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Thread: VW engine modellling

  1. #16
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    I saw a WWII aircraft engine and it had 3 cylinders connected together in the middle like the benz badge and then there were 8 more of those in a rotated shape for a total of 27 cylinders. It put out about 2000-3000hp

  2. #17
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    Does Cosmos allow you to determine the mesh element-type, size and distribution? I like solidworks but its analysis tools seem to be way too automatic. For my degree project I used I-DEAS, the modeling tools are useless but it interfaces nicley with SW. The calculations arent as 'pretty' as solidworks but seem to be more accurate.

    Also, how do you like CosmosMotion?

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jediali
    Nice to see some imagination! i think we should appraoch engine design standng as far back as possible so not to be influenced ny current accepted trends. In answering your questions:

    1)airplane rotary engines have done what your taking about but jet engines become more efficient in that era.
    2) There are only so many conrods that can connect to a given length of crankshaft. See veyron W16 as an example of lots of conrods powering a short crankshaft. so a WW24 (think about it) engine would be pretty crowded.

    The possibilities are certainly there though!
    It could work though right? I daydream about these things in school. I have plenty of time to perfect it.

  4. #19
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    Holy crap jediali, that looks pretty sweet. I had an intro course in Solidworks and about all I could do was draw boxes with holes in 'em! You made that from scratch?

    I don't know too much about the advanced techincal side of cars - I just know the basics. I've read up about different engine designs and the vibration and such, but don't exactly understand a balancing rod (is that right?) How does it work? Does it command the way the pistons fire in - because I thought that was the crankshaft. Just help explain this to a fool learning to be an engineer (only 2nd year mechanical).

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by jediali
    In relation to my last post an image of a V10 crank stress test i have done. This cranshaft has stroke of 39.89mm as the F1 one i based it on.
    Isn't this a picture of the crank deformation not stress?

    Also, there only two boundary conditions? One, the left most face of the shaft is fixed, and two the right most face has a torque applied. Is that correct?
    "In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they are not."

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyperl
    Does Cosmos allow you to determine the mesh element-type, size and distribution? I like solidworks but its analysis tools seem to be way too automatic. For my degree project I used I-DEAS, the modeling tools are useless but it interfaces nicley with SW. The calculations arent as 'pretty' as solidworks but seem to be more accurate.

    Also, how do you like CosmosMotion?
    The advanced package includes

    cosmosworks - FEA, you can specift mesh options, but it isnt as advanced as abaques or what your talking about. its cad first FEA second.

    cosmosmotion - vector motion analaysis
    setting up motions, springs, forces, graphs can be a pain but it is very accurate, my calculations tend to agree with it. plus you can create avi's from it

    flowworks FEA flow design - computational flow analysis, still figuring this one out
    Last edited by jediali; 11-15-2006 at 05:43 AM.
    autozine.org

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kitdy
    Holy crap jediali, that looks pretty sweet. I had an intro course in Solidworks and about all I could do was draw boxes with holes in 'em! You made that from scratch?

    I don't know too much about the advanced techincal side of cars - I just know the basics. I've read up about different engine designs and the vibration and such, but don't exactly understand a balancing rod (is that right?) How does it work? Does it command the way the pistons fire in - because I thought that was the crankshaft. Just help explain this to a fool learning to be an engineer (only 2nd year mechanical).
    a 2nd year is great and you probably would understand.

    I split ALL unbalanced forces form the crankshaft,conrods and pistons into either rotary or reciprocal unbalanced mass. I then designed each COUNTERWEIGHT to cater for each bearing load.
    autozine.org

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alastor
    Isn't this a picture of the crank deformation not stress?

    Also, there only two boundary conditions? One, the left most face of the shaft is fixed, and two the right most face has a torque applied. Is that correct?
    yes, here are all pictures from the test.
    - stress
    - strain
    - displacement
    - FOS

    This was a simple torque test simulating a 500Nm impluse. I then worked down crankshaft keeping the same fixed constraint and twisting the crankpins instead to see how offset torques worked out. The next stage was fatigue testing which was harder because getting an accurate S-N curve is tricky.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    autozine.org

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kitdy
    Holy crap jediali, that looks pretty sweet. I had an intro course in Solidworks and about all I could do was draw boxes with holes in 'em! You made that from scratch?

    I don't know too much about the advanced techincal side of cars - I just know the basics. I've read up about different engine designs and the vibration and such, but don't exactly understand a balancing rod (is that right?) How does it work? Does it command the way the pistons fire in - because I thought that was the crankshaft. Just help explain this to a fool learning to be an engineer (only 2nd year mechanical).
    Solidworks is quite easy once you get into it. I made them from scratch because i had experience with the software. If you want to make some cool stuff just spend time learning what all the buttons are. Chances are you have used a lot of the features already its just how to best use them. best of luck, if you have any specific questions Kitdy just ask and i might be able to answer.
    autozine.org

  10. #25
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    To revive this:

    Today i got an assignment. Guess what it was? I have to design (and animate) the crankshaft,con rod,pistons,valves etc. with Autodesk Inventor(solidworks competitor). It is a bit tough though. I need some sizes and measurements from an engine. I went by a Citroen dealership,but they couldnt really help me any further. (Maybe any one knows some ?) I now email PSAFrance and CitroenNetherlands.

    When i get some basic design stuff done i will come back and post screenshots I dont think the piston,crankshaft and con rod will take much longer than an hour to draw ... I maybe just need to resize/adjust it a bit later on.

    This engine will also be fitted to the drivetrain i am currently designing and calculating. This will be mounted on a self-designed chassis end of the year. Then we have to cooporate with IPO (industrial product design) students for the body and basic ex/interior design. The best person's designs will be built in 1:1 scale mock-up version next year

    Man i love this education We get to do so many really cool things,which also have huge educative value for later What could a clever car nut ask for more ?

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by drakkie View Post
    To revive this:

    Today i got an assignment. Guess what it was? I have to design (and animate) the crankshaft,con rod,pistons,valves etc. with Autodesk Inventor(solidworks competitor). It is a bit tough though. I need some sizes and measurements from an engine. I went by a Citroen dealership,but they couldnt really help me any further. (Maybe any one knows some ?) I now email PSAFrance and CitroenNetherlands.

    When i get some basic design stuff done i will come back and post screenshots I dont think the piston,crankshaft and con rod will take much longer than an hour to draw ... I maybe just need to resize/adjust it a bit later on.

    This engine will also be fitted to the drivetrain i am currently designing and calculating. This will be mounted on a self-designed chassis end of the year. Then we have to cooporate with IPO (industrial product design) students for the body and basic ex/interior design. The best person's designs will be built in 1:1 scale mock-up version next year

    Man i love this education We get to do so many really cool things,which also have huge educative value for later What could a clever car nut ask for more ?
    did you finish this..can we see it?
    autozine.org

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by jediali View Post
    did you finish this..can we see it?
    I am sorry I kind of forgot to post it. Because of time problems on school i did not complete it entirely back then. The neccesary animation was not done and some components are not exactly to size, for example the crank shaft needed some extra rounded edges and stuff...

    For now I have lost the DVD with reports,data, PPT's and 3D-CAD files of the second half of the first semester. When I find it, I will definately not forget about this again

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by drakkie View Post
    I am sorry I kind of forgot to post it. Because of time problems on school i did not complete it entirely back then. The neccesary animation was not done and some components are not exactly to size, for example the crank shaft needed some extra rounded edges and stuff...

    For now I have lost the DVD with reports,data, PPT's and 3D-CAD files of the second half of the first semester. When I find it, I will definately not forget about this again
    i was just interested..dont worry too much
    autozine.org

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by jediali View Post
    i was just interested..dont worry too much
    Yea I know But a promise is a promise so I should keep it. I'll do my best searching the bloody DVD in this huge mess called my room.

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