Farewell GTO

[Schmallz]

no no, don't get me wrong i LOVE the GTO, sat in a couple and wanted it to be mine. but its interior can not be compared to an M5, which is what pontiac's new goal is. i believe someone said that pontiac wants to be the "american BMW."

yes, it is a quality and luxurious ride, but there are many levels of luxury, and they haven't reached bmw's level yet.

I was the one who said Pontiac wants to be the American BMW, not nessicarly compete with them, just have the same principle, performance across the board. Cadillac is the one competeing with BMW, and they are doing a damn good job.

The Owner of a Pontiac dealer was the one who explaind the BMW thing with me and my parents when we were looking for a Solstice.

[jcp123]

I always thought Olds was a much better fit for competing with BMW, given its history...Cad would be a fantastic player agains Lexus, and Pontiac I think should be sort of the division that sells stripped-down, high-performance models of other GM cars.

[nota]

When comparing GTO to expensive BMW M5 (a compliment in itself) is price a relevant factor at all or should we throw in Rolls Royce as well?

[ZeTurbo]

good riddance... you shouldn't use a retro name without some retro styling cues, especially not on a muscle car icon like the GTO. Also, an Austrailian GTO - blasphemy!

SO TRUE!

I rather have a Solstice than a GTO (holden) to be honest. So much better looking, ragtop, lightwieght and is suposed to be inspiring in twisty roads.

[pAinTrAin]

Well at least the new mustangs interior is an improvement of the 99-04 and the 95-98, i own a 2000 GT and the interior sucks, all black with no high lights or style, love the outside though.

Seen the Camaro s new interior....I say sexy

[jcp123]

Hey, i thought the '94-'98 body was the best of the modern Mustangs, especially the '94's with the 5.0 but before the evil EEC-V with OBD-II was required in '95 (the '94 still had airbags though...grr). This generation did things right...original Mustang cues without trying to rape the originals like the current Mustangs do. For example, tri-bar taillights, side scoops, and dual-cowl interior. IDEAS that were copied from the original without molesting the LOOKS of the real Mustangs.

[SlickHolden]

Norway is not exsactly know for leting interesting cars slip into the country.
Car industri is none so information flow is low.



Opel and saab produce v6 with DOHC and you have the Cadillac nortstar so why not? Cosworth and williams are able to develop a f1 V8 ferrari build ther own engines and www.atomracing.se made there own prototype and Koenigsegg build there own engine I think(not shure) GM is the largest car producer in the world so if they can't aford to develop a 32-valve engine for a BMW comptitor they should look into the way they spend there money.

A LS7 in the right car would do a BMW. It wouldn't matter if it had 2vpc OHV.
But this Northstar engine does it have high capacity? I know nothing of it.
Back in the late 80's holden built a 5LT OHC V8. Today if let produce it that engine would be something real good today.
But GM doesn't need to make a Global DOHC V8 like they did with the V6. Chev's V8 is one of the best V8's in the world, There really is no reason now to use anything else. And it's light and cheap and packs a huge punch.

SO TRUE!

I rather have a Solstice than a GTO (holden) to be honest. So much better looking, ragtop, lightwieght and is suposed to be inspiring in twisty roads.

The GTO was much more then looks. Problem was pontiac stuck darth vaders helmet on the front end
But I'll stake my Reputation on this.... Sorry Mitusb I bet the GTO was better build better backed better quality more refined then any GM car in the U.S For under $40,000. And think it's based of a VT Commodore which was first built in 97. Now think if that car was good what will the next one be
The Camaro's skin hides all holden underneath.
Pontiac could have made the GTO so many things, The UK used all Holden's and HSV's kits. Pontiac stuffed that up. A couple of What the GTO could have been. You can't blame the car but you can blame the people that gave it the look marketed it. One car will rock some socks it's called a Bitter.

See what can be done with a effort. Same car its the Holden Monaro.

[Sid447]

Northstar,

Is a 4.6 dohc, all alloy V8 used in Cadillacs. Introduced in the early 90's I think. It had a terrible gestation period (serious reliability problems) ...though it's a very good engine now.
http://jadcock.oldsgmail.com/cadsls/northstar.htm
http://www.gm.com/automotive/gmpower...star/index.htm

Another hi-tech all-alloy V8. The Lotus developed all alloy dohc LT5 5.7 V8 for the C4 Vette ZR1 was developed in the late 80's.
http://www.eurovettes.com/zr1_home.htm



Nothing wrong with the GM Gen 3 & 4 pushrod V8's though. A lot more simple and compact than any dohc V8. And are proving to be reliable and oil-leak free with impressive power!


But talking of the end of GTO/Monaro/VZ........Don't get me wrong here, I own and am very attached to a Holden Commodore.
The origin of most if not all Holden Commodores (and other Holden models) came from GM Europe.
It's not about nationality here; it's about a global car maker keeping things simple and cost effective.
The Monaro/GTO/Commodore chassis/floorpan came from the last GM-E Omega which was designed and built in from the early 90's to around 2002. Holden took the platform and produced the car we know from '97. Substituting the dohc 4 cylinder and V6 's for Holden's version of a Camaro spec Gen 3 V8 (from MY99). along with Tremecs T56 and the GM 4L60-E transmissions.
If you put a GM-Europe Omega and any of the models from VT to VZ ( that's '97 to '05 model Commodore, or any of the CV8's or GTOs) ...side-by-side on car hoists and inspected underneath both cars, you'd find the floorpan is identical and 90% of the components too and could be interchanged between the cars.

Opel even made one with a Gen 3 V8:
http://www.conceptcarz.com/vehicle/z...8/default.aspx

The Opel Omega was also exported for a short time as the Cadillac Catera in the USA. Which was basically a re-badged but not re-engineered 3.0L or 3.2L V6* Omega.
* This is now known as the Alloytec and is also made in 3.6litre capacity for some markets since the GM/Buick 3.8 ohv iron V6 ceased production a few years ago.

[adrenaline]

Some nice info, but the thread is pretty stale now. Try not to bring back dead threads too often, unless you have something super to add

PS: Not 'all' Holden Commodores are from Europe. The newest is an Aussie. And hardly any Holden models are being sourced from europe now as Holden is looking to Korea.

[SlickHolden]

I think people still think that the commodore is a Opel. A couple of short and quick points here, Holden longer wheelbase, Wider track, Width length height all different. Boot capacity also. And when it comes to the IRS holden bought that off Opel which was started in the 70's.
Now also some holden being sold overseas could be mistaken for a Opel omega thats another thing.
Another good point is every part of the exterior isn't interchangeable.
But if you go back more then 10 years maybe a different story.
Now i know this for 100% truth... GM didn't want holden to build a car after VS and they had no plans for a V8. They just wanted holden to use the omega as it was. Buick wanted a car they got a reprieve and lucky for GM they built the VT cause it started something made holden bigger.


Trust me don't think the cars are 90% the same they are far from it. They have never been a Opel omega sent to Australia and then given a Aussie accent never happen. Holden had to build it from scratch as they just couldn't manipulate the car enough so it was just easier to build it to there specs.
Just got something interesting, Both Omega and commodore were same ground clearance, 150mm. But there was a 10mm height difference. That was the Opel omega Gen3 and the VY Executive. It might only be 10mm in height but it's more in width wheelbase length.

does anyone know if the Opel omega has a glued on firewall?.