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Thread: Diesel cars in America

  1. #211
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    Just the Passat, Golf, and Jetta - no other diesel cars here in the US. AFAIK the current diesel Passat is available only in sedan (saloon) form for now, not the Passat wagon, I'd have to get a previous model as of right now to get a wagon. As to using a slushbox tranny...yeah any turbo'd car is going to to alright with a slushbox...I just prefer rowing my own gears
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  2. #212
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    Did BMW just disco the diesel 3 series?

  3. #213
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    Apparently the new 2.0 turbo 328i is more efficient than the old 335d, so they're evaluating their options.
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  4. #214
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    Quote Originally Posted by pimento View Post
    Apparently the new 2.0 turbo 328i is more efficient than the old 335d, so they're evaluating their options.
    this just goes to show that base (petrol) versions of the 3-series are only available in Europe.....what about comparing the 328i with the 320d in terms of efficiency? And for that matter, the figures should be compared with the "new" 335d and not with the five year old version.
    Last edited by henk4; 02-27-2012 at 12:13 AM.
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  5. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcp123 View Post
    Just the Passat, Golf, and Jetta - no other diesel cars here in the US. AFAIK the current diesel Passat is available only in sedan (saloon) form for now, not the Passat wagon, I'd have to get a previous model as of right now to get a wagon. As to using a slushbox tranny...yeah any turbo'd car is going to to alright with a slushbox...I just prefer rowing my own gears
    TBH if it's diesel you're after, I'd hold out for something else. - The Passat is certainly nothing special - just 16 feet "of car" from the generic mould, so to speak.

    And yes, I like to row my own gears too (see my comments in any thread about a sports car with a manual 'box), but some cars are better suited to autos / paddle-shift. Previously I'd have rarely entertained the thought, but with modern DSG (and the like) 'boxes and a diesel engine, you get the control of a manual without the hassle of turbo lag etc. It's not as if diesel offers the ultimate pure driving experience anyway therefore foregoing a stick shift isn't such a big loss in terms of interaction.

    Quote Originally Posted by culver View Post
    Did BMW just disco the diesel 3 series?
    It appears so. They seem to be in doubt as to whether diesels are the right solution for the US...

    Quote Originally Posted by pimento View Post
    Apparently the new 2.0 turbo 328i is more efficient than the old 335d, so they're evaluating their options.
    In the real world, I'd expect a 35mpg UK / 29 US average from the 328i and maybe a couple more from the 335d. In that situation, it's clearly not worth spending the extra for diesel just for the economy benefits - especially as diesel fuel is more expensive per gallon in the US.

    Quote Originally Posted by henk4 View Post
    this just goes to show that base (petrol) versions of the 3-series are only available in Europe.....what about comparing the 328i with the 320d in terms of efficiency? And for that matter, the figures should be compared with the "new" 335d and not with the five year old version.
    There is no new 335d yet.

    The 320d I'd expect an average of about 45mpg UK / 37 US in the real world - maybe 55 / 45 on a gentle cruise. So losing 60 horsepower to gain around 10 mpg. If you can afford a new 3-series, the likelihood is you don't NEED to save 10mpg. The exception is of course company car drivers doing moon mileage.
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  6. #216
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  7. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferrer View Post
    Everywhere but here, I guess.
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  8. #218
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    Slightly off topic, but how come no car company has looked into diesel hybrids yet?

    Seems like a logical next step.

  9. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcp123 View Post
    Everywhere but here, I guess.
    Don't be so sure... France's government was proposing to equalise petrol and diesel's taxes, a proposal that has met with more than a bit of resistance from the french car makers...
    Quote Originally Posted by NSXType-R View Post
    Slightly off topic, but how come no car company has looked into diesel hybrids yet?

    Seems like a logical next step.
    They have.

    PSA have made the 3008 Hybrid4, the 508 RXH, the 508 Hybrid4 and the DS5 Hybrid4.

    The problem is that they are apparently rubbish, and they use more fuel than convetional diesel-only cars. Also, because of the way the system has been designed ride height has to be raised further harming fuel economy...
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  10. #220
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    There's a seemingly pervasive antipathy to diesels here. Much of that is GM's fault. But anyhow, while VW's diesels tend to sell strongly, I think they are taking just about all of the diesel motorcar market already. There are many automakers with diesel powerplants which could meet US emission standards, and I believe they are downright afraid to sell them here fearing there aren't enough customers to go around. A damn shame.
    An it harm none, do as ye will

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  11. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcp123 View Post
    There's a seemingly pervasive antipathy to diesels here. Much of that is GM's fault. But anyhow, while VW's diesels tend to sell strongly, I think they are taking just about all of the diesel motorcar market already. There are many automakers with diesel powerplants which could meet US emission standards, and I believe they are downright afraid to sell them here fearing there aren't enough customers to go around. A damn shame.
    Well more manufacturers are introducing new cars with diesel engines in the US like Mazda and Chrysler.

    If one day diesel overtakes petrol it will be sad day, though.
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  12. #222
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    Eh. For commuting, diesel probably makes more sense.

    I would like to sample diesel in a lighter car, but in the R class, it is pretty anemic and bleh. I have put on 22k diesel kms on the R class since I started at Benz in November.

    Anecdotal evidence from working at a dealership indicates a fair amount of Mercs sell with diesels in Tdot.

  13. #223
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferrer View Post
    Well more manufacturers are introducing new cars with diesel engines in the US like Mazda and Chrysler.

    If one day diesel overtakes petrol it will be sad day, though.
    I don't know about Chrysler, but I heave heard about Mazda's aspirations. If the new Mazda 6 is as good as I have heard it its, Mazda might get a purchase. We're in the market for a car this year possibly.
    An it harm none, do as ye will

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  14. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcp123 View Post
    There's a seemingly pervasive antipathy to diesels here. Much of that is GM's fault. But anyhow, while VW's diesels tend to sell strongly, I think they are taking just about all of the diesel motorcar market already. There are many automakers with diesel powerplants which could meet US emission standards, and I believe they are downright afraid to sell them here fearing there aren't enough customers to go around. A damn shame.
    I've had this argument before but I don't for a second buy the claim that GM cars from 1981 are the reason why diesels don't sell well in the US. There are a number of good reasons and none have to do with diesels that are older than many drivers.

    Until gas was over $2/gallon diesels made very little sense in the US. Even the best of the Euro diesels were just 'as good as' but never better than a gas engine in basically everything but mileage. When gas was $1.50/gallon why would I want say a Mercedes diesel instead of a MB V6? Same for any of VW's 4 pot turbos vs the diesels. My brother and sister both have late model VW diesel Jetta wagons. They aren't bad but the motors aren't as nice as the 2.0T in Dad's Passat. Also, I'm pretty sure the extra weight of a diesel is noticeable vs a gasser of similar power.

    When gas was stupid cheap the only other real benefit to diesel was good range. That's not a bad thing but most of the cars I've owned can go 400 miles on a tank. My bladder didn't last longer than my gas.

    When gas prices went up and mileage became an in thing diesel does start to look better. Of course we still have some big negatives. The emissions equipment isn't cheap. I'm rather worried about the service life of some of the expensive parts such as the VW exhaust filters. Rumor has it those cost around $3000 to replace and they are expected to last 100-150k miles. The fuel cost in the US currently favors gas thus some of the mileage advantage is lost based on the cost of fuel. Finally, at least in the US, the sticker price for a diesel is enough to make to reconsider.

    Almost 15 years ago I spent a summer in Japan. In some ways you would expect Japan, like Europe to really embrace diesel. While far more common than in the US, diesel's were far less common than in Europe. I can only assume that the combination of prices, regulations etc that made diesel popular in Europe and rare in the US made them less common in Japan. Japan has expensive gas and lots of good diesel technology yet they didn't have nearly the diesel mix of Europe.

  15. #225
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    Preaching to the choir. I'd rather lease a VW TDi for 36 months than buy almost anything else available here.
    An it harm none, do as ye will

    Approximately 79% of statistics are made up.

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