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Thread: Corvette Killer? Viper '08 is coming!

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slicks
    I dont see your logic, since when does air add weight? Displacement is NOT size of the engine...
    The point of adding displacement is they can make more USEABLE(flat torque curve) power while still in a relaxed state of tune.
    And lets not compare the cardboard Speed Six which wouldnt not pass emissions or crash tests here, which the Viper has to deal with.
    And as already stated, it does, and always has handled. You really need to stop watching top gear...
    You need to do some research on the Speed Six engine. The 380BHP @ 7000RPM the the speed six makes in the Sagaris is VERY USEABLE. For instance, the Sagaris is capable of naught to sixty in only 3.7 seconds, and to get to 100 only takes another 4.4-and for the hoes at home, that's 0-100mph in 8.1 seconds. Enlarging is not, I'll say that again, is not a bad thing, however, when the engine is already 8L there is no need to make it bigger.

    Of course, you attack the reliability and quality of the Speed Six, because as a good American that's what you do. You use a grossly generalised and quite outdated beleif about something to make it look weak, rather than elevating what you are supporting, simply cut down the competion. Almost all of the issues with the speed six, by all accounts, were resolved before the end of production. Yes, there still were the engines the burn up at 10 and 12 thousand miles, but those were the exception and not the rule.
    Go n-ithe an cat thu, is go n-ithe an diabhal an cat

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  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by fisetdavid26
    I can't believe american manufacturers are still making bigger and bigger engines. Not just them in fact. Come on, gas prices skyrocketed last year, they went down I know, but darn it's still a 8.4 liter engine! Not to forget Earth seems tired of all that polution.
    Quote Originally Posted by -What-
    Sure, blame America you uninformed....person.

    EVERY Ferrari and EVERY Lamborghini burns more gas and pollutes the Earth more than the current Viper. This 8.4 liter Viper is supposed to burn cleaner. Shut up, America didn't ruin your Christmas, blame Europe.
    I will gladly accept your humble comment of me being ignorant when you will read correctly what I said. I'm not only blaming America, I'm blaming to whole industry. I put in bold my correct statement. I aimed at american manufacturers in particular because Dodge is an... american manufacturer. My Christmas didn't suffer at all. No need to use "shut up" you know.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slicks
    I cannot belive how ignorant you are...
    Then explain me why I'm so ignorant saying cars pollute. I don't get it. No need to call me ignorant or stupid you know, and that's good for both of you. I just tried to give my two cents, not to get flamed. It is a fact that Earth is polluted. And making a 8.4 liter engine certainly won't help, even if it is extremely clean. It still pollute. That's what I'm saying. I know engines nowadays are cleaner. I know. So explain your point.
    Last edited by fisetdavid26; 12-29-2006 at 11:11 AM.
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  3. #63
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    However much a staunch enviromentalist I am, especially when it comes to cars, but pollution shouldn't even be on the list of things to cover when designing a supercar. These are ultra low production vehicles that are designed to be driven fast, and not often. It should be an afterthought.
    TOYNBEE IDEA IN KUBRICK 2001 RESURRECT DEAD ON PLANET JUPITER

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Esperante
    However much a staunch enviromentalist I am, especially when it comes to cars, but pollution shouldn't even be on the list of things to cover when designing a supercar. These are ultra low production vehicles that are designed to be driven fast, and not often. It should be an afterthought.
    That's why I have no problem with de-catting Cerberas. When I explain to people what de-catting is and talk about doing it to ultra high performance cars, they often look at me as if I'm talking about cannibalism! In fact, maybe some of those eco-mentalist bigots wouldn't mind jumping off a cliff, because they're polluting too...!
    "This is hardcore." - Evo's John Barker on the TVR Tuscan S

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by ADRENALINE

    Modifying quotes IS breaking the rules. People have been banned for doing so.
    Umm yeah, people...

    Can we ban this guy yet? I mean C'mon Sauc3! You can do it! Banned me for crying out loud...well editing posts actually...

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clivey
    That's why I have no problem with de-catting Cerberas. When I explain to people what de-catting is and talk about doing it to ultra high performance cars, they often look at me as if I'm talking about cannibalism! In fact, maybe some of those eco-mentalist bigots wouldn't mind jumping off a cliff, because they're polluting too...!
    Amen my brother! De-cat Cerb or de-cat Griff=perfection.
    Go n-ithe an cat thu, is go n-ithe an diabhal an cat

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  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by ruim20
    WOW 600bhp from a 8.4l v10, Impressive! (pause)........................................... .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ..............NOT!
    "borat"
    WOW hp/l is............................... a grade school argument.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matra et Alpine
    All other things being equal it DOES.
    It requres larger heads or larger bores with larger pistons or longer cranks.
    Of course better alloys and design can make the engine lighter/smaller, but that wasn't what you were asying was it ?
    The "larger" means more metal.

    Hey, long time no see old friend.
    Better breathing heads do not = bigger heads, nor are physically bigger heads required, when the block has not changed. Good example off the top of my head, the LS2 is wearing LS6 heads, but both have different displacement.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slicks
    WOW hp/l is............................... a grade school argument.
    Why do you find it so irritating when HP/L is mentioned.

    Surely, 600bhp is far more impressive when it comes from a 2L 4cyl than when it comes from an 8L 10cyl.
    Last edited by Mr.Tiv; 12-29-2006 at 01:17 PM.
    Go n-ithe an cat thu, is go n-ithe an diabhal an cat

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  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Tiv
    Amen my brother! De-cat Cerb or de-cat Griff=perfection.
    Which TVRs have you ridden in? I'd imagine opportunities are scarce what with you living in the U.S.A.

    I know someone who owns a 1999 Chimaera 4.0 and even though it's the baby, it's still got both bark and bite. I met the owner, Steve, through my girlfriends' parents. During the summer, they took me round to see the Chimaera and after a look round it, I got a ride in it.

    100mph cornering, uphill through an English village.

    There was such a sense of energy and power, I could not do anything but keep my eyes fixed on the next apex - if I would have looked anwhere else I wouldn't have been prepared to feel my stomach trying to exit my body through my ribcage.

    Despite that though, I was amazed at the suppleness of the ride. I've been in a Griffith 500 and remember using my hands to lift my backside off the seat over speed bumps but, even through the road surface in this area leaves a lot to be desired, it felt more comfortable than my parents' Minis and possibly even more than my car.

    The noise is something else. I have a bad quality sound recording off my phone (.amr format if anyone's interested) but even that sounds orgasmic.

    Steve drove the car into a dry field through an open gate so I could get some pics, that's when I took the sound recording, shortly before the farmer came into the field with his tractor, and with a 'we are not amused' face, announced that he was shutting the gate.

    I saw Steve and the car again on Christmas day, heading towards the local pub on a country road, there was a van in front of the Chimaera but as soon as it tuned off, Steve didn't even need to change down to leave my girlfriends' dad's 528i SE for dust. Fantastic car.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    "This is hardcore." - Evo's John Barker on the TVR Tuscan S

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Tiv
    Why do you find it so irritating when HP/L is mentioned.

    Surely, 600bhp is far more impressive when it comes from a 2L 4cyl than when it comes from an 8L 10cyl.
    You're not getting anywhere near 600hp without lots of boost. And even when you do, the powerband is going to be useless for the street.
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  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Tiv
    You need to do some research on the Speed Six engine. The 380BHP @ 7000RPM the the speed six makes in the Sagaris is VERY USEABLE. For instance, the Sagaris is capable of naught to sixty in only 3.7 seconds, and to get to 100 only takes another 4.4-and for the hoes at home, that's 0-100mph in 8.1 seconds. Enlarging is not, I'll say that again, is not a bad thing, however, when the engine is already 8L there is no need to make it bigger.
    Thank you talking parrot of Jeremy Clarkson.
    1.) No where did I say that the TVR doesnt have a "usable" power band.
    2.) 0-60 etc. doest show anything about usable power, look at a rolling 5-60mph if you want to see that. For example the EVO is able to do a 0-60 in under 5 seconds, but 5-60 takes around 7 seconds. Why? Well for one the AWD allows for a full throttle (or close to) launch, but it also has to do with lack of low end power.
    "Usable power" refers to the torque curve, the flatter it is (from idle to redline) the more usable power there is.

    Of course, you attack the reliability and quality of the Speed Six, because as a good American that's what you do.
    lol...wtf...

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quiggs
    You're not getting anywhere near 600hp without lots of boost. And even when you do, the powerband is going to be useless for the street.
    I am simply saying that HP/L shouldn't be discounted, nor am I saying that it's the only thing to consider.


    And Slicks. I have watched 2, maybe 3 episodes of Top Gear on YouTube, he doesn't seem to like TVR, so what the hell are you getting at?
    Go n-ithe an cat thu, is go n-ithe an diabhal an cat

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  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by fisetdavid26
    Then explain me why I'm so ignorant saying cars pollute. I don't get it. No need to call me ignorant or stupid you know, and that's good for both of you. I just tried to give my two cents, not to get flamed. It is a fact that Earth is polluted. And making a 8.4 liter engine certainly won't help, even if it is extremely clean. It still pollute. That's what I'm saying. I know engines nowadays are cleaner. I know. So explain your point.
    You make it sound like making the engine "bigger" (bigger displacement) will hurt gas milage. This is what you believe right?
    Gas milage is directly related to how much green house gas is put out, so the better gas milage, the less green house gas.
    Now, displacement has very little to do with gas milage, weight and gearing are the biggest factors here(also aerodynamics for highway gas milage).
    Quick example, the BMW M5 with a 500hp 5L V10 pollutes MORE than the 525hp, 8.3L V10 in 05 Viper.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Tiv
    Why do you find it so irritating when HP/L is mentioned.

    Surely, 600bhp is far more impressive when it comes from a 2L 4cyl than when it comes from an 8L 10cyl.
    No, not in the least bit.
    hp/l is irrelivent as a performance figure because peak hp tells you very little, and displacement tells you nothing at all.
    If you want to compare "awe factors" look at power to weight, or physical size of the engine.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Tiv
    I am simply saying that HP/L shouldn't be discounted, nor am I saying that it's the only thing to consider.
    It should be completely forgotten, its a fanboy argument.
    Ill set up a scenario, say you want to build a performance kit car. You have 2 engines, A and B, both are making 400hp. Engine A is 5L, 300lbs. Engine B is 4L 500lbs, and physically bigger than engine A. Which would you be more impressed by?

    And Slicks. I have watched 2, maybe 3 episodes of Top Gear on YouTube, he doesn't seem to like TVR, so what the hell are you getting at?
    Your whole "naught to 60" bit.
    Last edited by Slicks; 12-29-2006 at 01:42 PM.

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