Am I Right,in my assumptions.

[J.J.Horst]

I could correct your use of the Dutch language (but I won't).

I have to correct you though on Voisin: Voisin was a car manufacturer in it's own right, and had nothing to do with Bugatti. There may be some similar bodies on individual cars (which were often coach built by other companies), and there are some other similarities also, like the fact that both were busy in the aviation business also.

About the documentation museum: The virtual version (which is best accessible to anybody) is already online! Mostly organised by individual marque, there are loads of informations, taken from books, sometimes copied articles or scans of period advertising material and brochures. Google may be used as an index to this museum.

Take a look for example on http://www.BugattiRevue.com and especially in it's back issue index on http://www.BugattiRevue.com/revuold.htm . There's plenty of articles and brochures there. Marque enthusiasts for many other marques have done similar things, so your museum is quite big already!

For example go to http://perso.wanadoo.fr/automobiles-voisin/

[Ali Baba]

I could correct your use of the Dutch language (but I won't).

I have to correct you though on Voisin: Voisin was a car manufacturer in it's own right, and had nothing to do with Bugatti. There may be some similar bodies on individual cars (which were often coach built by other companies), and there are some other similarities also, like the fact that both were busy in the aviation business also.

About the documentation museum: The virtual version (which is best accessible to anybody) is already online! Mostly organised by individual marque, there are loads of informations, taken from books, sometimes copied articles or scans of period advertising material and brochures. Google may be used as an index to this museum.

Take a look for example on http://www.BugattiRevue.com and especially in it's back issue index on http://www.BugattiRevue.com/revuold.htm . There's plenty of articles and brochures there. Marque enthusiasts for many other marques have done similar things, so your museum is quite big already!

For example go to http://perso.wanadoo.fr/automobiles-voisin/

Heer Jakob Jan Horst (Jaap):Thanks a lot for Your Info.,Your website is a very good one,as well as the voisin's,However,Lots of folks prefer hard copy&models as well,as it's more'tangible',and traditional.
In addition to that,once such a museum established,a series of Car shows could be hosted on it's ground(Similar to events in Italy's Villa D'Este etc.).

[Matra et Alpine]

Sabakh El Khir!(Good Morning)!,You need to reply:'Sabakh el Nur'(Morning of Light.) Like Nuristan(land of light).
The reason I teach You My language,I try to help You to 'bridge the gap'.
so no more (ney mer in Scottish English) complaints about my English...unless of course You are all fluent in Arabic,And Understand'Maskhara el Kurdi'!.
Otherwise,I'll have to teach You all the Scottish English,and You all will be extremely 'frustrated'.(as You'll not be able tea understand a wee deoch an' doris,gang awa' etc.),anyway:I love a bonnie Lassie!.

Pleas dont' as you are all wrong.

And what part of Scotladn were you trygin to be anyway ?
There are as many varied dialects and words in Scotladn as there are across Europe.

It's NAE MAIR .... ( granted and as it's a SPOKEN dialect there are many spellings but yours doesnt' allow the reader to get the pronunciation even half right. )

You clearly cut and paste from web sites where you get your information
It's best not to say anythign and be thought the fool than post rubbish and prove it.
Harry Lauder ( Cos you posted phrases used in his songs ) is a cariacature created for the predominately Englishmusic halls and American audiences.
Please don't around saying you know Scots

SEE you did another one of those annoying tangents that people get on to you about.
( BTW, nice how you'cve vlustered anyone who has a problem as it beign them? Do you know the ratio of those who have a problem and those who dont' so that you can develop that rationale ? )

[Matra et Alpine]

I'd like to know your oppinions.

have you read the rest of his threads ?
The problem is common an dbecause of it in other threads he has been guided, suggested , advised and second guessed to what he was meaning.
But instead of trygin to improve he woudl go off on tangents and deny everything is a problem -- depite the number of peopel who helped.
I think in here you are seeing the distillation of all teh other posts coming to a sharp point to prod with.

Yes, if this is the first of alli's threads it looks cruel>
If he doesn't change ( as he hasn't till now and shows no sings of chosing to do so ) then I give you permission to coem slap my wrists in a months time.... ( By which I think you will have flamed him at least once in antoerh thread )

[Matra et Alpine]

This kind of post is utter nonesense,So far We all communicated very well.

Sorry, Ali, despite all your posturing and speudo science, you are not being bullied.

You have posted rubbish, peopel tell you it causes problems. You tell them it is THER problem not yours.
In psychological circles THAT is a bullly too
So it woudl seem you are not so learned.

Keep it simple and to the point.
Dont' go off at tangets.

And to all that "understood" ----- who the hell was "MrX" so far one person has dropped it from comprehension, another has thought it to be some ephemeral nice coroprate charitable body and another has thought it to be "ali" himself.

PS: These all exist. Every countriy that makes cars has musems. In those musems the older material is held. Car manufacturers keep their own museums. At the times they merge the info often gets centralised or when bankrupt, sold or donated. Clubs maintain similar and are often the recipients and the best place for the data and materials to reside as it will be used and cherished. Finally, private collectors build their own collectiosn of cars and materials. Soem ultiamtely become open to the public eg Pedersons. So I'm not sure WHY it woudol be asked to set somethign liek this up ... unless in yrou own area for your own car it didnt' exist. Not many peopel will provide funds to set one up in an international community

[Ali Baba]

Sorry, Ali, despite all your posturing and speudo science, you are not being bullied.

You have posted rubbish, peopel tell you it causes problems. You tell them it is THER problem not yours.
In psychological circles THAT is a bullly too
So it woudl seem you are not so learned.

Keep it simple and to the point.
Dont' go off at tangets.

And to all that "understood" ----- who the hell was "MrX" so far one person has dropped it from comprehension, another has thought it to be some ephemeral nice coroprate charitable body and another has thought it to be "ali" himself.

PS: These all exist. Every countriy that makes cars has musems. In those musems the older material is held. Car manufacturers keep their own museums. At the times they merge the info often gets centralised or when bankrupt, sold or donated. Clubs maintain similar and are often the recipients and the best place for the data and materials to reside as it will be used and cherished. Finally, private collectors build their own collectiosn of cars and materials. Soem ultiamtely become open to the public eg Pedersons. So I'm not sure WHY it woudol be asked to set somethign liek this up ... unless in yrou own area for your own car it didnt' exist. Not many peopel will provide funds to set one up in an international community

I've been forewarned before(about not learning English from you),but now You printed it so beatifully,to justify the warning I received,and By The way,No matter,how much "rubbish" I posted in the past,You won the crown!(self evident in your last 3 posts).

[Ali Baba]

Pleas dont' as you are all wrong.

And what part of Scotladn were you trygin to be anyway ?
There are as many varied dialects and words in Scotladn as there are across Europe.

It's NAE MAIR .... ( granted and as it's a SPOKEN dialect there are many spellings but yours doesnt' allow the reader to get the pronunciation even half right. )

You clearly cut and paste from web sites where you get your information
It's best not to say anythign and be thought the fool than post rubbish and prove it.
Harry Lauder ( Cos you posted phrases used in his songs ) is a cariacature created for the predominately Englishmusic halls and American audiences.
Please don't around saying you know Scots

SEE you did another one of those annoying tangents that people get on to you about.
( BTW, nice how you'cve vlustered anyone who has a problem as it beign them? Do you know the ratio of those who have a problem and those who dont' so that you can develop that rationale ? )

Now We're no longer in state iof confusion(Con Fu Tze)!,but in the'State' of NANAVUT,(No kidding this tiny nation in Alyeska/Alaska,or Northern territories/terretoire de of Canada,(Kalada/Colada)!.isn't it freezing up here?!.
We need some FIRE!(like:feuer in der heusen).(Then We'd better be in Tierra Del Fuego,on the way to Antarctics,Anyway being native of NANA VUT,Me an' You kan(can) can can(Communicate) better,I presume,Please correct me,if I'm wrong(I see you're extremely determined to make me look wrong all along,so what's the use?).oh ne'er mind! The Sister of the convent like Me!.
Mairi's Wedding!!!.Nay mare 'rubbish',it has been replaced by'Horse manure'!.(My best friends in the USA are of Scottish ancestry,and they literally proved their real friendship by deeds,I wished to god,That I could return their favo(u)r,but i served 'em very well!.I also love the"Highland games",and the bagpipes.and the Edinburgh(Edinborough)'Tatoo',unfortunately recently it became too modern to my traditional ears!.

[Matra et Alpine]

It's Edinburgh. "Civilised" writers stopped using the wrong spelling for native locationd the world over decades ago.
It never was Edinborough If you know Scots so well THAT would have been corrected a long time ago.
"Burgh" from the old German.
Please refrain from posting errors, we just get tired making sure others dont get it wrong too

Get it right I am not having to wkr to make you look wrong.
You post errors. And such blatant ones they require correction -- or there will be thousands of UCPers thinkign it is ed-in-bor-row.

[Ali Baba]

It's Edinburgh. "Civilised" writers stopped using the wrong spelling for native locationd the world over decades ago.
It never was Edinborough If you know Scots so well THAT would have been corrected a long time ago.
"Burgh" from the old German.
Please refrain from posting errors, we just get tired making sure others dont get it wrong too

Get it right I am not having to wkr to make you look wrong.
You post errors. And such blatant ones they require correction -- or there will be thousands of UCPers thinkign it is ed-in-bor-row.

While from German Burg(h) is a town(not City,which is Stadt,not Staat which's state)Edin's Burgh,is in British English of England Edinborough,I learned that in My childhood,When an Italian immigrant there use to sell Ice Cream from an old 1950s Austin 'Devon' or'somerset' Delivery van(factory conversion),Trust Me,I didn't invented the word Edinborough!.

[Matra et Alpine]

Ali, shut up as you have just PROVEN that you are speaking nonsense.

EVERYONE else on UCP knows that Scotland is NOT in "British England of England" ( which isn't a place either btw ).

Scotland is an independant nation which signed an agreement to power share as part of a larger Great Britain and later the United Kingdom.

What you "learned" in your childhood was 100% wrong ( and you should question many of the other "facts" you have challenged people with too )

You may not have invented it -- but it IS an invention.

You NEVER were in Edinburgh. Prove it . Name the 3 most important Italian ice cream makers in Scotland ? Who has the shop in Portobello ? Which one in the West is the most well known ?

IF you had ever been in Edinburgh, two things would be DEFINITE.

FIRST, you'd know it was NOT a borough because it's name pre-dates any connection with England !

SECOND, and most important, you would know that NEVER does Scotland get described as part of England and if you were selling from a 1950s van then you post-dated the rise of Scottish Nationalism which shouted that from the highest rooftops.

Caught out. So tell the truth who are you really ?
Either a kid fluent in the use of Google .....
or based on the poor English structure and jumping off at tangents to questions you are an automated computer program trying to pass the Turing test (and failing) See http://www.turinghub.com/ for the similarities

[Sauc3]

While from German Burg(h) is a town(not City,which is Stadt,not Staat which's state)Edin's Burgh,is in British English of England Edinborough,I learned that in My childhood,When an Italian immigrant there use to sell Ice Cream from an old 1950s Austin 'Devon' or'somerset' Delivery van(factory conversion),Trust Me,I didn't invented the word Edinborough!.

Nip nuck ku scaggit? Nuomiga tiurg, mitwurly pioti ot murtao pukler nehgra furli, hubrac liona. Nutrani geolan pioti kenvar jegla. Wurniog porwane ku i luhr netud.

[Ali Baba]

Ali, shut up as you have just PROVEN that you are speaking nonsense.

EVERYONE else on UCP knows that Scotland is NOT in "British England of England" ( which isn't a place either btw ).

Scotland is an independant nation which signed an agreement to power share as part of a larger Great Britain and later the United Kingdom.

What you "learned" in your childhood was 100% wrong ( and you should question many of the other "facts" you have challenged people with too )

You may not have invented it -- but it IS an invention.

You NEVER were in Edinburgh. Prove it . Name the 3 most important Italian ice cream makers in Scotland ? Who has the shop in Portobello ? Which one in the West is the most well known ?

IF you had ever been in Edinburgh, two things would be DEFINITE.

FIRST, you'd know it was NOT a borough because it's name pre-dates any connection with England !

SECOND, and most important, you would know that NEVER does Scotland get described as part of England and if you were selling from a 1950s van then you post-dated the rise of Scottish Nationalism which shouted that from the highest rooftops.

Caught out. So tell the truth who are you really ?
Either a kid fluent in the use of Google .....
or based on the poor English structure and jumping off at tangents to questions you are an automated computer program trying to pass the Turing test (and failing) See http://www.turinghub.com/ for the similarities

According to Dr. Vladimir Vesselov(Pronounce Vesselyov): I'm a humanoid robot,Thanks for the link,Take a stroll down Pricess st. and cimb up to the castle,as you pass by the'tenament' houses to the other side,try tea enjoy the view!.I never said that Scotland is England,Scotland,like Wakes&Northern Ireland are parts of the U.K. of G.B.(I don't use 'google'),
Who do You think I'm?(I think I'm Myself),but You made toomany wrong assumptions,that we could compile them together,and create an encyclopedia(not to worry You'll get your share of 'copyright royalties').Tha mi s'gith!.

[Ali Baba]

Nip nuck ku scaggit? Nuomiga tiurg, mitwurly pioti ot murtao pukler nehgra furli, hubrac liona. Nutrani geolan pioti kenvar jegla. Wurniog porwane ku i luhr netud.

I like to respond to you in: Scottish(&Irish) Gàidhlig :
1st)Tha mi s'gith!.
2nd)Fàilte, 3rd)Halò ! 4th)Ciamar a tha thu?(in The island of Skye/Western Hebrides We say:Kha Me ra ha Shu?)I hope Well)!.5th)Tapadh leat (Spasiba in Russian,it gave you a clue here). 6th)Dè an t-ainm a tha ort?(the real one please)!6th)Slàinte!(in Swedish/Svenske:Skaal/Skal,pronounced:Skol,another hint).
Now could you translate that'narischkeiten' that you copied& pasted from somewhere on the internet?!.
"Westering Home'just in case You get too confused,refer not only to the Highlands(Hielands),but also to the Western Isles(Hebrides).,I admire Your&matra's desire to learn scottish,I personally prefers the Scottish songs,especially the ones sung in Celtic (or:Gaelic Scottish),and I like to give you both a treat (may be We could sing it together,as it's one o' my childhood's favo(u)rites:
Séist
Tha mi sgìth 's mi leam fhìn,
Buain na rainich, buain na rainich
Tha mi sgìth 's mi leam fhìn,
Buain na rainich daonnan

1
Cùl an tomain, braigh an tomain,
Cùl an tomain, bhòidhich,
Cùl an tomain, braigh an tomain,
'H-uile là a'm' onar

2
'S tric a bha mi fhìn 's mo leannan
Anns a' ghleannan cheòthar,
'G éisdeachd còisir bhinn an doire
Seinn 's a' choille chòmhail;

3
O na 'm faicinn thu a' tighinn,
Ruithinn 'dhol 'nad chòdhail,
Ach mur tig thu 'n seo 'gam shireadh,
Ciamar thilleas dòchas?

4
Anns an t-sithean, o, gur sgìth mi;
'S tric mo chridh' 'ga leonadh,
'N uair bhios càch a' seinn nan luinneag
Cha dean mis' ach crònan.

5
'S bochd nach robh mi leat a rithist,
Sinn a bhitheadh ceòlmhór,
Rachainn leat gu cùl na cruinne,
Air bhàrr tuinne seòladh.

6
Ciod am feum dhomh bhi ri tuireadh?
Dé ni tuireadh dhomhsa
'S mi cho fada o gach duine
B'urrain tighinn 'gam chòmhnadh?
Now it's Matra et alpine turn to translate 'Mairi's Wedding',or even'Glencoe'(massacre in Glencoe).

[Matra et Alpine]

What a wally - a good Scottish term you can look up

So where do we start in the dissection ?

I know at the beginning ....

I never said that Scotland is England,Scotland,like Wakes&Northern Ireland are parts of the U.K. of G.B.(I don't use 'google'),

YOU said "Edin's Burgh,is in British English of England Edinborough"
and now you claim you didn't say Edinburgh (which IS in Scotland) was in England ?

Yeah right.

PS it's NOT the UK of GB either You dig deeper holes the more you type !!!!!

Another Scottish word for you --- dumpling.

Take a stroll down Pricess st. and cimb up to the castle,as you pass by the'tenament' houses to the other side

You spell it tenement no 'a' !!!! and it's PRINCES !!!!!!

Who do You think I'm?(I think I'm Myself),but You made toomany wrong assumptions,that we could compile them together,and create an encyclopedia(not to worry You'll get your share of 'copyright royalties').Tha mi s'gith!.

Well let's see.
So far we've found more errors in your writings than we can shake a stick at.

No asssumptions but one VERY LARGE ASS

BTW, neatly avoiding the questions that would have proved you had been in Scotland. I'll await those -- I guess you're not finding THOSE answers so easy to search, cut-and-paste from the internet then !!!!

I like to respond to you in: Scottish(&Irish) Gàidhlig :

Very good.
BUT what has that to do with it ?
We can all cut-and-paste and you do SO much of it it is so obvious and only confirms your stupidity in thinking anyone believes any of the BS you write
PS: Scottish and Irish Gaelic are different !!!!!

The island of Skye/Western Hebrides We say:Kha Me ra ha Shu?)

Oh "WE" say do "WE" ?
OK, who owns the chip shop in Portree ?
ZING --- you'll not find that in google either !!!

Now could you translate that'narischkeiten' that you copied& pasted from somewhere on the internet?!.

What the hell are you on about ?
You are the only one demosntrating a capacity to cut and paste drivel and pass it off as personal knowledge.
Yours is the childish fantasies we had all found funny and good to ridicule.
But now it is getting like the little retarded kid and you have moved onto my sympathy meter

"Westering Home'just in case You get too confused,refer not only to the Highlands(Hielands),but also to the Western Isles(Hebrides).,I admire Your&matra's desire to learn scottifoundfunnysh,I personally prefers the Scottish songs,especially the ones sung in Celtic (or:Gaelic Scottish),and I like to give you both a treat (may be We could sing it together,as it's one o' my childhood's favo(u)rites:

Look you doughball ( another good Scots term ) you are as much Scottish and been near Scotland as I am Martian and grew up on the moon.
You've avoided every actual question that you could only have known if your lies had been true.
so QED, you're a lying saddo

Now it's Matra et alpine turn to translate 'Mairi's Wedding',or even'Glencoe'(massacre in Glencoe).

ZING> Another FATAL mistake of someone trying to pass themselves of as knowing anything about Scotland.
Less than 5% of the population ( and growing smaller daily ) speak and write Gaelic.
I can speak a few words, but as a sassenach I wouldn't profess to know otherwise.

You would have done well NOT to have continued to show your ignorance of facts about Scotland that ANYONE who had ever lived here as you claimed would have known.

You are caught with your pants down

LIAR !!


AND so we reach the point where you can either be honest and tell the truth and you can earn respect and enjoy UCP or you can avoid the questions, keep lying and realise you WILL be the brunt of jokes and NOBODY will then believe a single word you type ( I'm at the point where I dont' believe ANY of the nouns, only a couple of the verbs )

[Ali Baba]

What a wally - a good Scottish term you can look up

So where do we start in the dissection ?

I know at the beginning ....

YOU said "Edin's Burgh,is in British English of England Edinborough"
and now you claim you didn't say Edinburgh (which IS in Scotland) was in England ?

Yeah right.

PS it's NOT the UK of GB either You dig deeper holes the more you type !!!!!

Another Scottish word for you --- dumpling.

You spell it tenement no 'a' !!!! and it's PRINCES !!!!!!

Well let's see.
So far we've found more errors in your writings than we can shake a stick at.

No asssumptions but one VERY LARGE ASS

BTW, neatly avoiding the questions that would have proved you had been in Scotland. I'll await those -- I guess you're not finding THOSE answers so easy to search, cut-and-paste from the internet then !!!!

Very good.
BUT what has that to do with it ?
We can all cut-and-paste and you do SO much of it it is so obvious and only confirms your stupidity in thinking anyone believes any of the BS you write
PS: Scottish and Irish Gaelic are different !!!!!

Oh "WE" say do "WE" ?
OK, who owns the chip shop in Portree ?
ZING --- you'll not find that in google either !!!

What the hell are you on about ?
You are the only one demosntrating a capacity to cut and paste drivel and pass it off as personal knowledge.
Yours is the childish fantasies we had all found funny and good to ridicule.
But now it is getting like the little retarded kid and you have moved onto my sympathy meter

Look you doughball ( another good Scots term ) you are as much Scottish and been near Scotland as I am Martian and grew up on the moon.
You've avoided every actual question that you could only have known if your lies had been true.
so QED, you're a lying saddo

ZING> Another FATAL mistake of someone trying to pass themselves of as knowing anything about Scotland.
Less than 5% of the population ( and growing smaller daily ) speak and write Gaelic.
I can speak a few words, but as a sassenach I wouldn't profess to know otherwise.

You would have done well NOT to have continued to show your ignorance of facts about Scotland that ANYONE who had ever lived here as you claimed would have known.

You are caught with your pants down

LIAR !!


AND so we reach the point where you can either be honest and tell the truth and you can earn respect and enjoy UCP or you can avoid the questions, keep lying and realise you WILL be the brunt of jokes and NOBODY will then believe a single word you type ( I'm at the point where I dont' believe ANY of the nouns, only a couple of the verbs )

Princess (not Princes,So You're just as bad as Im)st.And tenements,Yet with all Your supposed knowledge,you couldn't figure'who am I'?!.and instead,you enjoy hurling insults,which put you in bad light,in a psychological way,I'll ask you,really,did you ever gave a thought to the simple idea,of image you project,when you express yourself like that?!.Think about it,You hurt Yourself in the long & short run.in other words,you don't look better that Ali Bambi!.
Remember,I prefer Russians over 'Pollacks',and good Scottish folks over the ones that'falls by the wayside'.And worse...You made too many wrong assumptions,motivated by your's negative emotions,Which's unhealthy...Who needs high blood pressure?!.Then You got so far away from the original topic of discussion...and 'We both got lost' somewhere.I could even imagined,that You would be cooperative,abd as result,I'm not anticipating as such,however,I feel like a fine person who like to help others,who won't cooperate,Should I 'give up'?!,No!,I just keeps hoping for improvement,it's extremely difficult condition,it's like I tried to help My Irish Scottish friend here,Who continues to smoke&drink,I was successful partially,as he didn't ended homeless,but I wish i could help him a little bit more,but no move there so far,it doesn't mean,that I'm about to give up,on fellow human being,I just need to be more patient,it's a good attitude to start with...Patience!.