Engine Swaps - Improvement or Blasphemy

[NoOne]

I've done a few engine swaps myself, but always sticking to the original manufacturer ... IE: big block chev in place of a small block chev.

I know engine swaps using engines from a different manufacturer have been popular for a while. I've seen VW Bugs with 350 chevys in them, same with Austin-Healeys.

I'm not sure if I approve of this, then again, who can argue with transplanting a 60 hp VW Bug engine for a 300+ hp small block.

Comments or opinions?

[NoOne]

This is where I can't decide whether I approve or not ....
http://web2.airmail.net/atl/Rotary.html

I have nothing against Wankel rotary engines .... but in place of Porsche's own???? :confused:

[Batmobile_Turbo]

any beetle from the 60's or earlier with a chevy 350 in it is
blasphemus. actually there's a lot you can do to beetle engines, rather than turning them into hot rods.

[Egg Nog]

Originally posted by NoOne
I have nothing against Wankel rotary engines .... but in place of Porsche's own???? :confused:

Whatever, I think it's awesome! And besides, only the cams, pistons, and cylinder heads are Porsche... the rest is a VW engine :)

I'm all in favour of engine swaps, especially original ones. As long as they don't take it too far and ruin the character of the car like a Ferarri 355 with an implanted Mopar Hemi :)

[megotmea7]

i have mixed feelings on this subject, for example its popular to transplant chevys lt1's into 1st and 2nd gen RX-7's it makes an awsome car but its not an RX-7 anymore, the best/worst example i have of this was on RX-7 forums a BIG rotary buff bought a nice ported 13b, ceramic apex seals the whole shot and sold it right when he got it to put a very extreme lt1 in there (titanium bottom end, custome EXTREMLY high flowing intake manifold, a throttle body you could put your fist thru, top of the line ported racing heads, mean cams and a t56 tranny) he weighed it and it weigh'd less that the original 13b with turbo, intecooler, tranny and accesories. made a little over 760hp n/a (he had planned on using nitrouse by integrating it into the manifold but after seeing the engine dyno results he decided he didnt need it, at the time it was the most powerful n/a second generation lt1 used in any car anywhere and as far as i know it still is. he then completely striped the chassis down to paint it and added back only what he wanted(he retained the intirior) and made it look almost completly stock it weigh'd less than 2800lbs and a perfect 50/590 weight balance, had more torque than he could have ever hope to use on such a light car, made more power than he expected and he uses it as his "weekend car" never takes it to the track or drag strip and it cant be touched by anything on the road. it is an awsome car with an awsome engine but the RX-7 as named because it is the "*R*otary e*X*periment 7" not the mazda chassied 350 powered ex-rotary RX-7 he killed the character of the car but replaced it with something awsome, like i said im torn

[megotmea7]

lol i ment "50/50" not "50/590" damn fat middle finger...

[Ghost]

It's usually best to keep it in the manufacturer unless you want to do a lot of custom work. I'm gonna try and drop a sc carrera 3.2 into my 72 911 in the next year or two depending on a few things first.

[Cappy]

Let me get this straight.

The LT1 is a decent sized iron block and it's lighter than a rotory? I don't care if the rotart has a turbo, intercooler and plumbing. What's going on here?

[megotmea7]

besides the block the whole engine was made up of either titanium or aluminum, you dont think turbos, intercoolers, wastegates, and supporting systems weigh nothing do you? the engine itself weighs very little but when you add all that stuff it starts to add up

[-datsun 1600-]

ummmmm even with the turbo etc it wouldnt weigh more its a 1300cc

[Egg Nog]

Originally posted by -datsun 1600-
ummmmm even with the turbo etc it wouldnt weigh more its a 1300cc

What? Do you think engine wieght is proportional to displacement? A Ford 302 Windsor (5.0) is more compact and lighter than a Nissan DOHC 3.5, or a Rotary, or whatever you might say...

Please explain yourself...

[megotmea7]

lmao...

[Falcon500]

This is a strange subject for me whilei love the idea of a triumph TR8 with a holden 5 liter or a windsor instead of the all alloy 3.5 job i dont like the idea of mixing DNA with american companys like putting a chev in a capri or a chev engine in a ford hotrod. Also datsun Z series go likestink with a small block chev in them we used tohave a local with a 280Z and he put a blown chev in the car it absoulty hammerd but as megotomea said this can ruin the charictor of the cars also :confused:

[fpv_gtho]

what about all the datsun 1200's with 1.8L nissan motors in them, a friend of my mums bought one not too long ago and part of the front end had to be cut out to squeeze the engine in, now the guy wants to stick a turbo motor in

[-datsun 1600-]

Well what i thought was that since the 350 is a v8 it would have more pistons and conrods=more weight while a 13B engine is only made up of only two rotor nuts rotoray housings and an eccentric shaft thats less then cams,valves,pistons,cylinders,crankshaft etc but i can see it being lighter if its made of titanium or some other light weight metal

i dont know im problay wrong just putting my knowledge to the test :D

[Egg Nog]

Nice. I find that very honourable of you to say that. Most members on these boards would try to make up some stupid fictitious BS to try to prove their point. What you posted is awesome in my books. :)

To tell you the truth, I'm not fully confident anymore now that you've brought it up :) I do know that the 302 Windsor is a more compact design, but the weights may be pretty similar though. It does weigh less than and is more compact than many/most DOHC engines of similar displacement.

[kennyknoxville]

hey megotmea7, where can i find more info on this rx7?

[megotmea7]

Well what i thought was that since the 350 is a v8 it would have more pistons and conrods=more weight while a 13B engine is only made up of only two rotor nuts rotoray housings and an eccentric shaft thats less then cams,valves,pistons,cylinders,crankshaft etc but i can see it being lighter if its made of titanium or some other light weight metal
you also take into account the turbos, piping, intercooler, cast-iron manifold with all the sequintial tid-bits, intake manifold, snakes nest of vaccum lines on top, etc.


hey megotmea7, where can i find more info on this rx7?
i posted a link in my forum (rx-7 forum on www.importforum.com) to it. for those of you to lazy to go look ill find it for you...

WARNING the thread its one is was 50 pages+ LAST time i looked at it and that was 6-8 monthes ago it is LARGE...

[megotmea7]

they also had a guy swaping a SR20DET and tranny into a FD there too ill post the link also

[megotmea7]

Hmm only 46 pages...
LINK to "V8 monstrosity" (http://www.rx7club.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=37170)

LINK to stoopid SR20 swap... (http://www.rx7club.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=129272)

[Nildo]

NB this story is lifted from ZOOM! magazine....
The ultimate argument in engine conversions.

A fellow who lived in Australia was lucky enough to own a TWR Group A Commodore. One day it was stolen and the car was susequently stripped of all it's goodies and dumped. The owner was very upset, more so when he discovered the expense involved in restoring the vehicle. Just the twin throttle bodies were quoted at $4000 to replace!

What was this luckless guy to do? Instead of replacing the 5 litre hand built motor, he instead fitted a 2JZ-GTE from the twin turbo supra. It fit very well, and with a new exhaust, intercooler and a bit of porting, tuning work and boost bleed valves fitted he scored about 250 rear wheel kilowatts, compared to the 250 engine kilowatts the car previously had.

Now some people I tell this to are disgusted, some applaud it. I sit in the middle, if that is possible. I think it was a profitable solution, and that overall the car is better for the swap. However I also think the cars original integrity was ruined. I don't think every car has this value. A standard Holden, Toyota, Nissan or whatever usually benefits from engine swaps. But in the case of something like the group A, with the legend surrounding it, I would balk at the conversion. The intangible value of owning say, a Ferrari 250 GTO is far greater than producing a better car by shoehorning a modern 360 modena V8 into it.

That's what I think anyway.

[Nildo]

Having said all that, I am currently in negotiations (with my wife!;) ) to buy an old clapped out KE corolla. I intend to strip it out, rebuild the body and a minimal interior, and fit a supercharged 4A-GZE engine into it, to use as a club car.

[Falcon500]

Id rather see the group A with its origonal motorin it although the supra motor is a fine motor indeed its just not the same....Im a true purist when it comes to genuine racing cars while group A signifies the most unpopular time in Austrlian touring car championship (ATCC) history the cars still hadmany hours of work put into them and while the cars might not have won much they still have history behind them:(
Another story this time from boost is about and orange 80smodel celica with a twin turbo quad cam lexus v8in it which cuts low 9s on the 1/4 and only set the owner back $15,000 and hes still making gainsby doing minor tweaks in it hes aiming for low 8s by the end of next year.

[fpv_gtho]

well what about the MX-5's AEC are selling with a 4.0l lexus motor fitted with a sprintex supercharger

[-datsun 1600-]

to many mx5s are getting v8ed getting a bit un-orginal but good power.

But wouldnt the weight disturbution be shocking

[Falcon500]

Much like putting a v8 in an early 60s cortina or a big block in a capri. Or like putting a 350 in a lj torana it all fits (some better then others) but no good for any real balance.

[megotmea7]

if you look at the pics of how far back the LT1 sat in the FD you wouldnt question its weight balance and besides perfect weight balance isnt required for a good handling car let alone a pure street car as the "V8 mostrosity" is i never saw what the actual ratio was but it b willing to put money on it being VERY close to 50/50