whos fed up with dodge?

[DodgeNitroBIRM]

It's not that different from the GT, just missing the two fog lights in the grille, but the ride is great from what my dad has said from doing test drives in them for new car checks. We've even had a dealership only V6 called the "Crazy Horse," looks great, except for the large decal on the rear window and the fact that it has a decal on the front windshield (which is illegal in the state of Virginia).

[Snorky]

A box huh?... i kind've see a lot of the vehicles these days ending up like dead whales,.. all bloated and stuff.

[carlover]

Seeing as the 300C was just picked as Motor Trend car of the year and is a big sales success, it might just be you complaining. I doubt Chrysler will be worried too much by a 12 year old who thinks a Vector and a Toyota Prius are the kings of the road.

Excuse me. I'm going to go laugh for 5 minutes. That's some ownage wout.

Karrman, you like the round shape of the prius, but you like the sharp edges and the almost boxiness look of the Vector ? But then as soon as you see that dodge has boxy shapes you filp out and attack anyone who doesn't agree with you? WTF!? Your Caravan (apparently) sucked (it's probably fine, but you took your parents car keys once and forgot to cluctch when you shifted). Does that mean they all do? Does the viper suck!? The viper is one of the most pure sports cars you can get. Fast, good-looking, and the older models are classics! So now you hate dodge, and chrysler, who do produce good solid cars at resonable prices (20,000 ain't a lot of money for a car that can get to 60 in 6 seconds) because of one little thing that happened to you? And your saying it's because their cars look boxy?!? Or that they had no imagination when making the charger!!? I think the ironicy of it all would get through to you after the first thousand times.

BTW the magnum AND the 300C both look great and are very good cars. And I like the charger as well.

[RS6]

I'm sorry, I can't agree with you liking the new Charger. If it wasn't called Charger, then I might understand, but being called a Charger is just ridiculous.

[Revo]

I'm sorry, I can't agree with you liking the new Charger. If it wasn't called Charger, then I might understand, but being called a Charger is just ridiculous.

Come on, don't be so sensitive
Remember what Charger used to look like (and engine it used) back in 1984?

[CdocZ]

Come on, don't be so sensitive
Remember what Charger used to look like (and engine it used) back in 1984?

Yes, but continuing something like the legendary Charger, you should ressurect it in a good way, no? It's like the Pontiac GTO massacre.

[Godlaus]

Does anybody else think that dodge can do so much better in the engineering field? It seems to me like they're just throwing in a giant (or a richard clarkson put it; " A stupidly huge truck engine) engine into a sports car chassis. Both dodge and chevrolet could do so much better with their sports cars. Both the viper and the corvette still use pushrod engines, if they switched to a DOHC 4 valve/chamber 10 liter engine, you'd have GT performance using the right tuning. Why don't they make a better car? Sure, it'd be more expensive, but I'm sure that if ferrari made a thousand more enzos, they'd all be bought up. Why don't they make a better car? i'm so dissapointed.............

[Quiggs]

Simply because they don't need to. Dodge and Chevrolet have no problems whatsoever selling out annually of every Viper and Corvette produced. And it's a simple forumla that works. The cars' performace speak for themselves. Look at the other side of the coin. Why are the other manufacturers that supposedly use better technology only marginally, if at all, better than the archaic technology in the Corvette's pushrod engine and leaf spring suspension?

And before you start calling pushrod motors low-tech and undeveloped, you need to read this article on the new ZO6 motor.

[CdocZ]

Yes, the new Z06 engine is actually very high tech. Also, another reason is they do not want a high revving engine. A DOHC is a high revving engine, while pushrods are low revvers. If you want something that sounds like a muscle car, a pushrod will make the sound you want better.

[Godlaus]

They don't need to, but they can make a better car that can sell. Why has ferrari sold thousands of 360s? because they sell. Chevy and dodge could do the same.

Does their performance speak for themselves? Yes, for their price range, they're incredibly well put together, but the pushrod was put in because they wanted to keep the price down. not because it performs better.

the z06 is an amazing car, but they can do so much better. The car puts out 75 bhp per liter, whereas the f430 puts out around 115. It's the bhp/pound where the z06 makes it's acceleration. Chevy and dodge can do so much better. The don't need to, but why did ford make the GT? They didn't need to..... Any dohc variable 4 valve 7 liter engine that chevy can put in a z06 chassis would sell and make a profit. So why don't they? Are they just content where they are?

BTW = never did I really say that pushrods were bad, they're just outdated and used for price, not performance. The z06 just brings the best out of it.

[Quiggs]

So, you're saying GM and Chrysler should make their cars more expensive, but only get the same amount of performance out of them...?

[Godlaus]

So, you're saying GM and Chrysler should make their cars more expensive, but only get the same amount of performance out of them...?

no, they'd get better performance by making a supercar (which it looks like they're doing with the P8 and the now dead ME-12), and people would pay for it.

Hmmm..... I completely forgot about the p8.....answered my own question.

[CdocZ]

The way Viper's are made, they will never sell well. This is actually good, because most of them end up in the hands of people who A) actually will drive them, and B) know how to drive a track-oriented car (I am not saying the Viper is a true track car, but it is definitely track oriented). If the Viper sold a few thousand easily a year, people would give it bad reviews on how hard to drive it is, and less about the actual car for people who can drive. Most of those Ferrari's are bought up by retarded rich ingorant fools who are just buying the badge really, and the only time they are behind the wheel is when they are sitting in the seat behing "James the driver".

[Quiggs]

no, they'd get better performance by making a supercar (which it looks like they're doing with the P8 and the now dead ME-12), and people would pay for it.

Hmmm..... I completely forgot about the p8.....answered my own question.

It wouldn't make financial sense for GM or Chrysler to build a supercar. GM's in financial ruins right now, and Chrysler has the Mercedes SLR.

The more a car costs, the less people will buy it- no matter how well it performs. Take the Corvette and the Ferrari 360 (F430 sales haven't started yet). Over the 5 year run of 360's, Ferrari built 17,500 of them. Over the 7 years the C5 was in service, Chevrolet sold 214,000 of them. In 01 and 02, GM sold 13,000 Z06's- nearly the total of 360's sold.

[Slicks]

Does their performance speak for themselves? Yes, for their price range, they're incredibly well put together, but the pushrod was put in because they wanted to keep the price down. not because it performs better.

Speak for yourself, It works jsut as good if not better for this application.

the z06 is an amazing car, but they can do so much better. The car puts out 75 bhp per liter, whereas the f430 puts out around 115. It's the bhp/pound where the z06 makes it's acceleration. Chevy and dodge can do so much better. The don't need to, but why did ford make the GT? They didn't need to..... Any dohc variable 4 valve 7 liter engine that chevy can put in a z06 chassis would sell and make a profit. So why don't they? Are they just content where they are?

GM already did that, remember the (C4)Corvette ZR1? That car failed misserably, it was MUCH more expencive thanks to the heavy ass DOHC engine. That LT5 made "only" 400hp form 5.7L, just like the LS6, but the LS6 is cheaper, lighter, and physically smaller, so now let me ask, which is better? The LT5, thanks to its "high tech" design was 100lbs heavier than the OHV LT1 of the time, and over 200lbs heavier than the current LS2 in the 05 Corvette. To sum things up, GM doesnt put a DOHC engine in the Corvette because that would raise cost, add weight (and lower performance), make little to no more power at the same RPM than the LS2, and increase physical size, making it more difficult to put the engine far back in the front of the chassis(for better weight distrabution).

BTW = never did I really say that pushrods were bad, they're just outdated and used for price, not performance. The z06 just brings the best out of it.

BTW OHC was used before OHV engines, the OHV design is not "outdated."