Factory Installed Roll Cages

[iwmakemh]

Ok, my topic just got big lol. I don't know much about all this crash safety stuff, but I think a safety cage, like what LeonOfTheDead talked about would make a lot more sense than a roll cage. Aren't these already integrated into newer cars? What are safety cages? Is it a roll cage hidden away in the body panels?

[johnnynumfiv]

The unibody of the car would be the equivalent to a "safety cage". The pillars and rocker panels of modern cars are made up of multiple layers of metal which gives it strength. The B pillars usually go across the roof to form a hoop. Also, there are anti intrusion bars inside the doors. Even the windshield is considered a structural piece of the car.

[iwmakemh]

I see, well my topic got some interesting posts XD I learned a few new things!

<end thread here>

[Matra et Alpine]

There are tubes that usually run off the central cage to the ends of the car for added stiffness. They usually mount to the ends of the frame rails/chassis. So those would make the crumple zones useless. You know I work on race cars for a living right?

jm what kind of cars are you thhinking of ?
No competition cars extend beyond the suspension mounting points for stiffness.
Are you thinking of "stock cars" whre bumping is normal and "crumple zones" are too hi-tec ?

[johnnynumfiv]

It's commonplace for drag cars along with stock cars. I'm talking full tube chassis cars though. With leaf springs, the rear mounts are near the end of the chassis so they will need something going back there. Also, rubbin' is racin' harry, so you usually have some extra tubing up front and in the back. With some production based road racing cars, I've seen the cage carried beyond the suspension pick up points.
But yea, with a sports racer, like a lotus 23, Ginettas, sports 2000, etc, the main structural chassis ends at the suspension pick up points and everything beyond that is moot, usually for holding radiators, bodywork, lights.

[Matra et Alpine]

As I thought it would be j5
Drag and stock makes sense as the tubing is all ther is to the chassis so with no front cross momebers and vlance then it's down to the tubing
Though even WRC works cars don't extend beyond the top suspension mounts and some cross bracing for the bottom and anti roll bar locators.
Nothing major out front -- excess weigth = bad.
Rear spring hangers I was forgetting about

As a reference, here's th International 06 spec WRC Impreza shwoing the link forward to the front suspension top turrets at the right and to the rear panel rop mount area to the left. The 07 is similar with extra cross bracing to increase compartment survivability in the worst cases and cope with multiple impacts.

[johnnynumfiv]

That wrc design looks similar to a 240z we have in the shop.

It's the same in the rear as the stock trunk and unibody is strong enough to support the fuel cell/bodywork.

I'll try to take some pictures of the scarab we have thats an all tube chassis. It's a little overkill in some spots.

[Matra et Alpine]

nic epic j5, showing the top mount strengthening/stiffening clearly.

[iwmakemh]

I want that in my life! lol

[CapnBoost]

RUF (famous Porsche rebuilder) has been integrating cages on their cars for some time. From what I read on other forums, they only do it when they take the car down to a bare frame, and it's not cheap.