Return of Dodge, New Charger...Can we see a new Valiant?

[Luciferous]

Chrysler have confirmed (at last check) that Dodge will definately be returning to Australia sometime, and now Dodge are looking at a new Charger. With RWD architecture from past Mercs and the reintroduction of Dodge to help some more Chryslers through I reckon a resurrection of the Valiant nameplate could be the way to go. I know the idea probably isn't feasible but damn i want it to happen. Pity Chrylsers run by a bunch of retards...

[SlickHolden]

Chrysler have confirmed (at last check) that Dodge will definately be returning to Australia sometime, and now Dodge are looking at a new Charger. With RWD architecture from past Mercs and the reintroduction of Dodge to help some more Chryslers through I reckon a resurrection of the Valiant nameplate could be the way to go. I know the idea probably isn't feasible but damn i want it to happen. Pity Chrylsers run by a bunch of retards...
Hang on isn't a Aussie guy incharge of Chrysler or was that foMoCo ???

[Luciferous]

can't help you out there... but the head of chrysler australia lost his leg in a crash when a FWD hit him on his R1, thats pretty much all i know about Chrysler Australia... apart from them being a shitty little subsidiary that has a grand total of 2 products in its range

[fpv_gtho]

Jac Nasser was an Aussie and he was the previous Ford US boss....what i thinks stupid is theres a boss of all the Ford subsidies, like here, US, Brazil, Uk etc. then theres the FoMoCo boss.....but year, Jac Nasser used to be head honcho before he got the flick in 2001

[SlickHolden]

No w you would think a Aussie would do a great job over there wouldn't you ?
But he was a boof head so my bro tells me lol:D

[fpv_gtho]

well hes obviously done something wrong.....some people would probably find it hard to believe 2 people like Jacques Nasser and Geoph Polites came from the same country and ran the same country

[SlickHolden]

Yes that's very true one is a ok bloke the other is a I can't think of a nice way to say it so i'll just say what's on my mind, A Incompatant Boof head with a brain stuck in 1920 but wanted to build cars of 2010 in 1998 :Eeek:

[Blue Supra]

bring back the Valiant! my dads always nagging me to track down a Valiant type R?

[fpv_gtho]

good luck, ive never heard of them before :p

I think Open Road (NRMA) did a special once and talked to some Ford and Holden designers about what they thought the Falcon and Commodore would look like in 2010.....surprising what they came up with for the Falcon still had alot of AU influenced stuff :p

[Blue Supra]

Well i cant remember what it was exactly, ill look it up...

[Blue Supra]

Seen too many jap cars....

anyways its the Series "R" he wants... rare as friggin ducks teeth they are and cost a fortune when you find one!

[fpv_gtho]

Well i doubt it'll set him back more than a Phase3, theyre getting over $120K now

[Luciferous]

Did the R series have push button auto as well? Man, Chrylser shoudn't have ditched that.

[Blue Supra]

it did actually, i think thats half the reason he wants one:D

[fpv_gtho]

man the last time i saw a push button auto was when i got stuck standing at the front of the bus :p

[Luciferous]

Hey push button auto is one of the best ideas ever, its just that modern car makers never want to take a risk. Look at the Corvette, the C3 'Vette was arguably one of the best looking and unique cars of all time and ever since then the design has become more and more sanitised until you eventually get the C6. I don't see why we always have to rely on the French car makers for some originality once in a while

[fpv_gtho]

I think some people would argue it takes away from the experience of actually driving the car.....

[Blue Supra]

push button auto? i know it had it, but what was it exactlty? like you push a button for D and a button for R and a button for N etc?

[fpv_gtho]

i'd assume thats it.....it'd have to be pretty good for the time as it'd have to be for an electronic auto

[Blue Supra]

youd be screwed if the D button broke:p or got stuck:eek:

[fpv_gtho]

Hopefully the reliability of the system was up to scratch then :p

[Blue Supra]

hopefully....:D

[fpv_gtho]

im sure if it was really something to worry about, there'd be plenty on the net about it, or anyone who knew about them would know that theyre trouble

[Blue Supra]

mmm thats true, i think itd js ruin the driving experience though, make it too computerised, you dont even get a shifter!:o

[fpv_gtho]

yeah i know, thats exactly why i said it takes from the driving experience. like things like the sequential shifters like the BA, they can increase it. i recon paddle shifting takes away though as you can get away with just steering.....

[Blue Supra]

Tiptronic auto? sports shift? all the same crap differnt name, makes you think its a sports car when really a car thats not manual will never be a true sports car in my book.

[fpv_gtho]

well thats a common opinion held by alot of people really....a car has 3 pedals and thats not with a foot handbrake :p

[Blue Supra]

got into a Mitsu FTO today, had sports mode, wasnt impressed in the drive...

[fpv_gtho]

mitsubishi have put their tiptronic auto in a couple of things like the magna and outlander, and everyone who drives it says although its the right way around with the shift pattern for people who only own a car to drive, anyone who has fun driving says its the wrong way around........if that all makes sense :p

[Blue Supra]

hmmm
makes sense but dont think i could explain it...

[fpv_gtho]

maybe it was just a screwed up drive cause it was FWD as well :p

[Luciferous]

Yeah I still don't get why car manufacturers keep trying to sell 'sporty' FWD's. Isn't that a contradiction in itself?

Actually the push button autos in the R and S series Valiant made a name for themselves for reliability of the system. Plus it was different, and those cars were hardly sports cars, they were made for cruisin' so the drivin experience seems a bit better than the other 3 on the tree method from different companies. i'm fairly sure the system was mechanical not electrical, but beyond that i'm not sure.

[Blue Supra]

Perth man knows his stuff...
Put up an avatar buddy and show your colours:)

[fpv_gtho]

yeah, FWD have their far shair of problems when you push them to the limit, the worst kind of problems for a "sporty" or "performance" car. like you try and launch the car hard, the front's got no traction cause all the weights now on the back....great....then you try and accelerate through a corner and all it wants to do is go straight, then you lift off and it can snap into oversteer..

[Blue Supra]

zactly it, not cool... i wouldnt know how to describe that like you just did but ive seen it and had it happen so i know what you're talking bout, im a very visual learner...

[fpv_gtho]

its kinda like the first mainstream AWD systems....many people thought they'd have the benefits of FWD and RWD, but they had the disadvantages :p

[Blue Supra]

whats a disadvantage of AWD besides the weight it takes up?

[fpv_gtho]

well you cant do burnouts, which is an issue at the track cause you cant warm your tyres up. its got more power loss through the driveline which is bad coupled with the extra weight, athough is made up somewhat from its better torque distribution. i suppose its a bit harder to work under the bonnet for those who enjoy swapping engines

[Blue Supra]

oh i dunno bout burnouts... ive seen a Rexy smoke em up pretty good:D but yeh the engine swapping would be made very difficult id imagine...

[fpv_gtho]

well apparently in the US, theres a Jeep Wrangler with a 426 Hemi that does 4 wheel burnouts, so its not impossble....but a 300hp RWD will do them, a 300hp AWD wont......alot of the new AWD's have an east west engine layout like FWD which is a real shit, but the likes of Skylines still have a RWD style layout which makes it a bit easier

[Luciferous]

Hell i know a guy who pulls 4WD burnouts in converted Kingswood Overlanders....gotta love backyard mechanics...

Rear biased AWD probs has the best handling effects of all layouts (RWD AWD and FWD) when done right, like in the GTRs, 911 Turbo's, and more recently in things like the coupe4, gives the balance of RWD with the grip of AWD.
On a similar note, Yamaha's WR450F 2-Trac is the first production bike in the world to wear 2WD. Its basically their dirtbike with a hydraulic on-demand 2WD system. So hopefully it won't be long till we see Akira-style AWD motorbikes cuttin' it up on the streets as well as their AWD car cousins....

[SlickHolden]

I seen a Rex get sideways around a corner once, And i was on that corner:eek:
Todd kelly got some wheel spin out of a Avalanche XUV, But his brother didn't:D

[Blue Supra]

The avalanche is a joke but, its like adventra, you cant go 4wding in it coz it sits too low, and i think it the adventra only comes in auto:eek: low, 4wd, auto, not something to go desert duelling in:o

[anubis8221]

Adventra has to be auto because of the cross-trac system. And it's not a 4wd it's an AWD. It's not ment to go where land cruisers go.

[Blue Supra]

well that sux, i want to see a wagon that CAN go where landcruiser go dammit!:D

[fpv_gtho]

Adventra has to be auto because of the cross-trac system. And it's not a 4wd it's an AWD. It's not ment to go where land cruisers go.


Theres F all difference between the 2 though, its just in the marketing..

with the rex though, i dare say if you simply threw it into a corner with enough force it'd break traction and go sideways, but it'd pretty much be straight out of control, RWD you usually can control a slide better

[SlickHolden]

The next AWD/4WD will sit a little higher,
But the adventra and territory arn't built to go where man has not gone before lol:D

[fpv_gtho]

were saying that the 2006/7 adventra would have a unique body like the territory, but i think some people were saying with the VE being Zeta, it'd be easier said then done....

the AWD system under the 2 of them with the Bosch stability control is smart enough, but they just dont have the dimensions or the low range

[Blue Supra]

or the super cool looks that AWDs need:) like Lan Evos:p;)

[SlickHolden]

I really think the Adventra looks good, But i love the Avalanche look:D Love the rear it's nice:D

[fpv_gtho]

i think the avalanche looks worse to be honest...i reckon theres a limit they can take the aggressive AWD styling to and the Avalance just goes way beyond it..

[Colty]

I like the avalanche, and even the better the idea of a performance station wagon :D

[fpv_gtho]

personally, i think its almost as bad as the bling bling Caddy Esclades and Hummer H2's

[Colty]

Lol!!!

[Luciferous]

When the Adventra and Cross8 first came out Wheels went on a comprehensive test to cross Aus in a fleet of 3 (2 Adventras and 1 Cross8), and the terrain was enough to have Landcruisers on edge on spots. All the vehicles made it through, the only real critisism that they had was the low range from the fuel tank (5.7l of V8 aint exactly the best cross country engine), but the 4WD system and ride height help up just fine

[SlickHolden]

personally, i think its almost as bad as the bling bling Caddy Esclades and Hummer H2's
Ohhh no nothing is that bad :p

[Luciferous]

Hey who reckons that the new RR Phantom 5 should be counted as being bling?

[Blue Supra]

you couldnt take a Avalanche or a Adventra REAL 4WDing... going duning or crossing rivers... some of the depths ive seen cruisers go through would have either of those underwater!:eek: that what the snorkels on the side of 4WDs are for...one of those on either AWD wagon would lokk terrible!

[fpv_gtho]

well that'd be more rock crawling than 4 wheel driving...

on a note abot that wheels test though, theyve also taken a 911 turbo the back way up to cape york :p

[Luciferous]

Well I'm pretty sure that a Kluger, Territory or Outback probably could've made the trip, but I mean the ground clearance and AWD system work just fine

[fpv_gtho]

if your led to believe the media, Ford'll be releasing a ride height package to boost it up about half an inch to just under 200mm ground clearence. the excape has 200mm and the explorer has about 225mm just for comparisons sake, i think a cruiser has 230mm (100 series)

[Luciferous]

Well its always good when car makers take on board what the motoring journalists say, as far as i can tell the only major critiscm that theyve had of the territory has bin the ride height.

Maybe Holden should follow and fix the adventra's steering

[fpv_gtho]

well half an inch is still half of what most people wanted....although with a cruiser only at 230mm, a Tezza with about 210mm would have quite some capabilities, the trade off is increased roll so anything Ford does will more than likely NOT be at the sacrifice to handling...if they cant keep the body roll to a minimum, they'll ditch the idea of 15-20mm more ride height

[Luciferous]

You can achieve (relatively) high ride height and still keep body roll in check if you try hard enough, BMW have got it right for the X5

[fpv_gtho]

they reckon the Territory handles better than any other SUV though, including the ML, X5, X3, Cayenne and Toureg and that its become the class benchmark, but yeah with a good combo of camber, anti roll, dampers and spring rate, they should be able to figure it out

[Luciferous]

Well you'd hope so, suspension has always been one of Ford's strengths

[fpv_gtho]

whats so significant though is the Territory base prices for about $40K, i think a 3L X5 is around $70-80K so theres alot of room there to move. compared to the Adventra, $55K for an AWD Ghia Territory may be a bit of a ?, but anyone who values a car that does more than go from point A to B, may be swung from an X5 3L to the Ghia

[Luciferous]

Yeah but the X5's got a big presence in the SUV segment, its been a class leader for yonks, and if the 3L loses its position in the market BMW wont care, theres still the 3.0di, which highlights the lack of a deisel in the Territory range

[fpv_gtho]

The Territory's got 2000 sales a month now, which easily puts it as #1 in the class, in which the top 3 is filled out by the Prado and Kluger, although with only about 1000 sales each

[Luciferous]

But the Territory isnt a luxury SUV like an X5 or Toureg, so technically theyre in different class

[fpv_gtho]

thats true....BUT, the territory at least has the Ghia as a luxury model. its not the same i know, but its as close as its gunna get and the Territory's selling like hotcakes in the SUV market

[Falcon500]

But the Territory isnt a luxury SUV like an X5 or Toureg, so technically theyre in different class
What about the giah? rember not all prados and klugershave the GL/x luxuary packs and stuff.

[Luciferous]

And neither the Territory, Kluger, or Outback have a deisel or V8 option, 10 different choices of wheels nor 3 pages of options like true luxury SUV's

[fpv_gtho]

just wait though, ford have their iDesign range coming out for Falcon and Territory so that'll add some spice to the mix.

[Luciferous]

For sure, but they'd wanna give it some proper concentration, otherwise they'll end up like HBD...

[Falcon500]

And neither the Territory, Kluger, or Outback have a deisel or V8 option, 10 different choices of wheels nor 3 pages of options like true luxury SUV's
So its a prerequiset fora luxo 4x4 tohave a diesel or a v8? well thats news tome....so your normal X5 aint luxurious? or v6 statos arnt luxuary cars? and a leather equiped territory giah is not luxurious?.....

[fpv_gtho]

Well for the Territory at least, Ford's working their way around that.....its mid life update is highly likely to feature the twin turbo 2.7L V6 diesel, and perhaps by then they'll stick the XR6T engine in, perhaps retuned to offer even more low down torque

[Falcon500]

Well for the Territory at least, Ford's working their way around that.....its mid life update is highly likely to feature the twin turbo 2.7L V6 diesel, and perhaps by then they'll stick the XR6T engine in, perhaps retuned to offer even more low down torque
imagine a fpv version lol....

But retuneing it for more tourque is problythe way to go.

[Luciferous]

Well considering that every luxury 4WD on the market has either a V8 or deisel option (or both) yeah, i would say it was a prerequisite. The X5 is luxurious, it has the option of a V8 or deisel, and also has the advantage of being made by a luxury car maker. And a Statesman doesnt have a 'standard' model, its made as a luxury car straight of the bat. Theres a difference between a luxury 4WD and a 4WD with the luxury options.

[fpv_gtho]

Geoph Polites before he left laid his cards on the table and practically said nothings gunna stop him putting the turbo in there, even though the few test mules were always overheating.

[Luciferous]

That'd be the bet because theres no way in hell theyre gonna be able to cram the Boss in there for the stronger version

[fpv_gtho]

well CAPA's proven the BOSS will fit, albeit with perhaps 2mm clearance :p Ford nor FPV will risk that, and its already engineered for the I6 at the moment

[Luciferous]

how much clearance does the 6 give the engine bay?

[fpv_gtho]

well i think you can still see the ground if thats an indication....not even the BOSS in the XR8 will let you see the ground, and the suspensio in the Tezza has the suspension towers closer together.....but, its got extra deck height so no bonnet bulge needed

[Luciferous]

No kidding, i would have thought the AWD system would have got rid of any V8 aspirations for the Territory...

[fpv_gtho]

well CAPA took the RWD model, but the transfer case is just an off the shelf unit that both Ford and Holden use, and the 4 speed auto's proven behing the V8....it pretty much was down to engine bay room

[Luciferous]

Gotcha, I'd forgot there was a rear drive Tezza.... That would be a bit redundant wouldn't it? Making a performance version out of the base model, instead of the AWD one....

[fpv_gtho]

i think as long as they can get a hero model, they'll be happy, but they could do both....there'd be a market for both a RWD FPV Tezza and AWD FPV Tezza so they could capitalize on what Ford's already done

[Luciferous]

But i doubt they could cram a V8 into the AWD model, thats what i meant before.
I'm not too sure bout the rear drive hero model, its kind of defeats the point of it being a Tezza then doesn't it?

[Blue Supra]

Would you take a FPV Territory off road? I wouldnt! and i doubt very highly that anyone who buys one will, theyd retail for some stupid amount of $$$ and if you can afford to take a 4WD that costs that much off road and not worry about it getting scratched or dinged then you've got too much bloody money!:p

[Luciferous]

Oh yeah definately, but paying that much for a rear drive Tezza doesnt make sense, why not go a GT or Typhoon?

[SlickHolden]

Go the typhoon:D

[Luciferous]

I'm still a bit weird about an aussie muscle car that uses a turbo six...seems a bit wrong, but hey i bet the Chargers and XU-1's seemed a bit weird in theyre day too

[SlickHolden]

That's right, I think the word MUSCLE in U.S meens you have to have a V8, But here we are more flexable if it's got a great donk it's got muscle :D:D

[Luciferous]

Yeah at least it aint a 4

[Blue Supra]

If its got over 200kw on ANY engine, in my book it got grunt:) As for why not buy a GT or a typhoon, becasue they want that "up high" feeling you get from a 4WD (in this its not but you know what im sayin)

[SlickHolden]

Was thinking about you bluey yesterday, Seen a silver supra up the road here, Full kit very low to the ground the front was, Big wheels, Very loud sweet sound, Only problem was it was Auto:eek: All that power was robbed:(. Went good still:)

[Luciferous]

Yeah I see that Supra owners have finally picked up on the fact that Supra's have ducktails as standard so they don't need jackass giant rear wings on the back

As for the 'High driving position' anyone who buys a car for that is a jackass and should have theyre licence revoked
But in all seriousness its mainly women who want that so i cant really see them buying an FPV product, unless maybe it was a Pursuit

[Blue Supra]

As for the 'High driving position' anyone who buys a car for that is a jackass and should have theyre licence revoked


ROFL! So incredibly true!

[QUOTE=SlickHolden]
Was thinking about you bluey yesterday, Seen a silver supra up the road here, Full kit very low to the ground the front was, Big wheels, Very loud sweet sound, Only problem was it was Auto All that power was robbed. Went good still
[/QUOTE=SlickHolden]

That really pisses me off seeing that, theres onew near my work thats auto from SA!:eek: it shits me theres so many automatics goin around, there was one at the servo a few weeks ago:( sooo many autos! have the Supra boys gone crazy! or are they just suckers for the saving of 5k if you buy an auto instead on a manual! :mad:

[SlickHolden]

I really did like the note from it, Little crackle kind of but it was very loud compared to a gen3:D. Sounded a little like a skyline ? kiind of

[Luciferous]

Auto is so much easier to live with but, easier on maintenance, and if you just pose with it then its the perfect choice...

[Blue Supra]

I really did like the note from it, Little crackle kind of but it was very loud compared to a gen3:D. Sounded a little like a skyline ? kiind of

oooo yeh they have a nice note! you should hear one with a 3" pipe all the way through it at 6500rpm! i have... i was driving!:D

[SlickHolden]

I rekon he held it in first @ 4500rpm... I'm lucky cause my view is straight down the driveway into a street and down this street there are plenty of tuned up cars, They might kill me if i snap pics of them lol,, But there have been hotted up WRX, Skylines, Soarer V8TT, Now the Supra, Even a guy down there with a big fat hot dog like rear exhaust that looks straight off a Jap car, But must admit sounds bloody good:eek:

[Blue Supra]

Gotta love a Jap 6!:) At least when its been tuned not riced:p

[SlickHolden]

Fast and the furious sounds are great. Thats the kind of sound i herd from this V8TT soarer, It was awsome:eek: mind blowing:D

[Blue Supra]

i can put a V8 soarer engine in my datto apparently:D if i can, and if itll fit ill TT it:D

[SlickHolden]

Do it mate thats baby rocaks, I feel in love with the engine, But i dont much like the car :D

[Blue Supra]

yeh not so keen on the car itself but that engine is wonderful!:)
Ill need about 10k to do it, if i do engine ill need new gearbox, clutch, diff, tailshaft, brakes etc etc. 10k should cover most of it.
Sponsership anyone?:)

[SlickHolden]

Yep the car itself as a look does nothing for me, If a car move my pants:p:p Then i'll like it hahahahaha...
But that donk woohoo it is nice tuff very good V8's lexus.

[fpv_gtho]

i reckon a TTV8 lexus motor would tear your lil datto to shreds :p that is unless you were willing to prepare it fully with a rollcage front to back to keep the car straight

[Blue Supra]

oh yeh, itll get the full treatment inside it, outside im gunna leave it a scrappy POS lookin thing besides the mags, ULTIMATE SLEEPER!

guy in WRX "look at the fool in the datto, lol what a wanker, rev rev"
me " *smiles knowingly* "REV REV PTSCHH"
guy in WRX " WTF!!:eek:"

LOL!

[SlickHolden]

Hey thats my dream to have a old car outside but hide the goodies under skin :D
Like a V6 in a VB:D.

[Blue Supra]

you mean 8? or one of those NOICE TTv6s like in the torana concept:D

[Luciferous]

Yeah my mate was working on a Torana hatch with a Gen III, I said Jesus that thing would fly, whats it pull over the quarter?
He couldn't post a time he twisted the chassis first time he took it out

And Soarers are like the best lookin Jap cars

[Blue Supra]

didnt put a cage in it? Soarer or lexus whatevrs are pretty nice but im yet to come across a manual one. slick says theres one in melbs, is it an aftermarket conversion?

[Luciferous]

Damn straight it is, the Soarer GT's (the V8s) came in 4 speed auto only

Yeah i dunno if he could have even put a cage in it there was that much sound equipment in the back (hence the reason why my mate was workin on it)

[Blue Supra]

LOL, if youre goin to have that much grunt, you NEED to reinforce the chassis! or exactly what happened to him will happen:D
i thought it was an auto only, like the Aero Top Supras. Damn them i want an aerotop manual!

[Luciferous]

Wouldn't be too hard, supra 5 speed boxes can be found, I think its the same box thats found in the TT supra as well (same engine so it makes sense) but I dont think it would be the same auto box

[Blue Supra]

Its a diff box. the non turbo supra has a 5 speed overdrive box, the TT Supra has a 6 speed box:) unless you're talkin bout the series III Supras which all had 5 speeds. thats the plan for my datto with the lexus engine, hook it up to a supra 5 speed and itll be apples:)

[Luciferous]

Cmon...you know you want to bolt on a huge rear wing....

[Blue Supra]

only if itll actually help it not make it look stupid:D

[fpv_gtho]

you cant simply have just the big wing.....you either gotta have a full body kit, ot just minor things on a sleeper look.....ive seen a silver lancer going around with simply mags, GT stripes and an alluminium wing and it looks like a POS

[SlickHolden]

Could go zinger burger cardboard body kit :p

[fpv_gtho]

haha only the left hand side of the car :p geez that'll work

[SlickHolden]

Save a mint on it also:p

[fpv_gtho]

well it is ONLY cardboard :p

[Blue Supra]

Thats a LOT of zinger burgers... OMG i saw an old old old corrola that had some sort of 80s kit on it, it looked SOOO wrong. i couldnt believe what i was seeing! :eek:

[fpv_gtho]

i think i may have seen something like that, but one of the Yr12 for Design and Technology at my school made a new front bar for his Celica, but the idiot drove around for ages before it was marked so its all scratched and shit to go infront of the markers :p but i reckon he's wasted his money a bit, its just this old Celica with a fart can, new rims, new glossy paintjob with i think a big hood drawing on it and the bodykit.....i feel like peggin rocks at it whenever i see it...

[Blue Supra]

i feel like peggin rocks at it whenever i see it...

can i help?:p
i saw an integra today, pink with chrome rear lights. fart can. bling wheels. bodykit complete with eye candy in the passenger seat:rolleyes:

[fpv_gtho]

he already got an earful from my electronics teacher for sticking it straight on his car.....the whole yr12 this year he reckons are the laziest bunch in a while, all of the DTEC and woodwork classes were bludging all year and just started mocking thinkgs up in the last couple of weeks......now for next year it looks like i wont be able to do engineering or DTEC cause not enough people are in the classes :(

[Luciferous]

Oh well you get that, in my high school we had a specialist course to get into the graphic design course in tafe, when it came around for my year we got 3 applicants out of a class of 300+

I still got into tafe but, so its no biggie

[fpv_gtho]

i think its only about 5-6 people who actually WANT to do engineering and design and technology next year so im really hoping they'll let them do the classes, otherwise i'll probably end up swapping them for woodwork and chemistry

[Luciferous]

Design classes are always tiny so you may get lucky

[Blue Supra]

Yeh small classes are a GOOD thing, except when you're doin biology. In year 11 my biol class has 7 students in it and the teacher was the most boring old fool. Then our regular teacher who had been on maternity leave came back and my marks went
^
|
|
|
_

[fpv_gtho]

it might pick up....during tech drawing today acouple of the tec teachers were talking about it, getting numbers on who's doing woodwork, engineering and design and technology...it looks like wood's the only that'll get enough people for next year, they need atleast 10 and theyre struggling at that out of a yeargroup of 240, but i think yr11 goes down to about 150

[Blue Supra]

that sucks man, ill come back to school and go in the classes for ya;) the schools average grade will go up 3 marks:D

[fpv_gtho]

haha maybe, im not so worried about engineering, but losing design and tech's a bit of a bummer as i had alot more freedom to what i could do than woodwork, i kept thinking of like doing a rear spoiler or some crap as the final project :p

[Luciferous]

My school wasnt in the best area of perth so the manual arts classes were always full, funnily enough

[fpv_gtho]

i guess you could say alot of the people who done them this year for Yr10, they were such dropkicks that they didnt get accepted for next year. engineering expecially, i think some people have been scared away cause some teachers have been saying some students wanting to do it wouldnt cope

[Luciferous]

Yeah the worst thing is when your school offers a specialist course then doesn't run it. Case in point, I went to my school in the first place for the course i was talking about, i was there for 3 years before i could do it(it only ran for yr 11 n 12), then as i can do it, it doesnt run. I don't think i need to mention i was more than slightly miffed

[fpv_gtho]

a couple of years ago, apparently my school ran mechanics as a HSC course so that wouldve been pretty neat, but heaps of OHnS shit has screwed with how careful they gotta be.....now cause the damn dust extractors dont work on the machines in the tech rooms, we cant use MDF for stuff next year which'll drive the costs up on everything. apparently the school can get introuble if theyre caught letting people use MDF this year, but its next year theyre putting their foot down. damn carsinogenic shit

[Luciferous]

Yeah, I remember our teacher were sayong about 5-6 years ago all the year 12's went to Adventure World every year (its like a huge amusement park with mostly outdoor pools and rides, with one up front fee then everythings free, cept food). Nowadays they wont even consider it for paperwork, public liability and all that shit. It's like we all gotta be treated like we're from the bottom of the intellectual barrel because a few of the said individuals decided to go and act like dipshits

[fpv_gtho]

we've got the option of doing a TAFE course instead of the subject now, but thats a big hasle as its like all the week's periods in one go on like the friday, 2-6pm or something like that.....but yeah, the school lost its insurance for work experience in Yr10 so i missed out on that this year, the last couple of weeks after the SC this year rather than being work experience this year is now shit to prepare us for yr11 and stuff....

[Luciferous]

Well most school round my area still got full insurance and stuff so work experience is still a big part of it.
I remember a couple of years back a kid drowned in the pools at Hampton high-school, its one of the closer school to were we were. Thats the thing that screws it up for everyone. I feel sorry for the guys family and everythin, but you gotta wonder how long someone is gonna survive in australia without knowing how to swim, it shouldnt screw up everything for everyone else

[fpv_gtho]

you'd think that EVERYONE these days'd be getting their kids swimming when theyre like 2 months old, when theyre still at that point that when they go under, their throat automatically closes up to keep fluids out...

i think its the CEO (catholic education office) that lost the insurance though, the premiums for 240 Yr10 students doing work experience just got too much

[Luciferous]

Hmm, well WA is the state that spells Wait Awhile, so maybe it'll hit over here too.

I think the guy was an immigrant from the Middle East somewhere, so technically its noone's fault (except for maybe a certain lack of judgement) but we gotta pay in the long run

[fpv_gtho]

the screwed up thing about insurance though, is they'll ask ridiculously priced premiums, then when you actually make a claim they'll go running and hide

[Luciferous]

Yeah my mate just crashed his car the other night, i was so annoyed, wasnt his fault, everyone who saw it just drove off. He's made a claim, the costs of repair to the other car will basically be covered by the excess he's gotta pay, and he's gotta pay to fix his car too. Plus on top of that if anything else happens his insurance company will probably tell him to bugger off

[fpv_gtho]

my mum had to make a claim to the NRMA once when someone swung out too far whilst turning a corner and hit her...it was an intersection that didnt really line up, so my mum was sitting to turn on a main road about where the cars were coming out from another road.....either way, even with her pensioners discount, she still had to pay $400 excess, and couldnt get the other bugger's number plate

[Luciferous]

Yeah we were in a line of cars and a guy pulled out in front, everyone slammed on the brakes, we were last in line and went up the back of a magna. Everyone kept drivin despite the fact that they HAD to have heard the crash, so in the eyes of the law it was my mates fault

[fpv_gtho]

things like that you really wish everyone who saw it gave the cops a report of everything, cause you can be completely caught out and have the blame all dumped on you

[Luciferous]

Yep 1200 buck bill outta the blue for my mate, he wasnt too impressed. And the guy who he hit, first thing he said was 'not your fault, it was that c**t's up there'. But you can yell and shout till your blue in the face but someone's gotta pay the bill and its gonna be you.

[fpv_gtho]

yeah theyve always gotta have a scapegoat, i guess we should be glad of third party insurance at least then

[Luciferous]

Yeah if someone ran into the back of us as well we'd be cool. Isn't that a sad thought?

[fpv_gtho]

what can you do though....its just how the dice rolls i guess. if someons going to be that paranoid of accidents, they shouldnt be on the road, but i guess that leaves all the other idiots, causing pile ups, and sending insurance premiums skywards for the discomfort for us sane drivers

[Luciferous]

Yeah but the thing that gets people annoyed is that you think insurance covers you for everything until you happen to really need it and get a nasty wake up call from your insurance company.

[fpv_gtho]

yeah like a couple of years ago when Woollongong got those mudslides, no one was covered by insurance from it so that was a few thousand people screwed out of a claim

[Luciferous]

Yep and all while the insurance company is laughing their ass off

[fpv_gtho]

yep. i guess its a bit of a relief when organisations like HIH fall apart from their greed, although deep down you know its not what should happen considering all the people who are involved with the company. its a hard situation i guess

[Luciferous]

Big companies can get away with a lot. Mitsubishi have been doin' it for the last 10 years...

[fpv_gtho]

i guess its all catching up to them now though...people talk about the massive job losses if someone like them go under, but realistically, the jobsll stay. like what happend when Valiant gave up? Mitsubishi moved in, whats to say they didnt rehire at least some of the existing workers, unless theres a fair time gap between the switchover that im unaware of

[Luciferous]

Yeah, which is funny we come back to the subject on this thread....
If Chrysler bit the bullet and bought the plant back of Mitsubishi (which they could do, theyre shaping up good for the next few years) we could quite possibly see a new Valiant.

[fpv_gtho]

i guess a "buy-out" is possible now that Daimler Chrysler said they want to pull their shares in Mitsubishi....i dont like the planned US charger though, its chasing after the RX-8's uniqueness with the idea of a 4 door coupe.....if Chrysler did the unthinkable and bought back the SA plant, then i'd want them to come up with their own, 2 door coupe, but thats unlikely...

[Luciferous]

If they study Valiant and Chrysler Aus's history, they had a habit of mutilating platforms to suit their needs, so if they follow that through it should be cool. For example the original aussie Charger was a shortened floorpan from a Dodge ute, and all the body was entirely unique to aus.

[fpv_gtho]

yeah, Valiant was really the only local to get the idea of a coupe sportscar right, as the shorter-than-sedan wheebase gave it less weight, both the Falcon Hardtop and Monaro i think had a longer wheelbase giving more weight....

I think its still worth a look though, they wanted to bring the 300 and 300C over to rival the Fairlane/Statesman

[Luciferous]

Yeah the styling is very Chrylser retro, like the Valiant Regals or the original 300C's. Chrylser have access to all of Benz's old stuff so they should get a bit creative with the platforms and get back to the Chrysler of old

[fpv_gtho]

it can only mean good....the whole US must be i a bit of a retro stage (i guess, STILL) with the new Ford's coming out looking retro and now the 300C...but Chrysler's been riding on retro for a while now..

i'd be interested how much freedom Chrysler would be given if they set up locally.....

[Luciferous]

Hopefully a lot. I mean lets face it, Chrylsers never won any awards for anything technical, but theyve had really out there design, which has won a lot of people over. Now they have the tech to back it up, they hopefully wont let it go to their heads

[Blue Supra]

well the only chryslers here atm that i can think of is the voyager and the neon and in the states is a Dodge :S

a new Valiant would win the hearts of many baby boomers i would think.

[fpv_gtho]

yeah theres them 2 as well as the viper and PT cruiser.....but theres only like 25 Vipers that got imported at like $250K originally.......but a decent enough car with the Valiant badge, as Bluey said, would win people over...

[Luciferous]

Chrysler only has 3 cars in its line up in Aus, The Voyager, PT Cruiser and Misfire. The Viper was killed after only about 11 or 12 cars were sold, which serves them right for trying to hock off decade old cars for 250 large. It was pretty damn insulting and the sales reflected it, plus you could go private and pay about 10k more for a much later model, which had been converted to RHD. The Neon was also killed a while back due to poor sales, due to poor quality, dynamics, driveline, looks, name, brand, pretty much everything.
They need to re-establish themselves in Australia properly with good products before they even think of making the cars in Australia again first

[fpv_gtho]

They want to bring in the 2nd gen Viper on an order by order basis, they think they can get it in for about $200K each which is 20% off the old price. its about what a new Ford GT will convert to though

[Blue Supra]

Thatd be a pain but for the customer... having to wait X number of weeks/months to have your car delivered from the states RHD converted...

[Luciferous]

I cant really think of many products Chrysler has that could get some interest, apart from the 300C and thats already coming over, and the Misfire SRT/6, preferably the cabrio. Maybe a turbo PT or PT cabrio could go well, but I dunno. Also if you check the title of this thread, Chrysler are definately bringing back Dodge, so the last thing they want is to create brand confusion by bringing in the newest Viper then bringing in Dodge and having marketing screw it all up.

[fpv_gtho]

well some people still wait like 6 weeks for their cars. like if your buying a commo or magna thats on the new batch, you gotta wait for it to be shipped from adelaide, and likewise with camrys/avalons and falcons/territorys but theyre from melbourne. they get converted in melbourne by VIPerformance though

[fpv_gtho]

I cant really think of many products Chrysler has that could get some interest, apart from the 300C and thats already coming over, and the Misfire SRT/6, preferably the cabrio. Maybe a turbo PT or PT cabrio could go well, but I dunno. Also if you check the title of this thread, Chrysler are definately bringing back Dodge, so the last thing they want is to create brand confusion by bringing in the newest Viper then bringing in Dodge and having marketing screw it all up.


as far as i know, the PT Cruiser isnt the best car to go sticking a turbo on, i think someone tried it and it turned out alot like the Turbo Beetle

[Blue Supra]

mmmm thats true but it would take longer to get one form the states surely.

[Luciferous]

The Cruiser isnt exactly bought by performance enthusiusts so I doubt anyone would notice. 'Wow, it goes faster than usual!! This is amazing!'

[fpv_gtho]

i know people that have thought it shouldve been V8 RWD and shit like that though, so the desig of its obviously appealing to people in that way, regardless of if chrysler intended it to

[Luciferous]

A lot of muscle car fans I know love the front end, but are extremely dissappointed by its credentials

[fpv_gtho]

maybe the car wouldve been a world better if it was european built, hell maybe even if it was built here, rather than Detroit

[Luciferous]

Maybe the car would have been better built with a proper back end and RWD, with at least a 6 as well

[fpv_gtho]

that'd be if they wanted it to be a performance car. the problem with retro though is everything looks sporty. the biggest let down of the century had to have been when they made the Plymouth Prowler have a 3.5L V6 though.

[Luciferous]

Yeah but the engine bay could take much more couldnt it? That would have been the idea, keep the price competitive so that tuners could put in bigger engines. So long as it has the looks and the driveline, the engine doesnt matter all that much. That's a car that should have been brought to Aus, the Prowler. Would have been a huge hit. At least bigger than the Viper, but that isnt saying much.

[fpv_gtho]

Only the most serious of tuners these days do engine swaps anymore, its just so much easier to find all the extra power you want through forced induction. Anyway, why should Plymouth have built the car with intentions on how it'll be treated aftermarket? If that was the case then evey manufacturer would only ever offer one trim level with the basic engine for all of their models.

I personally think that since it was designed to look like a hotrod, not being a V8 cut its appeal in half. I cant think of ANY hotrod ive seen thats got a V6. I dont know whether the layout of the car wouldve made a RHD conversion possible though, i know because of the Falcons engine position it cant be converted to LHD

[Luciferous]

That would suck for Ford...
One of the integral parts of the Hot Rod culture was customisation of the cars, bigger engines, sidepipes, lead slead conversions etc. If they made the car so that it was easy to drop a Hemi V8 straight in, it would have been a good idea. You'd want to find ways to make the car more affordable to its target audience.

[fpv_gtho]

Its something theyre working on for 2008, i reckon for that they'll have an alloy block ready.

The original hot rod culture took small cars, normally with 4 cylinders, and tubbed them out and retrofitted them with V8's. Its very comparible to the ricer culture today IMO. Plymouth was aiming at a particular market with the Prowler, theres no doubt about that, but im sure that whatever croud that was wouldnt have stuck a Hemi in it before strapping twin turbo's on. As i said before, the latter is so much easier with the lower costs, less fuss and more potential power.

[Luciferous]

But, more importantly, its not in tune with the car's theme. I wouldn't expect the Prowler to have the best dynamics, but Hot Rods never have. It's a mentality of the car, the looks, the sound, the feel of it. You need the sound of a V8 to finish the picture. And maybe some better wheels than those typically yank things they stick on em too.

[fpv_gtho]

I honestly would be disappointed if the Prowler was less than exciting to drive. Whether hotrods did or didnt have great dynamics, the 2st century image of the hotrod, what Plymouth created with the Prowler, the car inspires you into thinking its got a sporty road presence, that it'll be one of the best things on the road.

GM got it seriously wrong with the SSR. The retro looking convertible ute resembling an FJ ute, only had like 220kw and weighed in at around 2200kg and was a complete dog to drive

[Luciferous]

In my eyes the main problem was it was too high of the ground, and that just dicked up the looks. Besides it was made for cruisin' not for hoonin', so it wasnt ever goind to ride very well. The practicality of it made it a bit silly but, wasnt even a proper ute.

[fpv_gtho]

well i was gunna say before that its practically a pimp mobile....:p

i dont think the Yanks know how to make a good ute fullstop though, the idea of a convertible ute is a bit weird

[Luciferous]

And would look absolutely ridiculous with the roof down.
Well at least they recognise they can't make good utes. When the GTO first came out over there the main car they wanted from Aus was the Maloo badged as an El Camino

[fpv_gtho]

They cant even get it straight what a ute is, most of them think its simply a translation of what they call trucks.........

exporting it as an el camino i guess wouldnt be bad, i reckon they wouldve met the sales targets alot better than what the GTO's done. some people even think the falcon ute should be exported as a Ranchero :p

[Luciferous]

Would probably go down well, pity bout the LHD problems

Yeah the HSV styling definately would be a hit compared to the GTO's

[fpv_gtho]

i think things might be different now wth the free trade agreement, but that didnt affect all areas of trade of course. those first couple of months the GTO went on sale, bob lutz was probably thinking "maybe i shouldve gone for 12000 Monaros and 6000 utes...." :p. ford's gotta engineer 2008 for LHD though otherwise holden will be able to keep up the exports which'll only make the commodore cheaper, and it'll only make it hurt harder when they make the big switch to aluminiun construction in probably 10-15 years.

[Blue Supra]

what part will be aluminium construciton? the whole car or just the engine?

[fpv_gtho]

just the bodywork, chassis etc.....the suspension's usually a mix of cast iron, forged steel and cast alloy for different strengths for is purposes etc. their current engine blocks are all cast iron which is alot of weight over the front axle, so if they were to switch to alluminium alloy blocks for both engines today, i think they could save about 40-50kg, and even better still, its take off the front, improving the balance

[Blue Supra]

nice, when are they bringin this? 2008 you rekin? wont it be a bit late by then with the VE coming out like in 2006?

[fpv_gtho]

They can have an alluminium block for the V8 ready at the click of a finger as the new GT40 has it, but the I6 block would have to be the all new model in 2008. as far as i can see that'd be the next logical evolution of the engine. the price of alluminium is going to be too expensive in the next couple of years so we'll see another all new falcon get introduced and phase out before it happens, but theres always alluminium bodypanels like the roof, boot and bonnet that can be done i suppose, especially on the FPV's and XR's

[Blue Supra]

fibreglass is not really an option for a "family" sedan i spose hey:p

[fpv_gtho]

well i suppose it can be, but its too weak really, it cracks and doesnt really absorb much i guess so things like Alluminium, Carbon Fibre and even Kevlar are now used, although theyre alot more expensive...fibreglass is still in bodykits though at least

[Blue Supra]

well its light and doesnt NEED to be strong for kits i spose.

[fpv_gtho]

well i know for reproduction hot rod bodies, they end up heavier than steel as to make them strong enough, the fibreglass has to be made pretty think which adds up in heaps more weight....but yeah, any sort of a knock a bodykit takes, if it does damage you kinda deserve it for driving like that :p

[Blue Supra]

Yeh thats the down point, fibreglass is heaps easier to repair then steel! i just knock my dents back out with a rubber mallet. not that i have had any major ones to take care of.

[fpv_gtho]

you did have those problems with your bumpers though :p

but year, if you got a problem with fibreglass, cut it out and put a new section in and sand it back, metal its harder to work with as you gotta "work" the material into the right place and most people will just fix it all up with putty or something...

[Blue Supra]

well if i roll this thing or something. i wont be happy
a) i just spent ALOT of money on it
b) i cant afford to fix it
c) ill have to drive either a rolled car or not drive at all
:(

fortunately i dont plan on rolling:)

[fpv_gtho]

well put a rollbar in and you'll be set:p

i saw this 1200 sedan that had apparently rolled and you wouldnt really think that was the case, the only real damage was the roof was a bit more squashed on the edges

[Luciferous]

I can tell you for a fact that cars look different when they've been rolled. When, uh, my brother's Kingswood was rolled and I was kinda directly responsible, it definately looked different when it was put back on its wheels. The roof was all dented in and it had no more windows, both A pillars were bent and one of the B pillars was too. My brother's mate's solution to fix this dilemma was simply to pull out an angle grinder and remove the roof completely

[fpv_gtho]

yay, convertible Kingswood:p

i think things like Landcruisers get the hardest hits from rollovers, i went to this 4x4 wrecker once and about half the cars there were just landcruisers with one side of the roof rolled and caved in :eek:

[Luciferous]

Yeah it didnt look too bad, except for the fact it had no windscreen, and 4 door convertibles aren't a clever idea. I think its still in one piece, we've been waiting for it to just implode one day.

[fpv_gtho]

Heaps of people do the 4 door convertibles though, alot cheaper than getting a proper 2 door...have you seen that bottled water add where that idiot keeps jumping in this old red impala, then finally the chick filled it up with the hose? :p

[Luciferous]

Yeah, but where do the B pillars go in a 4 door convertible? Most 4 door based convertibles get turned into 2 doors so they don't fall apart when you turn a corner.

[fpv_gtho]

they just cut them off flush with the top of the doors usually.....i guess they just try something like how a 4 door pillarless setup is