My New Car

[Clivey]

Don't get an aygo sport, all you get is body coloured trim and alloy wheels, so its really not worth it. Infact, don't get either. A Fiat Panda 100hp costs about the same to buy and insure AND its supposed to be more fun.

What have you been smoking? All versions of the Aygo are in insurance group 1E whereas the Panda 100HP is in group 5, which is one higher than my car. He'd be paying well over £1,600/year under his own name to insure one. Not only that but the Aygo is only about 2/3 of the Panda 100HP's price.

I've noticed a trend on UCP recently; Everybody's obsessed with the top of the range designation from any given model range. "Ooh, I want a Sport GT Lightweight Luxury LWB Track Day Special!!!1one." Nobody's happy with anything less than the top of the range - a stupid obsession that'll come to bear when insurance is due! A much more realistic approach would be to compare a Panda 1.2 petrol or 1.3 diesel to the Aygo.

In the category we're talking about here: Superminis, price is everything - especially when you consider that most of the drivers are relatively new.

The quickest cars for the money (including insurance) are the last-gen Clio, Corsa and Punto 1.4's in middle-range designations (Dynamique / SXi / Dynamic) without A/C. I should know, I own one (Corsa) and despite what the heavily prejudiced and opinionated (probably due to backhanders) British press say, it's a fun car to drive.*

*The British press (Top Gear etc.), have repeatedly criticised the Corsa for one of having lacklustre handling qualities leading to very pronounced understeer...in my experience the solution to that is to actually bother to put the laptop down and turn the steering wheel.

[jediali]

*The British press (Top Gear etc.), have repeatedly criticised the Corsa for one of having lacklustre handling qualities leading to very pronounced understeer...in my experience the solution to that is to actually bother to put the laptop down and turn the steering wheel.

Any car in this class driven wrong is going to understeer. Most of the reports regarding the new corsa say its a great allrounder, but i wouldn't expect a car like this to shine in handling like say a crisper fiesta. Are these cars get heavier they are losing steering feel? The new Clio, 107 and corsa are quite big so perhaps are getting more electronic assistance in the steering.

[Clivey]

Any car in this class driven wrong is going to understeer. Most of the reports regarding the new corsa say its a great allrounder, but i wouldn't expect a car like this to shine in handling like say a crisper fiesta. Are these cars get heavier they are losing steering feel? The new Clio, 107 and corsa are quite big so perhaps are getting more electronic assistance in the steering.

I'm talking about the last-generation Corsa 'D' (not to be confused with diesel) models (2001-2006).

Mine's a 2004 "04-reg" 1.4i16v Twinport Sxi 3-door. And the answer is that my cars' steering is ridiculously light and way too-over assisted and therefore produces little to no steering feel BUT that doesn't go to say that my car unsersteers!

Due to the light steering and, as it says in the brochure for my model "Lowered (15mm) and uprated sports suspension", my car is actually initially quicker to change direction than my dad's Mini. Outright cornering grip is pretty good, the front-end giving plenty of warning before the nose gets reluctant and lift-off oversteer can be provoked (the car also has hyper-sensitive throttle, clutch and pedals to match the steering) when you want it.

...but i wouldn't expect a car like this to shine in handling like say a crisper fiesta.

When the car still belonged to my mum, it was involved in an accident: http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/forum...highlight=Polo , the insurance company provided us with a rental car (Ford Fiesta), which was the Corsa's equivalent model (1.4i16v Zetec) albeit two years younger (06-reg). The car had about 900 miles on the clock when I had the chance to drive it, so it hadn't been intefered with but I have to say that compared to the Corsa as a drivers' car, the Fiesta was a dog.

The engine was lacklustre compared to the Corsa's, taking a further 2-seconds to reach 60 and feeling very underpowered in every situation. My dad drove it up to Scotland and back in the time we had it and echos these opinions saying that it was useless on the Motorway, guzzling more fuel than my car whilst being much slower at the same time.

Adding to this, the car had the general feel of a small MPV. It's bigger than the Corsa in every dimension and possibly has a smoother and quieter ride but the seats are far higher and together with the tall boxy body-shape leads to the MPV-like feel. It seems to attempt to use the door mirrors as stabilisers in the corners. TG lie. It rolls, a lot. The steering though, does have slightly more feel than the Corsa and a good initial turn-in.

Are these cars get heavier they are losing steering feel? The new Clio, 107 and corsa are quite big so perhaps are getting more electronic assistance in the steering.

I'm guessing that you mean the 207 (the 107 is the Aygo / C1 clone)?

The short answer is that as the new generation of Super"mini"'s become less and less 'mini', the performance is going down the toilet. They may have good steering (as I've said, it wouldn't be hard to improve on the Corsa D's steering feel) but they're getting much bigger and heavier whilst using the same engines.

Case in point: The 'new' Corsa 1.4 Sxi 3-door is over 100kgs heavier than my 2004 model and takes over 2-seconds longer to reach 60, whilst the fuel economy stays thew same (surely it should improve with a new model?)...

...1,000 posts! W00t!!!

[jediali]

congrats on a fine milenia post, and i'm happy because i stole it from you with my daft comments.

i did mean 207, sorry. I agree the fiesta fails in much of the ways you mentioned, and unfortunately i don't have the pleasure of testing these cars but to rely on various reviews which say that one area the fiesta excels is handling. Im not sure anyway.

[Waugh-terfall]

Don't get an aygo sport, all you get is body coloured trim and alloy wheels, so its really not worth it. Infact, don't get either. A Fiat Panda 100hp costs about the same to buy and insure AND its supposed to be more fun.

Hmm, I love Aygo Sports though, Panda 100HP is in group 1E for insurance??!!

[Clivey]

Hmm, I love Aygo Sports though, Panda 100HP is in group 1E for insurance??!!

...the Panda 100HP is in group 5...

Confucius says "Man who posts before reading thread look very silly."

If however you meant to be sarcastic with that comment, you should have used a smiley.

congrats on a fine milenia post, and i'm happy because i stole it from you with my daft comments.

Thanks! I wouldn't say that your comments are daft - you've raised the main issue with new-generation "Superminis" - the fact that they do NOT do what they say on the tin; and are bringing up relevant topics consistently. I wish the same could be said for everyone on the forum (not sniping at anyone in particular, certainly not in this thread).

[Waugh-terfall]

Whoops, I meant to use a Smiley. Ahwell, I think I've settled my eyes on a Yaris T3 1.3VVT-i or 1.4D-4D. BigSmall FTW!

[jediali]

Whoops, I meant to use a Smiley. Ahwell, I think I've settled my eyes on a Yaris T3 1.3VVT-i or 1.4D-4D. BigSmall FTW!

~ vast grey interiors all the way ~
~ not for me i say ~

[Ferrer]

Personally I'd rather have the Swift 1.3 or perhaps the Mazda 2 1.3.

[Waugh-terfall]

~ vast grey interiors all the way ~
~ not for me i say ~

The current ones rather nice, I've become a fan of Toyta with the recent Verso, Auris, RAV-4 & Yaris, not to mention Aygo, me recent ride in an 05 Verso T3 D-4D sort of concreted my new found likings of Toyota

Personally I'd rather have the Swift 1.3 or perhaps the Mazda 2 1.3.

Asif & I were talking about the Swift 1.3 & 1.5, but I think I'd rather the Toyota, it just has that edge to me over the Swift, if it were a Porshce Cayman 2.7 eating Swift Sport, that'd be another story... but I dunno, Mazda 2 isn't all that nice, plus it's being replaced anyway.

[h00t_h00t]

Hmm, I love Aygo Sports though, Panda 100HP is in group 1E for insurance??!!

I never said that, however it is cheaper than the Yaris T-sport you also talked about getting.

[Ferrer]

Asif & I were talking about the Swift 1.3 & 1.5, but I think I'd rather the Toyota, it just has that edge to me over the Swift, if it were a Porshce Cayman 2.7 eating Swift Sport, that'd be another story... but I dunno, Mazda 2 isn't all that nice, plus it's being replaced anyway.

Comparing both 1.3-litre engined Swift and Yaris lighter, more powerful, faster and 3 cm lower. The Yaris is slitghly cheaper and uses slitghly less fuel, but the difference isn't signicant in my opinion.

And the Mazda I'm talking about is the next one.

[Waugh-terfall]

Nah, Yaris T3, with alloys, lol, I want the 1.4D-4D Yaris, I haven't yet seen the new 2, I'll look in to them, but they'd be too expensive.

[h00t_h00t]

Remember that many new drivers have an accident in their first year, do you really want smash up a new-ish car? Buy an old banger to do all your learning in.

[Ferrer]

Nah, Yaris T3, with alloys, lol, I want the 1.4D-4D Yaris, I haven't yet seen the new 2, I'll look in to them, but they'd be too expensive.

Considering you're going for a diesel I don't think a base Mazda will be more expensive than it...