[QUOTE=Ferrer;864420]Damiano, I think you are spot on.
Which if you think about it, is quite sad.[/QUOTE]
I've been used to both since a while, sadly;):o
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[QUOTE=Ferrer;864420]Damiano, I think you are spot on.
Which if you think about it, is quite sad.[/QUOTE]
I've been used to both since a while, sadly;):o
Just because someone drives a Toyota doesn't mean they are boring. They may not care about cars and only use it as a transportation device. You have to remember that you're a petrolhead and most people don't think like you do when it comes to automobiles, the same way a teenager would disagree on a film with a snobby movie critic. It comes down to difference in taste and opinion.
Plus, Larry David drives Toyotas and I would definitely not call him sad or boring.
[QUOTE=Rockefella;864438]Just because someone drives a Toyota doesn't mean they are boring. They may not care about cars and only use it as a transportation device. You have to remember that you're a petrolhead and most people don't think like you do when it comes to automobiles, the same way a teenager would disagree on a film with a snobby movie critic. It comes down to difference in taste and opinion.
Plus, Larry David drives Toyotas and I would definitely not call him sad or boring.[/QUOTE]
true, but from a general point of view, we could say that as proper enthusiast we can give an good idea of how a person is knowing the car he owns. now, from a general point of view, saying someone owns a Toyota Corolla, intriguing personality isn't the first thing that comes to mind.
it's not objectively true, but overall acceptable.
even knowing the best car in the world doesn't make you the best person of the world after all.
[QUOTE=Ferrer;864083]Is there? Chevrolet Aveo, Chevrolet Cobalt, million year old Focus and let's not start talking about Chryslers...
With those I'd choose a Toyota too.
On the reliability fron though, what you say may have been true in the past but today a Fiat Panda is as reliable as a Toyota Yaris and a Ctroën C4 will last as long as a Toyota Auris. But even so if I was that concerned about reliability I'd rather a Honda or a Subaru than a Toyota...[/QUOTE]
The Chevy Aveo isn't GM made. It's some Korean badge engineered thingy. The Colbalt is okay, I guess. The interior (from what I hear) still isn't up to par with its competitors and suffers because of that then.
[QUOTE=Ferrer;864153]But even so, not being an expert doesn't mean you shouldn't or couldn't care about wat you drive.
If really everyone drove Toyotas, then there would be no art, no good restaurants or no fine wines. No I'm not an expert on music or food, but I certainly do enjoy a good meal or classical music.[/QUOTE]
But not everyone does drive Toyotas. Rock and Leon got it dead on. We're connoisseurs of cars. We've gotten picky.
A foodie might like escargot, but a 4 year old will say eww.
[QUOTE=NSXType-R;864519]The Chevy Aveo isn't GM made. It's some Korean badge engineered thingy. The Colbalt is okay, I guess. The interior (from what I hear) still isn't up to par with its competitors and suffers because of that then. [/QUOTE]
daewoo... owned by GM. so yes it is GM made.
[QUOTE=cmcpokey;864521]daewoo... owned by GM. so yes it is GM made.[/QUOTE]
was it already owned by GM when the original and pretty similar Daewoo Kalos was unveiled? embarrassing car if you ask me, especially in the [I]Pontiac trim leve[/I]l
[QUOTE=LeonOfTheDead;864526]was it already owned by GM when the original and pretty similar Daewoo Kalos was unveiled? embarrassing car if you ask me, especially in the [I]Pontiac trim leve[/I]l[/QUOTE]
GM bought a controlling stake in Daewoo automotive in 2001, but had partnership deals with them going back to the early 90s. so in short...yes
[QUOTE=LeonOfTheDead;864494]true, but from a general point of view, we could say that as proper enthusiast we can give an good idea of how a person is knowing the car he owns. now, from a general point of view, saying someone owns a Toyota Corolla, intriguing personality isn't the first thing that comes to mind.
it's not objectively true, but overall acceptable.[/QUOTE]
I'll agree with that, as long as you remember that some people don't care at all about their car's performance. IF someone has a remote interest in cars, then your point I think is 100% true assuming they can afford to buy and maintain their ride --for some a $500 used Saturn from a guy that you know down the block-- may be the only thing that fits your budget so you don't have the luxury of looking for a second hand Alfa Romeo. Like someone brought up, if you're only looking at Point A to Point B, your main criteria are probably comfort, economy, reliability, and manufacturer reputation. Toyota has those 4 nailed I think. Be it a Corolla or Camry, these people can care less about the excitement factor and personality of such owners shouldn't even be measured by what they drive.
I'm kind of rambling here so in short I'll just say, I agree with you as long as you're not including the person I described above into the 'judged by what they drive' category. I drove a Pontiac Bonneville and I have 15k+ posts on an automotive forum. That has to speak for something. [I]Cough[/I] Ferrer.
[QUOTE=Rockefella;864587]I drove a Pontiac Bonneville and I have 15k+ posts on an automotive forum. That has to speak for something. [I]Cough[/I] Ferrer.[/QUOTE]
im not sure that says what you want it to.
[QUOTE=Rockefella;864587]I'm kind of rambling here so in short I'll just say, I agree with you as long as you're not including the person I described above into the 'judged by what they drive' category. I drove a Pontiac Bonneville and I have 15k+ posts on an automotive forum. That has to speak for something. [I]Cough[/I] Ferrer.[/QUOTE]
I drive my mom's Fiat Stilo, or dad's Fiat Croma. both diesels.
I visited all the car museums/factories of the Modena's area, garages, Mille Miglia, concept exhibition and so on, so yeah, I agree with you.
[QUOTE=Rockefella;864587]I'll agree with that, as long as you remember that some people don't care at all about their car's performance. IF someone has a remote interest in cars, then your point I think is 100% true assuming they can afford to buy and maintain their ride --for some a $500 used Saturn from a guy that you know down the block-- may be the only thing that fits your budget so you don't have the luxury of looking for a second hand Alfa Romeo. Like someone brought up, if you're only looking at Point A to Point B, your main criteria are probably comfort, economy, reliability, and manufacturer reputation. Toyota has those 4 nailed I think. Be it a Corolla or Camry, these people can care less about the excitement factor and personality of such owners shouldn't even be measured by what they drive.
I'm kind of rambling here so in short I'll just say, I agree with you as long as you're not including the person I described above into the 'judged by what they drive' category. I drove a Pontiac Bonneville and I have 15k+ posts on an automotive forum. That has to speak for something. [I]Cough[/I] Ferrer.[/QUOTE]
It's not the performance that bothers me, after all there are some Toyotas that are plenty fast. Nor is it the price, I've seen V6 Alfas going for as little as 990€ here. Also I'm not arguing that a Toyota is a bad car, because it isn't.
Of course there's a market for Toyotas, I'm not denying that. And there of course different circumstances for different owners. I certainly wouldn't refuse a Toyota if I were to inherit one.
My point originally was that if you do like good thing in life, and a car is a [I]thing in life[/I], why would you bother about a Toyota. Surely as has been said there are some people that can't be bothered. But being the best selling car manufacturer in the world means most of the people in this world can't be bothered.
Which if you think about it, is slightly sad.
a car bought by a great number of people tends to become boring just because of that....
[QUOTE=henk4;864739]a car bought by a great number of people tends to become boring just because of that....[/QUOTE]
Not necessarily, I'd say.
Take the DS for instance.
[QUOTE=Ferrer;864740]Not necessarily, I'd say.
Take the DS for instance.[/QUOTE]
I almost hated the Fiat 500 and VW Beetle though before of seeing the light.
I still hate the Golf.
[QUOTE=LeonOfTheDead;864742]I almost hated the Fiat 500 and VW Beetle though before of seeing the light.
I still hate the Golf.[/QUOTE]
I like the Golf. Very popular, but excellent car. And of course the Auris makes it look as if it was a Ferrari...
The original Nuova 500 from the 50's is another of those "very popular, but it still feels special" cases.