New C7

[C-4 guy]

I just got back from Barrett-Jackson in Scottsdale and thought I'd add to the internet 'buzz' with my own pics of the new C7. It's beautiful and must be seen in the flesh (so to speak). Someone shelled out $1.1 million for the right to own serial # 001.

[Wouter Melissen]

NASCAR team owner and Chevy dealer Rick Hendrick bought the car. He also bought one of the L88 Corvettes sold by the other auctioneers.

[TVR IS KING]

I can't stand how they've thrown away the circle tail-light motif. I just don't get it. Love how they've kept the targa though :)

[Matra et Alpine]

Doesn't work for me. Too much "wannabe European supercar look" about it.

'Vettes should look like 'Vettes !!

[RacingManiac]

Doesn't work for me. Too much "wannabe European supercar look" about it.

'Vettes should look like 'Vettes !!

Still made like a Vette....and probably won't cost like the EU cars that'll be slower....:D

[NSXType-R]

I can't stand how they've thrown away the circle tail-light motif. I just don't get it. Love how they've kept the targa though :)

I agree- it looks like a tarted up Camaro.

[Pretty Tone]

The Corvette should look similar to the Camaro. They are made by the same company. All major manufacturers display brand continuity... Look at Benz or Ford. Anyone saying the Rapide is just a big DB? Im laughing at GM for telling me that I can afford a new if I could afford a 2013. Huge generalizations!!!

[Kitdy]

NASCAR team owner and Chevy dealer Rick Hendrick bought the car. He also bought one of the L88 Corvettes sold by the other auctioneers.

Those were some good buys. I wouldn't mind an L88, the first C7, or ZL1 for that matter. Brilliant coverage on those rare Vettes BTW. There is scant info on the ZL1.


I can't stand how they've thrown away the circle tail-light motif. I just don't get it. Love how they've kept the targa though :)

Those circle lights always sucked. The entire rear from C4-C6 has been hideous. So chintzy and drab. Good riddance to bad rubbish.


Still made like a Vette....and probably won't cost like the EU cars that'll be slower....:D

And most importantly when it comes to actually owning cars, not writing about them on forums, easier and cheaper to repair, maintain, daily drive, fill up with gas, use at the track... etc.

[Ferrer]

And most importantly when it comes to actually owning cars, not writing about them on forums, easier and cheaper to repair, maintain, daily drive, fill up with gas, use at the track... etc.
Except that the world isn't America.

Here a Corvette will be as exotic as a Maserati, if not more.

[Kitdy]

Here I think the main issue facing the vette internationally is not lack of performance though, nor mpg, nor handling, even interior now.

[Ferrer]

Here I think the main issue facing the vette internationally is not lack of performance though, nor mpg, nor handling, even interior now.
MPG is, since it's not quite as frugal as a "normal" European sportscar. Then there's the badge, the non-implementation of the Corvette image/history in Europe (that's the same that happens with Cadillac) and finally the price.

Unfortunately for us the Corvette here isn't the same bargain supercar that is in North America. The Camaro is suffering the same fate.

[RacingManiac]

MPG is, since it's not quite as frugal as a "normal" European sportscar.


I dunno....
C7 Vette: "Up to 26 MPG Highway", 450bhp

EPA MPG City/Highway
BMW M3 14/20 414bhp
Porsche 911 Carrera S: 19/27 400bhp
Audi RS5 16/23 450bhp

[Ferrer]

I dunno....
C7 Vette: "Up to 26 MPG Highway", 450bhp

EPA MPG City/Highway
BMW M3 14/20 414bhp
Porsche 911 Carrera S: 19/27 400bhp
Audi RS5 16/23 450bhp
You see, according to us commie Euros things go like this:

Corvette Grand Sport C6 (our base Corvette) 13,6l/100km (Automatic: 12,6l/100km)

Cars that use less fuel include:

Lamborghini Gallardo LP550-2 13,3l/100km
Ferrari 458 Italia 13,3l/100km
Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG GT 13,2l/100km
Audi R8 V10 13,1l/100km
Aston Martin V8 Vantage 12,6l/100km
BMW M3 Coupé 12,4l/100km
Jaguar XKR-S 12,3l/100km
Nissan GT-R 11,8l/100km
McLaren MP4-12C 11,7l/100km
Porsche 911 (997) Turbo S 11,4l/100km
Bentley Continental GT V8 10,6l/100km
Mercedes-Benz CL 63 AMG 10,5l/100km
BMW M6 Coupé 9,9l/100km
Lotus Evora S 9,9l/100km
Porsche 911 Carrera S 8,7l/100km

So I don't know maybe we don't know how to drive the old Chevy...

[culver]

You see, according to us commie Euros things go like this:

Corvette Grand Sport C6 (our base Corvette) 13,6l/100km (Automatic: 12,6l/100km)

Cars that use less fuel include:

Lamborghini Gallardo LP550-2 13,3l/100km
Ferrari 458 Italia 13,3l/100km
Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG GT 13,2l/100km
Audi R8 V10 13,1l/100km
Aston Martin V8 Vantage 12,6l/100km
BMW M3 Coupé 12,4l/100km
Jaguar XKR-S 12,3l/100km
Nissan GT-R 11,8l/100km
McLaren MP4-12C 11,7l/100km
Porsche 911 (997) Turbo S 11,4l/100km
Bentley Continental GT V8 10,6l/100km
Mercedes-Benz CL 63 AMG 10,5l/100km
BMW M6 Coupé 9,9l/100km
Lotus Evora S 9,9l/100km
Porsche 911 Carrera S 8,7l/100km

So I don't know maybe we don't know how to drive the old Chevy...

It does seem odd that the mileage ratings are so different. However, the magazine reviews in the US typically show the Corvette matching the other high power sports cars. Really I could see the Corvette not beating the better cars on that list but the guzzlers like the Lamborghini or Ferrari? I don't buy it. It's possible that the Euro test cycle doesn't allow GM to use the skip shift feature or something else. Either way, if you look at forums and magazine reviews in the US it's clear the Corvette does deliver good mileage for it's class.
My brother drove a C6 cross country and got over 28mpg the whole time. The idea that the basic Corvette gets worse mileage I think would have to be based on a test cycle that perhaps doesn't allow the car to get into a high gear as quickly as it can thus hurting the mileage of the car. Either way in real life the car delivers and many reviews and owners have noted the car's good mileage.

[Ferrer]

It does seem odd that the mileage ratings are so different. However, the magazine reviews in the US typically show the Corvette matching the other high power sports cars. Really I could see the Corvette not beating the better cars on that list but the guzzlers like the Lamborghini or Ferrari? I don't buy it. It's possible that the Euro test cycle doesn't allow GM to use the skip shift feature or something else. Either way, if you look at forums and magazine reviews in the US it's clear the Corvette does deliver good mileage for it's class.
My brother drove a C6 cross country and got over 28mpg the whole time. The idea that the basic Corvette gets worse mileage I think would have to be based on a test cycle that perhaps doesn't allow the car to get into a high gear as quickly as it can thus hurting the mileage of the car. Either way in real life the car delivers and many reviews and owners have noted the car's good mileage.
I think that EDM Corvettes don't have the Skip Shift feature fitted. When we used to get the standard (i.e. not the widebody Grand Sport) coupe and convertible they also got the Z51 option fitted as standard.

[culver]

For the US, all manual Corvettes have the skip shift feature. I could see them disabling it for Europe (easy to do) but all the US manuals have it. Either way, the Corvette, when driven conservatively will deliver mileage that few similar sports cars can match.

[NSXType-R]

The Corvette should look similar to the Camaro. They are made by the same company. All major manufacturers display brand continuity... Look at Benz or Ford. Anyone saying the Rapide is just a big DB? Im laughing at GM for telling me that I can afford a new if I could afford a 2013. Huge generalizations!!!

It's one thing to have the brand recognition- Audis have similar grills and headlamps, but they don't make it look tacky. Acuras have been terrible at integrating that beak into all their cars and have made it smaller and smaller with each new car.

And Corvettes have always had round tail lights, even the GT-R had it. Yes, pop up headlamps went away, but that was more of a safety regulation thing, not a stylistic flair.

[Cyco]

The Corvettes do roughly the claimed fuel consumption numbers.

Not sure anyone has ever matched the official consumption figure for an AMV8 or a 458...

[Kitdy]

This argument can be ended by saying that Europe is full of communists, and America is full of freedom. 'Murica!

But seriously folks, the Corvette does get pretty good MPG in tests. I am too lazy to crack open the R and T database right now, but I doubt that the Gallardo SLS, 458, maybe even 12C get the same real mpg as a Vette. Freedom reigns!

I just had a thought: if the Nordic countries are socialism lite, is Canada socialism lite lite?

[Ferrer]

This argument can be ended by saying that Europe is full of communists, and America is full of freedom. 'Murica!

But seriously folks, the Corvette does get pretty good MPG in tests. I am too lazy to crack open the R and T database right now, but I doubt that the Gallardo SLS, 458, maybe even 12C get the same real mpg as a Vette. Freedom reigns!

I just had a thought: if the Nordic countries are socialism lite, is Canada socialism lite lite?
Nevermind MPG. We have pretty much no dealers, no one's ever heard of the SBC and a base Corvette costs 90.000€ (about $120,000, and that's in Spain wait 'til someone in the North comes along...).

I think we'll have to stick we commie hatchbacks and diesel engines.

[Kitdy]

Nevermind MPG. We have pretty much no dealers, no one's ever heard of the SBC and a base Corvette costs 90.000€ (about $120,000, and that's in Spain wait 'til someone in the North comes along...).

This is more what I was alluding to with my original comment. The Corvette could make sense in Europe (minus snobby feelings over an American sportscar). The issue is the mad price, lack of dealers, image, etc., not performance, handling, and fuel economy.

[Matra et Alpine]

Handling will always be an issue limiting it's sales as too many small twisty and busy roads in old Europe make the car less than ideal. 90% of the handling issues raised aren't really "snobby" :) Just seen that way if you've not driven our roads. You've seen some of them, would you driver a long bonnet, wide stance car and enjoy it ?

They would need to have a distribution and service trained network for launch and the risk too high to get the volumes to warrant it .... UNLESS they upped the price to match those of other cars that sell in low numbers and whose customers expect "dealer level" servicing. Up the price and it's not so attractive :( ( I was lucky to be at the Viper European launch and talk to the marketeers, dealers and journos. This was seen as the biggest issue for them with the Viper :(

[NSXType-R]

Nevermind MPG. We have pretty much no dealers, no one's ever heard of the SBC and a base Corvette costs 90.000€ (about $120,000, and that's in Spain wait 'til someone in the North comes along...).

I think we'll have to stick we commie hatchbacks and diesel engines.

What is a SBC?


This is more what I was alluding to with my original comment. The Corvette could make sense in Europe (minus snobby feelings over an American sportscar). The issue is the mad price, lack of dealers, image, etc., not performance, handling, and fuel economy.

Its size and width may be a big issue. Is it much wider than most other sports cars? From what I see, the SLS looks pretty massive itself. Sure it's not in the same price point, but the SL class isn't tiny either.

[Ferrer]

This is more what I was alluding to with my original comment. The Corvette could make sense in Europe (minus snobby feelings over an American sportscar). The issue is the mad price, lack of dealers, image, etc., not performance, handling, and fuel economy.
In a continent where we have cars like the Scirocco TDI, the TT TDI, the RCZ HDI or the SLK250 CDI, despite being good for the performance the fuel economy doesn't help either.

It't the same problem the Camaro has.

Handling will always be an issue limiting it's sales as too many small twisty and busy roads in old Europe make the car less than ideal. 90% of the handling issues raised aren't really "snobby" :) Just seen that way if you've not driven our roads. You've seen some of them, would you driver a long bonnet, wide stance car and enjoy it ?

They would need to have a distribution and service trained network for launch and the risk too high to get the volumes to warrant it .... UNLESS they upped the price to match those of other cars that sell in low numbers and whose customers expect "dealer level" servicing. Up the price and it's not so attractive :( ( I was lucky to be at the Viper European launch and talk to the marketeers, dealers and journos. This was seen as the biggest issue for them with the Viper :(
But that's not handling, it's size, which I agree doesn't help either. It's a problem that is plaguing european cars as well though, which are becoming just too big to be enjoyable on the right roads.

And this is very clear under the one Ford strategy. Their cars are just becoming too big to be comfortable in European roads and cities.

What is a SBC?
Small Block Chevy.

[Kitdy]

Handling will always be an issue limiting it's sales as too many small twisty and busy roads in old Europe make the car less than ideal. 90% of the handling issues raised aren't really "snobby" :) Just seen that way if you've not driven our roads. You've seen some of them, would you driver a long bonnet, wide stance car and enjoy it ?

They would need to have a distribution and service trained network for launch and the risk too high to get the volumes to warrant it .... UNLESS they upped the price to match those of other cars that sell in low numbers and whose customers expect "dealer level" servicing. Up the price and it's not so attractive :( ( I was lucky to be at the Viper European launch and talk to the marketeers, dealers and journos. This was seen as the biggest issue for them with the Viper :(


In a continent where we have cars like the Scirocco TDI, the TT TDI, the RCZ HDI or the SLK250 CDI, despite being good for the performance the fuel economy doesn't help either.

It't the same problem the Camaro has.

But that's not handling, it's size, which I agree doesn't help either. It's a problem that is plaguing european cars as well though, which are becoming just too big to be enjoyable on the right roads.

And this is very clear under the one Ford strategy. Their cars are just becoming too big to be comfortable in European roads and cities.

Small Block Chevy.

Yeah, the big Euro high money sportscars are big as hell too. Problem: the Vette does not have the image associated with a say, Lamborghini, Ferrari, SLS, to compete on that level.

The dealer/repair issue you mention is a lot of what I was thinking being a huge hurdle to clear.

[Ferrer]

Yeah, the big Euro high money sportscars are big as hell too. Problem: the Vette does not have the image associated with a say, Lamborghini, Ferrari, SLS, to compete on that level.

The dealer/repair issue you mention is a lot of what I was thinking being a huge hurdle to clear.
If it was priced to compete with the Boxster, SLK and Z4 it would probably be far more successful. Against heavyweights like a 911 or an XK? Not so much.

[RacingManiac]

In US its about that price bracket, being an export its much harder to do, especially Vette is still not a "world car" for GM....

I think this can compete with a XK or something though. It can be competitive at a point of being more driver oriented vs the GT of a XK. 911 its a much harder proposition....

Who knows, maybe a Vette can be an alternative to something like a TVR....a more refined version of a similar formula...

[Kitdy]

If it was priced to compete with the Boxster, SLK and Z4 it would probably be far more successful. Against heavyweights like a 911 or an XK? Not so much.

The Corvette is more of a sportscar than either of those in their base forms, as you know, especially with the 911 getting more GTey by the day.


In US its about that price bracket, being an export its much harder to do, especially Vette is still not a "world car" for GM....

I think this can compete with a XK or something though. It can be competitive at a point of being more driver oriented vs the GT of a XK. 911 its a much harder proposition....

Who knows, maybe a Vette can be an alternative to something like a TVR....a more refined version of a similar formula...

I don't think the Corvette will sell well outside these shores. I don't think that matters.

[RacingManiac]

Well it matters to GM that Corvette needs to sell more period....C6 sales was falling which was the reason why GM went to a less conventional design to see if it can garner more sales from the less likely buyers. Though as you say though that's probably still limited to the people in NA....

The first mention of the C7 is still done with jest in the new Top Gear UK episode tonight...though TBH talks like that from the Brits is hard to be taken seriously considering their car industry(or any reputation of it) is nonexistent these days...

[NSXType-R]

If it was priced to compete with the Boxster, SLK and Z4 it would probably be far more successful. Against heavyweights like a 911 or an XK? Not so much.


The Corvette is more of a sportscar than either of those in their base forms, as you know, especially with the 911 getting more GTey by the day.



I don't think the Corvette will sell well outside these shores. I don't think that matters.

Price wise it's about the same no? Maybe not so much in Europe as there are smaller displacement motors in the SLK and Z4, but here they little roadsters start off at around $50,000 anyway.

[Ferrer]

Price wise it's about the same no? Maybe not so much in Europe as there are smaller displacement motors in the SLK and Z4, but here they little roadsters start off at around $50,000 anyway.
Well...

370Z -> 46k €
Boxster -> 54k €
Z4 35i -> 55k €
Z4 35is -> 67k €
Boxster S -> 69k €
TT RS Plus -> 72k €
Cayman S -> 74k €
Exige S -> 77k €
SLK 55 AMG -> 85k €
Evora S -> 85k €
Corvette Grand Sport -> 88k €
911 Carrera -> 101k €
GT-R -> 106k €
Corvette Z06 -> 109k €

[NSXType-R]

Wow. Euro pricing is terrible on the Corvette.

Oh, and SBC was such an obvious acronym! I am embarrassed.

[Matra et Alpine]

RM, don't confuse TopGear with British motoring journalism :)

Ferrer if it is matched up against the Boxter et al in your list then the handling (aka size and placement on the road to get round tight corners safely and quickly ) will condemn it :( It will sell well to owners who like big Jags, Ferraris, Astons etc.

BUT, the badge just does not have the kudos. Like Renault dropping Alpine and then wondering why hardly anyone bought an A610 when it was better handling and performing than the 911 of the day. You could own a better "RENAULT" or spend £1K more and have a Porsche badge !! Guess what..... So it's not a "American sportscar" thing really, it's brand image and the 'Vette is stuck until a generation of drivers die off who remembered the bad :(

Second hand sales prices make a huge difference to sales success too and there just isn't big enough market imho in Europe for it other than a low volume import :( Shame :(

[RacingManiac]

I don't confuse TG with actual press, but TG has much wider reach than your typical media, and they just perpetuate the silly stereotypes....

[Matra et Alpine]

True RM, but for anyone who would be in the market for a 'Vette then TG tv show is the last place they consider :) I agree the reach in to the 15 y'o kiddies market is high ! But they aren't buyers.

[RacingManiac]

They are going to be buyers in a decades' time though....in time for C9 or something rather....And be in the demographic that GM probably wants...Well maybe 2 decades...

[culver]

So why do we think that the Corvette cost so much more in Europe? Is the a GM chose to price it like that sort of thing? Is the car not imported by GM but perhaps under some odd, old contract (this is true of Toyota in the Southeast US)? Is this a case of tariffs and other duties trying to increase the cost of imports? The C7 is reportedly designed to meet the rules of the road in all left hand drive countries so it's not a bunch of conversion for Europe type costs.

[Kitdy]

So why do we think that the Corvette cost so much more in Europe? Is the a GM chose to price it like that sort of thing? Is the car not imported by GM but perhaps under some odd, old contract (this is true of Toyota in the Southeast US)? Is this a case of tariffs and other duties trying to increase the cost of imports? The C7 is reportedly designed to meet the rules of the road in all left hand drive countries so it's not a bunch of conversion for Europe type costs.

Communism?

[pimento]

Niche volumes require higher profit margins to justify training up the dealer networks, maintaining stock of parts etc, potentially because they feel they can even, that sort of thing.

[Ferrer]

Ferrer if it is matched up against the Boxter et al in your list then the handling (aka size and placement on the road to get round tight corners safely and quickly ) will condemn it :( It will sell well to owners who like big Jags, Ferraris, Astons etc.

BUT, the badge just does not have the kudos. Like Renault dropping Alpine and then wondering why hardly anyone bought an A610 when it was better handling and performing than the 911 of the day. You could own a better "RENAULT" or spend £1K more and have a Porsche badge !! Guess what..... So it's not a "American sportscar" thing really, it's brand image and the 'Vette is stuck until a generation of drivers die off who remembered the bad :(

Second hand sales prices make a huge difference to sales success too and there just isn't big enough market imho in Europe for it other than a low volume import :( Shame :(
I don't disagree that the Boxster is in a bit of a class of its own, but all the others are either boulevardiers (SLK, Z4) or cheap sportscars with a whiff of musclecar-ness about them (the 370Z). So no problems in terms of handling or pace on that aspect.

The biggest nail in its coffin, though, aren't the 6 cylinder versions but the SLK 55 AMG. True it comes with cloth seats and halogen headlamps, but it has a big V8, folding metal roof and it is a Benz.

It's the same problem the Camaro has in Europe. The size is even worse, but if it was priced to compete against high level hot hatches it might work. Against entry level sportscars? Not so much, since if you are going to buy an impractical car with abysmal fuel consumption it may as well be a BMW or a Porsche.

So why do we think that the Corvette cost so much more in Europe? Is the a GM chose to price it like that sort of thing? Is the car not imported by GM but perhaps under some odd, old contract (this is true of Toyota in the Southeast US)? Is this a case of tariffs and other duties trying to increase the cost of imports? The C7 is reportedly designed to meet the rules of the road in all left hand drive countries so it's not a bunch of conversion for Europe type costs.
Aside from the lack of dealer network and service network (as I said the SBC here is as exotic as a Lamborgihini V12 engine) the volumes do not justify competing on price.

It's the same problem that affects the Camaro or the new Cadillac saloons. They are good cars, and might even work in Europe (with some adjustments) but first of all you'd have to overcome all the image problems they have. So since there's no point in competing on price because you are going to sell three a year you might as well at least get some nice profit on the (few) cars you sell.

Europe has to be one of the most recalcitrant, difficult and annoying automotive markets in the world...

[culver]

What you are suggesting then is that GM sets the price high, not that say Europe has some import duties which force up the price (this would be true in say Korea).

[Ferrer]

What you are suggesting then is that GM sets the price high, not that say Europe has some import duties which force up the price (this would be true in say Korea).
Let's look at it this way (for ease of calculation I've taken a straight USD to EUR).

The Cayman S increases its price by 56% from the US to Spain, while the Corvette Grand Sport increases its price between the same countries in 109%. They are sold under the same tax rates in Spain, so it can't be that.

[Matra et Alpine]

Expectation and after sale service and support from a "dealer network" is higher in the UK than in US for sure - can't speak for all of Europe but most of it is likewise. So you need to fill a parts delivery chain with items and train techs and assign forecourt dealer space. None of that comes cheap :( IF they could predict selling 100,000 cars then it could be justified, but without it you have to set a price on the volume expected to sell that covers the costs of import and operating the support network. Thus it gets crucified and price has to be higher to pay for it.

The likes of hot hatches are on a win here as they piggy-back the massive distribution and dealer network selling 10,000 a month ! In the UK at least nobody with an interest in cars would go near a Chevrolet dealer or trust them to properly maintain anything beyond a cheap 3 door A-B car :( So they face higher costs here to break the barriers the Daewoo absorption created.

comments like "communism" are the funniest so far :)

Minimum 'tax' in Europe added is VAT which is 20% in the UK ( equivalent of sales tax ).
SOME European states heavily tax luxury and low mpg cars in attempts to reduce emissions. UK uses an annual road tax to do that ( £500 for the worst offenders - so not a big issue here )

[crisis]

Doesn't work for me. Too much "wannabe European supercar look" about it.

'Vettes should look like 'Vettes !!

I have to agree. It looks great but it doesn't look enough like a Vette. GM have managed to morph the original design and still keep a signature look over the years much like Porsche but the headlights for me are the problem, extending back so far an all.

[crisis]

Wow. Euro pricing is terrible on the Corvette.



And Australia. :(