Could they make the Pontiac GTO any worse?

[SlickHolden]

Bingo!
Thats exactly what happend. Lutz drove the car and fell in love with it. He wanted Pontiac to have a come back in the performance department, and what else says performance than "GTO". That name striked fear in the hearts of racers back in the day...
The Monaro is undoubtably a very nice car, but in all respects doesnt deserve the GTO name. I agree, it should have been introduced as something different, maybe a Le Mans (baby GTO).

I would even say it the other way around, The MONARO name is legendary in Australia, And maybe the GTO name doesn't deserve to be plasted on such a icon

[fpv_gtho]

Well I mean the weight was the only thing I was arguing, the tires were crap on Muscle Cars, and I'm pretty sure about 30% of the power was getting sucked up by the transmission alone....

Well if Ford 9 inch diff's are anything to go by, then its quite possible. Many people only reccomend using one when your pushing serious figures as they suck up alot of power, so for moderate things they reccomend things like a Hilux 4x4 diff. i havent heard anything similar though for the likes of the Toploader, FMX and C4 though

[Slicks]

Correct me if I'm wrong on this, but I was under the impression that Muscle Cars weighed F-all. In a comparison between a HK Munro and its current incarnation, I was surprised to see the HK undercut the 2002 model but 500kg, but I suppose it makes sense, no safety equipment or other crap they make you stick in cars these days...

What do you mean "f-all"? Ive never heard that term before...

[charged]

F-all(****all) means fairly light in weight,

[Slicks]

I would even say it the other way around, The MONARO name is legendary in Australia, And maybe the GTO name doesn't deserve to be plasted on such a icon

I know what your saying and thats what I would expect from some one who grew up with the Monaro. Truly the GTO was a car to be feared though. It ran faster times than the current US GTO in the 1/4 mile. People just expected more from a "GTO."

[Slicks]

F-all(****all) means fairly light in weight,

lol oh thanks

Well then i can answer the question.
No, most muslce cars were over 3500lbs. "Pony cars" (cars that were not based off another car, hence dont use the "proper" name muscle car) were generally at or just under 3500lbs, like the Camaro and Mustang.

[fpv_gtho]

I know what your saying and thats what I would expect from some one who grew up with the Monaro. Truly the GTO was a car to be feared though. It ran faster times than the current US GTO in the 1/4 mile. People just expected more from a "GTO."

Wouldnt surprise me in the least if you guys wouldnt be truly satisfied with another GTO that could get Sub-5 seconds 0-100kmh/0-60mph like the first tri-carb, in which case, simply taking our HSV GTO rather than making a mockery of the Monaro would be alot easier to do. Thats recently just pulled at 4.99 in an auto

[Blitz_]

wow, what a fugly car, i liked the clean lines of the original next gen. munro, this is just hideous. What is wif the yanks adding all this colour coding and unecessarry vents to the kits? and the embossed GTO on the rear is the worst, just put in a badge plz. Now that judge concept is one helluva car!

[fpv_gtho]

Maybe its something to lure some Mustang buyers

[Luciferous]

lol oh thanks

Well then i can answer the question.
No, most muslce cars were over 3500lbs. "Pony cars" (cars that were not based off another car, hence dont use the "proper" name muscle car) were generally at or just under 3500lbs, like the Camaro and Mustang.

Well yeah, that ain't that much weight-wise, Slicks. If you take a look at similar-sized vehicles nowadays they weigh a lot more. I would say the main culprit is the tyres and transmission, as I was saying before up to 30% of the power is getting chewed up by the trans (compared to about 17% now), and when the cars were around when radial tyres were big news you know they weren't anything special. I think when a test was done in a Valiant Charger (an Aussie version built by Chrylser subsidiary Valiant - Triple carbie 265 Hemi 6) they managed to shave half a second off the quarter mile just by putting on new tyres compared to the original style they came out on....

[charged]

Yeah tyres make a big difference,cant see what the yanks are on about,the GTO fairly well flys,who cares about ,2 or .3 of a sec,you cant really feel that by the seat of your pants anyway

[fpv_gtho]

To them it must be a big thing, i know Matra has before said that many in the US need to put a figure on something rather than judge it subjectively, and i have to agree with him considering they seem to be the only ones trying to put a figure on handling

[SlickHolden]

I know what your saying and thats what I would expect from some one who grew up with the Monaro. Truly the GTO was a car to be feared though. It ran faster times than the current US GTO in the 1/4 mile. People just expected more from a "GTO."

What they are offering you now is the full package, Speed, Handling, comfort,

If the HSV GTO can do 4.99sec 0-100, then you would expect the Pontiac to go same if not a tad faster since it shouldn't have the same weight it should be a little lighter

But as the original, It's all ad-on's ad this ad that and it wasn't cheap, How about a Standard no options factory original GTO Vs The current 2005 one, No options full standard.
You guys should know what can be done to these LS1's and LS2's. $2000 it's doing 12's $5000 it's doing 11's $15,000 it's in the 8's.

[Slicks]

What they are offering you now is the full package, Speed, Handling, comfort,

If the HSV GTO can do 4.99sec 0-100, then you would expect the Pontiac to go same if not a tad faster since it shouldn't have the same weight it should be a little lighter

But as the original, It's all ad-on's ad this ad that and it wasn't cheap, How about a Standard no options factory original GTO Vs The current 2005 one, No options full standard.
You guys should know what can be done to these LS1's and LS2's. $2000 it's doing 12's $5000 it's doing 11's $15,000 it's in the 8's.

Oh, we know what the LS1 can do...
But f-bodies are cheaper and lighter than the GTO, thats proabably another reason they dont sell too well, cause you can get a nice used f-bod still!

[fpv_gtho]

The F-bodies are no more a better car though, maybe more GTO's would sell if drag racing severely outweighed circuit racing as far as popularity goes. I guess we're lucky enough over here that if you want a dedicated drag car, simply get one of the one tonners and there goes half your issues wih the car sagging its arse on launch