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Old 04-15-2008, 06:29 PM
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Ford considers axing V8 Falcon

Ford considers axing V8 Falcon - drive.com.au

Ford considers axing V8 Falcon
Bruce Newton, drive.com.au, April 15, 2008



Ford could again drop the V8 engine from the Falcon range in response to environmental concerns, while diesel power will at last be available for Falcon and Territory in 2010. By BRUCE NEWTON.


Will new FG XR8 be the last regular Falcon to be powered by a V8? Ford Australia is not guaranteeing the engine's presence in a future line-up.
Ford could drop the V8 engine for future Falcons.

With sales of Falcon dipping and emissions rules getting tougher, Ford Australia’s recently appointed president Bill Osborne is offering no guarantees a V8 engine is part of the Falcon’s future.

The 5.4-litre 'Boss' V8 has survived into the new FG Falcon line-up – on-sale in May 2008 – but only in one model: the hardcore Falcon XR8.

The 4.0-litre turbo six-cylinder has instead become the more widely used performance engine, employed in both the XR and G6 ranges.

The Falcon's six-cylinder turbo engine also outpaces the Falcon V8, easily besting it against the stopwatch in testing by Drive and other media outlets.

Despite being slower, the Falcon V8 is also thirstier. It slurps a claimed average of 14.0 litres per 100km, 20 per cent more than the turbo six-cylinder's claimed 11.7L/100km.

“Quite frankly we have not sorted out our V8 strategy going forward,” Osborne said at the Ford FG Falcon launch last week. “That is an open question.”

Ford’s quandary over V8s is in direct contrast to Holden, which has employed General Motors' American-sourced V8 family to great effect since the late '90s. HSV will soon begin selling a performance hero with a 7.0-litre V8, the biggest engine in any new production car sold in Australia. Standard HSVs will soon adopt a 6.2-litre V8, codenamed LS3.

The problem for Ford’s Australian division is its parent company’s move away from V8s to a strategy called ‘Ecoboost’ that embraces V6 engines with forced induction and direct injection. The V6 engines are aimed at retaining performance while improving fuel economy and emissions.

Therefore the larder is pretty bare when it comes V8 powertrains going forward. In the short term the current 5.4-litre V8 in Falcon and FPV models is expected to be modified to meet stricter Euro IV emissions levels that become mandatory mid-2010.

Beyond that Osborne confirmed a new 5.0-litre V8 to be developed and built in North America for the Ford Mustang was being examined for possible use in Ford's new Falcon.

“We have taken a look at [that V8] and it looks like it will be a pretty competitive engine, particularly if we decide to boost (turbocharge or supercharge) it as well,” said Osborne.

“We have to decide whether that is suitable for us, but we also have to compare those kinds of alternatives with the Ecoboost strategy. We will have to evaluate whether consumers here are wedded to V8s or to V8 [type] power and torque levels.

“One of the things we will be looking at is the sales mix of the I6 (inline six-cylinder) turbo [versus the V8].”

Osborne is conscious of the negative publicity that Ford Australia created when it dropped V8 engines from its line-up between 1982 and 1991.

While Ford waxes and wanes on V8s, there is no doubt it is progressing on a diesel engine for the Falcon and Territory. Ford is planning to introduce a turbo-diesel V6 in Territory in early 2010. This will follow on from a mild update for the Territory in the first half of 2009.

Both Territory and Falcon will change over from the locally-built inline six-cylinder to an imported petrol V6 in early 2010.

And diesel for the new Falcon? Territory is the priority, but if all goes well Ford would also like to adopt the diesel engine for the Falcon at the same time.

--------------------------------------------------------------

Theyd be nuts to drop it altogether. Leave it in the XR8 for the V8 purists and put the I6T in everything else. Also any american V8 is a bad option, get a euro sourced one instead and give us a screaming falcon!
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Old 04-15-2008, 06:35 PM
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i agree, there'll always be the fans who just want the V8 noise on a sunday drive
sure,the boosted six is the performance king and a diesel pretty much routes the 8 when touring, but at least one model should still keep it, for tradition...
for some reason, perhaps because they've dropped the V8 from the lineup before, i'm perfectly comfortable with them relying on the six as their performance donk holden couldn't do it, haha
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Old 04-15-2008, 06:54 PM
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Where would that leave the V8 supercars? isnt it a requirement that a production V8 be made?
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Old 04-15-2008, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whiteballz View Post
Where would that leave the V8 supercars? isnt it a requirement that a production V8 be made?
Maybe they can do a limited run of 200 with V-8 engines to homologlate them.

V-8s are always cool. They're still doing thirsty engines in America. I don't see a reason to drop them in Australia. For all I know, it's probably cheaper in Austalia.
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Old 04-15-2008, 07:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whiteballz View Post
Where would that leave the V8 supercars? isnt it a requirement that a production V8 be made?
start using the I6, lol
no, but as nsx said maybe we'll see the return of homologated cars
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Originally Posted by NSXType-R View Post
Maybe they can do a limited run of 200 with V-8 engines to homologlate them.

V-8s are always cool. They're still doing thirsty engines in America. I don't see a reason to drop them in Australia. For all I know, it's probably cheaper in Austalia.
not cheaper, but the problem is the chev V8's used in holdens are still really good, ford's, not so much..
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Old 04-15-2008, 08:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clutch-monkey View Post
not cheaper, but the problem is the chev V8's used in holdens are still really good, ford's, not so much..
Thats here, theres much better ones in the states smaller and much more powerful then here. Coupled with the mustangs being around 200kgs lighter also doesnt help.

Rember the limited run of N/A mustangs we got here? Those 4.6s made 240kw (320hp) now cast your mind to the nations cup mustang (jd sponsored and driven by john bowe) with the supercharger that used to put the GTS monaros (300kw 400hp stock with allowneces for blueprinting,chips,exhaust ect ect) to shame,so much so they moved the mustang up a class claiming it was experimental because our (mustang) didnt have the supercharged motor. And then finally the fact where getting a larger iron truck motor which in a family tree would resemble the mustang mod motors distant cousin from texas larger,slower,overweight,less refined and speaks with a drawl (no offence to any texans just making a point) and the final nail in the coffin their refusal to risk any remote ammount of drivability (thanks to prodives mature edge) and their refusal to supercharge the current motor (which has seen some really massive number stateside and even at a local level i know of a handful floating around here) so there potential in that motor they just dont want to tap that.
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Old 04-15-2008, 08:59 PM
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All of this leads me to believe we are entering a time similar to what happened in the '70s: There was a decline and death of muscle and performance cars in general and then all those TERRIBLE fake muscles cars came out (i.e. Mustang II, Chevy Corvette California, etc) but then technology improved and they were able to reintroduce performance machines with better fuel economy and good horsepower to boot.

So I think carmakers in general will do this for a while, so I guess just sit tight and hope they find new fuel technologies fast!
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Old 04-15-2008, 09:23 PM
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It seems that it's less about the performance available and more about the fuel consumption. How do the Chev and Ford (here/stateside) V8s stack up in that regard? Given that they turbo I6 and current V8 are making basically the same figures but the I6 is a bunch more economical I can see where they're coming from, but it would be nice to have the V8 as an option for those who want it.
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Old 04-15-2008, 09:56 PM
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What happens to FPV and the GT if Ford pulls the pin on the V8? Looks like another pencil neck running the company again and not someone with petrol in the veins... More things change the more they stay the same. They drop the V8, I'll be buying a Holden. Im getting tired of Fords half arsed approach. I mean FFS, they didnt have a standard cd player in their base model until au3 i think it was... who was still using casettes in '02?

(How about a turbo diesel V8)
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Old 04-15-2008, 10:13 PM
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From the sounds of things, if they need to homologate for V8 Supercars they'd likely keep a V8 somewhere in FPV for homologation requirements at least. It'd certainly make more sense that way.
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Old 04-15-2008, 10:56 PM
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Axing the V8 = losing performance car cred amongst the cretins.

surely thats gotta account for like....200 sales/year? enough for the Homo-logation?
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Old 04-15-2008, 11:08 PM
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There are diehards that buy the still, Even with a turbo on the side.
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Old 04-15-2008, 11:12 PM
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There is also the "Halo" effect of a V8 model - while the Turbo 6 does the hard yards technically, people will always be prouder saying "it's got a V8!" instead of "It runs 7 bar boost and special cams!!111!!"
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Old 04-15-2008, 11:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whiteballz View Post
Where would that leave the V8 supercars? isnt it a requirement that a production V8 be made?
A production 5L OHV V8?

They'd probably just change the rules if it kept Ford competing, just like they'd probably do the same if Toyota ever showed any interest in entering.

The whole article's just a beat up about Ford not having a set future with the current V8. Why would they? Its a parts bin special that'll be replaced with the I6 come 2010. Then they'll have the option of a high tech DOHC 5L or a low tech 5.8-6.2 V8, both crate motors.
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Old 04-15-2008, 11:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IBrake4Rainbows View Post
There is also the "Halo" effect of a V8 model - while the Turbo 6 does the hard yards technically, people will always be prouder saying "it's got a V8!" instead of "It runs 7 bar boost and special cams!!111!!"
zomg not artificial displacement!!11!!
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Why would they? Its a parts bin special that'll be replaced with the I6 come 2010.
replaced along with or literally replaced with?
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