Alpine LMP2 launch

[Matra et Alpine]

The new livery has been announced.

The car is still signatech/Nissan for now it seems :(
( Wouter, you not received a release on this and get us some inside info ? )

Following the recent announcement on March 8 of its entry for both the 2013 Le Mans 24 Hours and this year’s European Le Mans Series, Signatech-Alpine today presented the endurance racing prototype that will defend Alpine’s colours this season at L’Atelier Renault in Paris, France.

The N°36 Alpine will make its first track appearance at the official ELMS test days at Paul Ricard, France, on March 26-27.
It was a little less than 35 years ago that the 1978 Le Mans 24 Hours-winning Alpine-Renault A442B paraded down the Champs-Elysées in front of a cheering crowd who turned out to show their appreciation for the car’s success in the hands of Jean-Pierre Jaussaud and Didier Pironi. Today, the Parisian public and visitors to the French capital have another chance to discover the A442B, since it is one of the centrepieces of the ‘No Limit!’ exhibition which is currently running at L’Atelier Renault (until April 7).
The Champs Elysees premises consequently provided the ideal backdrop for the revelation of the new Alpine prototype which is poised to compete in this year’s endurance racing season. Société des Automobiles Alpine-Caterham’s CEO Bernard Ollivier and Philippe Sinault, Signatech-Alpine Team Principal, lifted the veil to reveal a striking blue and orange livery which recalls the colours sported by the Alpines which raced at Le Mans some five decades ago.
“Since the announcement of Alpine’s revival on November 5 last year, we have been moving forward step by step,” said Bernard Ollivier. “The unveiling of this splendid car marks the beginning of another phase. It will turn a wheel for the first time very soon, and its maiden race will follow shortly afterwards. The news of our endurance racing programme received a very positive welcome, not only from diehard Alpine enthusiasts, but also from the world of motor racing in general. We can hardly wait to see our brand’s colours in action!”
“I am extremely proud to be representing Alpine, but it as an honour which goes hand in hand with significant responsibilities,” noted Philippe Sinault. “The next step is to take the car to Paul Ricard where our work will begin in earnest. Our aim is to be competitive in endurance racing’s highly competitive LMP2 class. We will use the different test sessions that are planned, as well as the first two rounds of the ELMS, to prepare for June’s Le Mans 24 Hours which is clearly the focal point of the season.”
The drivers who have been named to share the N°36 Alpine-Renault form a blend of experience and youth, and all three are keen to get behind its wheel. Nelson Panciatici, 24, and Pierre Ragues, 29, who were confirmed at the time of the programme’s original announcement, will be joined for the Le Mans 24 Hours by 34-year old Tristan Gommendy. The three Frenchmen all rose up through the ranks of Renault’s single-seater formulae and, between them, total 10 previous participations in the world’s most famous motor race. Another French youngster, Paul-Loup Chatin, has been chosen as the car’s reserve driver.
Renault Press

[Wouter Melissen]

The car is an Oreca 03 LMP2 chassis with a Zytek developed Nissan engine, so the package is identical to the one raced by Signatech during the last two seasons.

[Matra et Alpine]

I've seen another report that stated the chassis was "Alpine", but like you was lead to believe it was signatech's Oreca. Wondered if there had been a change of heart, if Alpien were doing some mods to it ... or as suspect it's another Renauld badge engineering BS :(

[RacingManiac]

Supposedly Renault is getting into P2 engine business(badged as Alpine) to directly compete with Nissan's in the same business(also rumor Nissan might be back in a P1 at some point). At this point it makes no sense to come out with a new car in 2013 since the big rule shuffle is next year...

[Ferrer]

I'm betting on marketing stunt for the reintroduction of Alpine road cars.

[Kitdy]

The badge job doesn't bother me. Amazing livery.

[Chernaudi]

It's just Alpine (owned by Renault) rebadging the Oreca 03 LMP2 car (same tub as the Oreca 01 LMP1, Oreca 09 FLM/LMPC, and Courage LC70/75 LMP1 and LMP2 car), and the same Nissan VK45 based ex-Super GT 4.5 V8 (Nissan is majority owned by Renault).

It's just Renault trying to get back into sportscar racing on a budget and using what they have at hand now, and as a marketing exercise because Renault is about to re-launch Alpine as a brand and a performance division of Renault, sort of like what RenaultSport is now, and and Nismo is to Nissan.

And why not--it's worked for Renault putting their name on the Lotus-Renualt F1 team (where they're an engine supplier and minority owner), and putting Infiniti as a sponsor of Red Bull Racing in F1 (Infiniti is the luxury division of Nissan in North America, Europe, and Austral-Asia--I don't know if that applies in Japan, where the Infiniti G is/was sold as the Nissan Skyline, and the Infiniti M is/was sold as the Nissan Fuga).

It also worked for Nissan/Renault and Michelin with the Delta Wing--All Nissan and Michelin did was put their sponsorship on the car (the DW's engine wasn't even really a Nissan engine--it was a modified RML Chevy Cruze WTCC engine), and they got notoriety and press for minimum money expenditure; Michelin probably spends more (or as much) being an associate sponsor for Audi Sport and Toyota Motorsport GmbH in the WEC than they spent on the DW.

In the case of Nissan/Renault, you can rip on Carlos Ghosn for being stingy with money when it comes to Nissan's and Renault's racing programs, but he's obviously a smart business man and knows how to work a little bit of sponsorship a long way in terms of getting his brands in the news.

[Ferrer]

It's just Renault trying to get back into sportscar racing on a budget and using what they have at hand now, and as a marketing exercise because Renault is about to re-launch Alpine as a brand and a performance division of Renault, sort of like what RenaultSport is now, and and Nismo is to Nissan.
RenaultSport is Alpine. They actually build their cars (or are newer RSs built alongside their "normal" counterparts?) in Alpine's old Dieppe factory.

And why not--it's worked for Renault putting their name on the Lotus-Renualt F1 team (where they're an engine supplier and minority owner), and putting Infiniti as a sponsor of Red Bull Racing in F1 (Infiniti is the luxury division of Nissan in North America, Europe, and Austral-Asia--I don't know if that applies in Japan, where the Infiniti G is/was sold as the Nissan Skyline, and the Infiniti M is/was sold as the Nissan Fuga).
The Lotus team was built on the foundations of the old Renault F1 team.

[Kitdy]

Go Toleman!

[Matra et Alpine]

Chernaudi, Ghosn and co decided that they could sell more "performance" cars by utilising the great Gordini reputation.
They proceeded to stick 2 white stripes on mediocre blue cars with mediocre performance and made Gordini a laughing stock of a name. So bad they've now dropped it and moved on to (hopefully not) destroy Alpine the same way :(
Sadly, I don't see the road going Alpine will match the market leaders and so the risk is another Caterham failed design but this time ruin a great reputation.
Like the 21, they've shown it early and promised it and by the time it comes others will have surpassed what if currently offers ( as some do already )

[Kitdy]

Wouldn't it be funny if Alpine, RenaultSport, and Gordini were all offered at the same time?

Oh, teh lolz.

You could have the GARS Megane!

[LTSmash]

Supposedly Renault is getting into P2 engine business(badged as Alpine) to directly compete with Nissan's in the same business(also rumor Nissan might be back in a P1 at some point).

What about this alliance that Renault and Nissan have? Isn't this some sort of conflict?

[Kitdy]

What about this alliance that Renault and Nissan have? Isn't this some sort of conflict?

VAG is going to battle itself at Le Mans, and it does in various limited capacities with the GT3 and R8 already. Yes, I phrased the first part of that sentence intentionally.

I think Renault-Nissan-Dacia-Infiniti are trying to get the maximal exposure for each brand spending cheap dollars (save Infiniti Red Bull Racing Renault).

Badging a car Renault-Alpine in P2 and having a bunch of other privateers running Nissan engines and GT Academy and its grads going all over the world ain't a bad idea to me.

[RacingManiac]

In the case of Nissan/Renault, you can rip on Carlos Ghosn for being stingy with money when it comes to Nissan's and Renault's racing programs, but he's obviously a smart business man and knows how to work a little bit of sponsorship a long way in terms of getting his brands in the news.

Even smarter would be doubling the return on investement...

Renault to return to Le Mans | Racecar Engineering (http://www.racecar-engineering.com/news/renault-to-return-to-le-mans/)

[Ferrer]

Chernaudi, Ghosn and co decided that they could sell more "performance" cars by utilising the great Gordini reputation.
They proceeded to stick 2 white stripes on mediocre blue cars with mediocre performance and made Gordini a laughing stock of a name. So bad they've now dropped it and moved on to (hopefully not) destroy Alpine the same way :(
I disagree on one part only. The Twingo RS is a superb performance car.

Other than that, yes, the shameless pillage of an historic name by the Regie is sad.

What about this alliance that Renault and Nissan have? Isn't this some sort of conflict?


VAG is going to battle itself at Le Mans, and it does in various limited capacities with the GT3 and R8 already. Yes, I phrased the first part of that sentence intentionally.

I think Renault-Nissan-Dacia-Infiniti are trying to get the maximal exposure for each brand spending cheap dollars (save Infiniti Red Bull Racing Renault).

Badging a car Renault-Alpine in P2 and having a bunch of other privateers running Nissan engines and GT Academy and its grads going all over the world ain't a bad idea to me.
PSA also used to compete against itself in the WRC and now is losing 5 american billions of commie-euros a year.

Are those two circumstances related?

[RacingManiac]

I think PSA has other problem more than racing against itself...

[Matra et Alpine]

I disagree on one part only. The Twingo RS is a superb performance car.
It's a fine car, not a Corsa Nurbugring tho :) nor a Suzuki Swift

However, the GORDINI RS is in Renaults own words

Also available with the Gordini label . Twingo Gordini R.S. boasts immediately recognizable styling, with 17-inch diamond effect black wheels, leather upholstery and climate control. Inimitably sporty and chic with its two stripes, Twingo Gordini R.S. is now available with a new grey interior ambience, alongside the existing blue, for all exterior body colours: Malta Blue, Glacier White, Pearlescent Black or Vif Red. New Twingo Gordini R.S. adds a touch of sophistication to the appeal of Renault Sport.
Note, Gordini, famous for engine tuning and chassis handling are now demoted to being a "label" for "chic" looks :( :(

[Ferrer]

It's a fine car, not a Corsa Nurbugring tho :) nor a Suzuki Swift
Haven't driven the Opel or the Suzuki, but with the Cup chassis the Twingo is as good as a Mk1 Cooper S BMW, and that's about the best front wheel drive carI've ever driven.

It was also a bargain. I was offered one for 14.900€ (£12,630) but in the end decided I preferred rear wheel drive (And thank god I did, I think that the Renault would've been even worse on day to day basis than the Mazda).

However, the GORDINI RS is in Renaults own words

Note, Gordini, famous for engine tuning and chassis handling are now demoted to being a "label" for "chic" looks :( :(
Agree.

I think what they wanted to do is pull an Abarth. The problem is that, unlike Fiat, Renault already offered superb high performance models, so Gordinis were limited to aesthetic modifications, ruining everything in the process.

I'd also add that Abarth survives alone on the cuteness of the 500. The Abarth 500 is quite a bad car and Abarth Puntos are hardly seen at all...

[Matra et Alpine]

Even in standard trim the Swift is a fast car on the 'Ring. With simple suspension mods MUCH better than the Clio F1 R27 available !! I was surprised by the quality of the chassis in the Swift - I went in biased :) We had a press release Corsa 'Ring to Doune sprint where the journo was given permission to "compete". He didn't hang about !!

Havne't had chance to push a Twingo but it wasn't a happy ride on bumpy roads at "normal" speeds :(
So I think it would very much depend on the intended use - as it always does :)
Yeah I was disappointed at what "Abarth" added to the 500 when my daughter was buying the cinque'. The salesman was noob to and couldn't understand why I was asking if there was an option to latch the boot open by a few inches :) :)

[Ferrer]

Even in standard trim the Swift is a fast car on the 'Ring. With simple suspension mods MUCH better than the Clio F1 R27 available !! I was surprised by the quality of the chassis in the Swift - I went in biased :) We had a press release Corsa 'Ring to Doune sprint where the journo was given permission to "compete". He didn't hang about !!

Havne't had chance to push a Twingo but it wasn't a happy ride on bumpy roads at "normal" speeds :(
So I think it would very much depend on the intended use - as it always does :)
Yeah I was disappointed at what "Abarth" added to the 500 when my daughter was buying the cinque'. The salesman was noob to and couldn't understand why I was asking if there was an option to latch the boot open by a few inches :) :)
You see, I'm not interested in outright speed. I want a car that communicates with me and that I can have fun with. The last tenth of a second is irrelevant to me. :)

I always remember when I drove an XF 4.2 and subsequently an A6 3.2 Quattro. The Audi was as fast (possibly faster, even with a 45bhp power deficit) as the big Jag, but the big Jag was the driver's car. It asked to be driven, not just a point-and-shoot game as was the Audi. I'm looking for "Jaguars" in my cars.

That's why I found the Twingo satisfying. Fine steering, agile, nimble, and with a collaborative rear axle (altough I admit it must not be the most comfortable car in the world...). Old-school revvy normally aspirated engine and a fine gearbox. The Abarth was none of that and it had a stupid bouncy ride.

Swift looks interesting, but Corsa 'Ring far too expensive and radical for me.

[Matra et Alpine]

With you on the feedback that makes a great car.

Still with the RX-8 for that reason :) :) Still not found anything as much connection without spending lots .... and that definately did NOT include an Evora which is disappointing from Lotus :)

I went into a Swift expecting FWD junk and was taken aback. MUCH better than a Mini imho and cheaper :)

[Man of Steel]

Abarth Puntos are hardly seen at all...

Since launch of the Abarth Punto Evo in 2010 I saw exactly two, from which one was on a carshow. I can hardly believe they sold more, they are extremely rare on the road. I like it and end of 2011 I even considered buying it, but the car was too new and the prices were ridicilous (they still are), well above 20K in Euro's. Would you opt for the Essesse kit (boost to 180 hp, lowered shocks and better brakes) via the official Abarth dealer you have to bring another 3K.

What also was a letdown is that they only sell it via the Abarth network which is even more limited then finding a refridgerator in the midst of the desert. Even for 'everything besides regular maintenance' I would have to drive 1,5 hours to nearest service point.

When I think of it, I am glad I did not buy it. Not for the price or servicing, but more of the image these cars bring. Basically hot hatches look just like their modest counterparts with added spoilers and big wheels but they bring a certain 'boy racer' image. I guess I grow old as I believe my 147 is a much more 'mature' and representative car, also when visiting customers for work etcetera. ;)

Third point, do I need the surplus of power which is in hot hatches? Well, 150 hp is not too much I figured and nothing special in daily traffic with fat diesels in lease cars. So next car with more power would definitely be nice. On the other hand I seldom exceed 140 km/h. In daily traffic to work it is not even possible to achieve that. I have a calm driving style, sometimes even a bit too cautious. Current car has all the comfort also when I do not feel like having my teeth rambled out when driving on roads without good paving.

[Ferrer]

Abarth also has a no-haggling policy, so the cars are sold on list prices, no discounts at all. They can be had without decals and everything, but that's almost the only point of Abarths so if you go second hand they'll all have the decals and graphics in the bodywork...

Regarding power, it is (almost) never excessive. Even if you don't drive very fast having power to get you out trouble if you need so (like a misjudged overtaking) is always reassuring. These days even city cars can hit 160km/h easily.

As for comfort I've also lately moved it up my list of wanted attributes. I think one of the problems is that many people (including those who run car makers) think that to have a good handling you must also have a preposterously stiff suspension and that said silly suspension setting make the car sporty. I say this is all a load of rubbish; a suspension that is too hard ruins everything, including handling and there are cars with superb ride comfort that also handle very well.

[pimento]

Haven't driven the Opel or the Suzuki, but with the Cup chassis the Twingo is as good as a Mk1 Cooper S BMW, and that's about the best front wheel drive carI've ever driven.

The latest Fifth Gear has a Swift/Twingo head to head, they were pretty closely matched. Swift wasn't as sharp to drive, but pulled harder. Seemed like better rubber would pretty much bring it up to par on the handling stakes, and maybe some suspension tweaks.

[jcp123]

As for comfort I've also lately moved it up my list of wanted attributes. I think one of the problems is that many people (including those who run car makers) think that to have a good handling you must also have a preposterously stiff suspension and that said silly suspension setting make the car sporty. I say this is all a load of rubbish; a suspension that is too hard ruins everything, including handling and there are cars with superb ride comfort that also handle very well.

I sort of judge cars on a spectrum...the tradeoff of ride vs. handling. I myself prefer a good ride over handling any day, but as long as there is some kind of payoff for a stiffer ride I can at least respect that.

[Ferrer]

I sort of judge cars on a spectrum...the tradeoff of ride vs. handling. I myself prefer a good ride over handling any day, but as long as there is some kind of payoff for a stiffer ride I can at least respect that.
I still put handling above, but I reckon that comfort has moved up to second probably. It also depends on the type of car and the use you are going to give it; for instance I tolerated the bed-of-nails-like ride in the Mini because in the mountains it was pretty much unbeatable and everything was set in that way, but the ride in the new A-Class or DS4 is simply unacceptable because they are not built to play with the laws of physics.

I also thing that putting a needlessly stiff suspension and big tyres does not make up for a badly designed chassis and as I said does not make a car sporty (A-Class, classic case in point) even if many manufacturers (and people) think so. I prefer a well designed chassis and then suspension settings that achieve a good compromise between ride and handling.

[Dino Scuderia]

Launched into one of the most boring classes ever in racing.

[RacingManiac]

Launched into one of the most boring classes ever in racing.

LMP2 is pretty hotly contested in EU....there are genuine OEM interest in the class with multiple engine suppliers and well funded privateers...it just never did so well in US.

[Dino Scuderia]

LMP2 is pretty hotly contested in EU....there are genuine OEM interest in the class with multiple engine suppliers and well funded privateers...it just never did so well in US.


You never see people post vids of P2 dog fights....that's what I'm getting at, the racing never seems to excite.

[Matra et Alpine]

Sadly that's usually because media is so focussed on the big spend, big image teams :(

Exception at Le Mans was Pescarolo teams over the years. The French love of him meant his cars got reasonable coverage no matter how bad :)

[LTSmash]

You never see people post vids of P2 dog fights....that's what I'm getting at, the racing never seems to excite.

Or that LMPC we have in the ALMS. Honestly, P2 was interesting when the RS Spyder's were beating the R10's for overall wins... since then it has been pretty lackluster.

[Kitdy]

I don't care much for a spec class in a MULTI CLASS RACE.

[Matra et Alpine]

If we don't kitdy then motor racing is doomed :(
Cant fill grids for big and endurance races unless they are multi class.
So please support all the classes, each brings something different to the race :)
Want to keep >100 cars on the grid(s) at the 'Ring :)

[Kitdy]

If we don't kitdy then motor racing is doomed :(
Cant fill grids for big and endurance races unless they are multi class.
So please support all the classes, each brings something different to the race :)
Want to keep >100 cars on the grid(s) at the 'Ring :)

Yes yes, that is fine. But one class in a multiclass race made of spec cars? I am not interested. Spec racing is fine in my books, but when there are other classes with different machinery in it...

[LTSmash]

Kids, this is spec racing.