of the current V8? The V10 was cool because it wasn't just an uprated version of another 5 series engine.

Floating vs fixed calipers, floating from what I've read had a few advantages beyond just cost. I don't recall them and even then my reference was somewhat fuzzy on the subject. It would be interesting to talk to an expert in the area.

I'm curious if the CTS-V's engine affected BMW's decision making. I can't imagine they were happy that a Caddy was proving faster than their V10 car.

[ScionDriver]

I quite like it. It's closer to the E39 with it's understated presence. I think it'll be a good car. I like the idea of a proper manual option too, to me the last one was too tech savvy and complicated. I remember asking a BMW rep at the Chicago Auto Show if it was really necessary for a car to have 8 gear changing options, I finally got him to admit it probably didn't.

[RacingManiac]

I quite like it. It's closer to the E39 with it's understated presence. I think it'll be a good car. I like the idea of a proper manual option too, to me the last one was too tech savvy and complicated. I remember asking a BMW rep at the Chicago Auto Show if it was really necessary for a car to have 8 gear changing options, I finally got him to admit it probably didn't.

Gear shift option doesn't add weight, they are just codes....although it is as you say, adds unnecessary complication...

[kingofthering]

It's not as awful as I thought it would look, but it still looks like somebody's punched it in the face a few times.

[NSXType-R]

It's okay I guess. No crazy eyebrows of the older 5 series. Definitely a step in the right direction, but I'm not sure if I like it either.

[crisis]

I like the look. Looks like they have finally lost all vestiges of "that boot lid". Nice to see them using styling cues from Holden for the side vents. :p

http://www.wholesalesuspension.com.au/pics/gallery/large/holden/ve_ss_sd_1.JPG

[clutch-monkey]

looks better than the last effort.
that said, most people would confuse it with an M3 at a glance..

[Commodore GS/E]

I don't quite know what to think of the new car. It's OK looking but still a step down from the E39 M5. Is the engine that unique or just a turbo version of the current V8? The V10 was cool because it wasn't just an uprated version of another 5 series engine.

Floating vs fixed calipers, floating from what I've read had a few advantages beyond just cost. I don't recall them and even then my reference was somewhat fuzzy on the subject. It would be interesting to talk to an expert in the area.

I'm curious if the CTS-V's engine affected BMW's decision making. I can't imagine they were happy that a Caddy was proving faster than their V10 car.

Just a small question... wasn't it obvoius from the beginning that the V10 would lack torque? I mean, given it's F1 origins...

[culver]

Just a small question... wasn't it obvoius from the beginning that the V10 would lack torque? I mean, given it's F1 origins...

I have no idea. I didn't offer any conjectures about torque. Torque or not, the GM engine was simply more powerful. The V10 is hardly an F1 based engine though. Also, let's be realistic here, no, it's not lacking in torque. Just about any other car with that BMW V10 would be be considered silly powerful and silly full of torque. I mean I felt like the 400hp LS2 in the 2005 Corvette had silly amounts of torque. It's just that the turbo and SC'ed competitors have enough torque for a third world country.

[roosterjuicer]

While im sure this car will be objectively better than the old one, i will miss the screaming naturally aspirated M motors of yesteryear. one of my first car memories is cruising around in my friend's early 2000's M3 and listening to that beautiful inline 6 purr.

The other day was fortunate enough to be stuck behind a relatively new m5 for a few miles. I shut down my radio, opened the windows and sunroof, and just listened to the music coming out the pipes. Could that have been the end of beautiful high revving NA motors from BMW? I hope not.

edit: i wrote this before the holden picture loaded. but my point still stands.

[Kitdy]

I shut down my radio, opened the windows and sunroof, and just listened to the music coming out the pipes.

I do the same thing when a nice car is around me.

[Ferrer]

I do it too. Well sometimes.

[RacingManiac]

This month's Automobile and C&D have some interesting detail....amongst the most bizzare is the engine sound through stereo thing. Since the Turbo V8 is so muted that they record the sound off an engine dyno and playback through the sound system in the car....a la video game style....

Its a very interesting car though, with the reversed flow head, watercooled ECU and all....

[NSXType-R]

I heard about that too.

Strange move on their part. I mean, why would I buy a V8 car just to hear it on the stereo?

[Ferrer]

So, lowering the windows is actually not recomended to hear the engine better.

Silly.

Probably.

[Kitdy]

I just got the most recent Car and Driver and I will see what they have to say.

However, this car does nothing for me, and BMW in general seems to be losing the plot for the enthusiast driver.

[Ferrer]

However, this car does nothing for me, and BMW in general seems to be losing the plot for the enthusiast driver.
No, only the M cars.

[RacingManiac]

Quite the contrary I think....they went back to hydraulically assisted steering in lieu of the electric ones for enhanced feel(with some sacrifice in fuel economy), they spent most of the time tuning the engine to make it behave less like a turbo in terms of response and lag. And for the first time it has some proper braking hardware...

M5 was never going to be a E30 kind of a driving experience. Its a 4 door GT car, and it seems quite well done for that. At the very least this doesn't look as fussy as the last one...I'd say none of us really are in the right demographic for that car....

[Ferrer]

Oh surely it's very advanced and very good. Quantifiably it's better in every way than all previous M cars, let alone M5s. But I found the M3 E90 to be a very cold and clinical car. Again it was possibly the best sports saloon out there in its time, but in my opinion an M car shouldn't just be good.

It's all about the experience. And if a manual gearbox, high revving normally aspirated engined car could deliver it, I doubt an automatic car with turbo engine and a stereo that does noises because the engine can't will.

[Magnum9987]

I picked up Top Gear, on which the M5 features on the cover. James felt the soundtrack was dull and, compared to the E63 AMG, throttle response was quite slow. But he had no complaint with paddle shift, and none with the ride. He put it as "a perfect gentleman's sport saloon."

Of course, James is the "boring" one after all. I want to hear how the others think about it.

I've always liked the trick engine and in terms of raw performance, it can't really get any better, without getting bigger. Of course, feel will suffer. I think if BMW were to reenter the supercar scene sometime soon, that would be the engine to go with.

[b.carson]

is there a 2 door version for m5? anyway it still looks very sexy in 4 doors.

[clutch-monkey]

yes, the M6..