2010 German Grand Prix (July 23 - 25)

[JRodrigues]

Who pays Massa's salary?

The problem is not who pays Massa's salary. It's who pays Alonso's...

[RacingManiac]

I personally have no issue with the existence of team order, be it as this kind where one driver yields to another or like Webber's situation last week. With RBR I think people are upset because its thought they are equal. While at Ferrari you'd think people are used to it. The issue though now is that without the fuel stop and real pit-strategy anymore, there are little room a team can actually make it happen, and with the radio comm free for all to hear they can't be too discrete neither. Unlike the Schumacher era of team order though, there are explicit rules now that spells out you can't manipulate the race result through that, something that does not exist back then. So even if Massa were to make it less obvious, all the radio messages that lead up to it can make you draw the same conclusion anyway...

Now its more of a rule violation thing, and if FIA/WMSC does not do anything more than just the $100K fine, then really having such a rule makes little sense, since they thrown the book at drivers this year for smaller things, for something like this(that can be rightly argued as race fixing, now that regs are written as such) and no severe penalty are imposed, then really its them declaring it as open season for more team order to take place on track...

[fpv_gtho]

With RBR I think people are upset because its thought they are equal.

That may be the case for the most part, but a fair few people are getting sick of Horner and the way he talks to the media, and the perception of how the team is being run like a puppet show.

[LeonOfTheDead]

I missed that part of the race, yet I'm fine with it.
Team orders are like the proverbial elephant in the room. This time, Massa stepped on his tail and here we go.

It is funny though to read on local newspapers how this "team order thing" is just a silly supposition by the rest of the world.

[wwgkd]

If F1 is a team sport, and it is set up like one, then I don't really have a problem with team orders. It has been made against the rules, so I'm also ok with the $100,000 fine. Further penalties would be pretty ridiculous though, given no one else has been punished for the several instances of team orders this year.

Massa was pretty obvious about it so fine, make a showing for the fans, but lets not go overboard.

[RacingManiac]

If F1 is a team sport, and it is set up like one, then I don't really have a problem with team orders. It has been made against the rules, so I'm also ok with the $100,000 fine. Further penalties would be pretty ridiculous though, given no one else has been punished for the several instances of team orders this year.

Massa was pretty obvious about it so fine, make a showing for the fans, but lets not go overboard.

I think the difference is the aspect of "manipulating the result". Stuff like the "front wing-gate" at RBR and this is that the whole front wing thing does not really impact the result directly(actually the opposite happened...), where as this caused a direct impact to how the race finished, which is I think how the rule was written to ban.

However, it really can be argued many different ways. Considering something like how you stack the pitstop or who pits first, stuff like that can be argued to have direct effect on the result and is allowed...

[henk4]

Perhaps the FIA should study daily procedures in the recently completed Tour de France (bicycle). The Tour is all about team orders on what the riders should do and when and why not and everybody agrees that the team comes first.

[fairlyoldguy]

Massa took the advantage at the start, and held the lead, Alonso was running second. If Alonso was faster than Massa, then it is up to him to make the pass (presumably cleanly), that's why the sport is called racing! You gotta race to take the win, not follow the script set by someone sitting on a chair in the pits. This left a very sour taste in my mouth. And, oh yeah, a $100K fine on Ferrari, big deal! That's not even lunch money to them, it's candy bar money. Borscht (euphemism) I say.

[wwgkd]

I think the difference is the aspect of "manipulating the result". Stuff like the "front wing-gate" at RBR and this is that the whole front wing thing does not really impact the result directly(actually the opposite happened...), where as this caused a direct impact to how the race finished, which is I think how the rule was written to ban.

However, it really can be argued many different ways. Considering something like how you stack the pitstop or who pits first, stuff like that can be argued to have direct effect on the result and is allowed...

I wasn't even thinking about that side of things. Red bull tried the team orders, which resulted in a crash, but there have been other similar incidents. Pretty sure McLarens done it this season.

[pimento]

The issue is more with the team blatantly ordering the position swap in front of the crowds. If re-fuelling was still allowed then it could have been managed with pit stop timings and none of this furore would be happening. Behind the scenes is 'allowed' as it doesn't interfere nearly so much with the spectacle of racers going at it hammer and tong. The essence of the ruling is to keep the team shenanigans in the pits and let the racers race.