Aspiration Types

[Quiggs]

So is he running race gas only? Or did he pull like 30 degrees of timing out of it? Cause that's a lot of boost for a 9.5:1 motor.

Edit: Wait. All first gens were 1.8's... And I was beaten to it...

[hightower99]

Sorry but that doesn't exist. Miata were either 1.6 or 1.8.

Yes sorry i was mixing up information...

Bone-stock 94 1.8L miata lump bought froma junk yard with supposedly only 27000 miles.

T4/T3 hybrid turbo (capable of over 25psi)

399.4RWHP and 375 lbs-ft RWT. running 25psi on a 9:1 compression ratio (stock compression)

I am talking about www.racingmazda.com's minimonster one. In my mag it says it blasted 10.98@125mph!

Turbo ROX
end of story...

[Quiggs]

If you're talking about this car, then it's making 400whp on RACE gas. Y'know, that stuff that RACE cars use. And you didn't want to talk about race cars.

[Cyco]

As I said NA is only good to about 500hp (rare occasions due happen but not on american V8s) FI is cheaper and more effective after that.

Really?

Example 1

Example 2

Example 3

How many more do you want?

[hightower99]

If you're talking about this car, then it's making 400whp on RACE gas. Y'know, that stuff that RACE cars use. And you didn't want to talk about race cars.

I didn't want race car engines in this discussion

running on race gas is fine... How can you even equate running on race gas to running a racing engine?

It is still a totally stock engine (bare some mild porting) with a turbo that is making 400whp! not respecting that as a pillar of turbo performance and a testement to the punishment that a stock engine can take is naive and ignorant.

Cyco: you show a Ferrari Enzo which is one of the rare cases where NA is capable of more than 500hp

then a Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano another of the rare cases

then an Aston Martin Vanquish S. Another rare and very expensive car. It only makes 520hp at the crank showing that even this "high performance" variant struggles to get more than 500hp.

None are old style american V8s
All are really expensive and rare (no one on this forum would have one)

So what is your point?

If we are talking exotics then there are a ton of FI ones that make way more than 500hp

FI cars that make atleast 550hp
Maybach M57
Bentley Continental Flying Spur
Bugatti Veyron
Hennessey Venom 1000 Twin Turbo
Lingenfelter C6 Commemorative Corvette
Lingenfelter C6 Z06 Corvette
A mariad of Supras and Skylines...
Koenigsegg CC8S, CCR, CCX

Thats over 3 times the number of cars you showed.

[jediali]

I didn't want race car engines in this discussion

running on race gas is fine... How can you even equate running on race gas to running a racing engine?

It is still a totally stock engine (bare some mild porting) with a turbo that is making 400whp! not respecting that as a pillar of turbo performance and a testement to the punishment that a stock engine can take is naive and ignorant.

Cyco: you show a Ferrari Enzo which is one of the rare cases where NA is capable of more than 500hp

then a Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano another of the rare cases

then an Aston Martin Vanquish S. Another rare and very expensive car. It only makes 520hp at the crank showing that even this "high performance" variant struggles to get more than 500hp.

None are old style american V8s
All are really expensive and rare (no one on this forum would have one)

So what is your point?

If we are talking exotics then there are a ton of FI ones that make way more than 500hp

FI cars that make atleast 550hp
Maybach M57
Bentley Continental Flying Spur
Bugatti Veyron
Hennessey Venom 1000 Twin Turbo
Lingenfelter C6 Commemorative Corvette
Lingenfelter C6 Z06 Corvette
A mariad of Supras and Skylines...
Koenigsegg CC8S, CCR, CCX

Thats over 3 times the number of cars you showed.

good point, what gets me that people think 500+ hp NA cars are rare, in europe there are a good few, as for turbocharged/supercharged 500+ there are dozens!

[fpv_gtho]

I didn't want race car engines in this discussion

running on race gas is fine... How can you even equate running on race gas to running a racing engine?

It is still a totally stock engine (bare some mild porting) with a turbo that is making 400whp! not respecting that as a pillar of turbo performance and a testement to the punishment that a stock engine can take is naive and ignorant.

Then why do they only boast 310rwhp on pump gas? Perhaps anything more than 15psi on such crap fuel renders the engine as a hand grenade?

[Cyco]

All are really expensive and rare (no one on this forum would have one)

Sorry if facts are getting in the way of your uneducated opinions again, but several forum members DO own these cars.

LovinVanquishS has a Vanquish S (may have since sold it)

Napolis not only has an Enzo, but he had PinninFarina modify it into the P4/5

There are also several others who own high performance cars and so none of those mentioned would be outside their budget or possibility off their list off cars.

I suspect there may be a member or 2 that have a 599 or have 1 on order, but they have not announced it here so its not my place to disclose that.

Wow you can post lots of cars that have forced induction (I keep reading FI as fuel injection) if desired I can look and find plenty more that reach 500+ NA. How about the BMW M5&6s, the McLaren F1? M5s are very common - at least in this part of the world. Should I go on?

[McReis]

Sorry if facts are getting in the way of your uneducated opinions again, but several forum members DO own these cars.

LovinVanquishS has a Vanquish S (may have since sold it)

Napolis not only has an Enzo, but he had PinninFarina modify it into the P4/5

There are also several others who own high performance cars and so none of those mentioned would be outside their budget or possibility off their list off cars.

I suspect there may be a member or 2 that have a 599 or have 1 on order, but they have not announced it here so its not my place to disclose that.

How could you let the Fiat 850 Coupé out of this?

[hightower99]

Then why do they only boast 310rwhp on pump gas? Perhaps anything more than 15psi on such crap fuel renders the engine as a hand grenade?

What is your point? running on race gas is fine (as it isn't hard to get)

and even with 310whp from 15psi boost that is a serious beating on an engine running 9:1 compression ratio...

Sorry if facts are getting in the way of your uneducated opinions again, but several forum members DO own these cars.

LovinVanquishS has a Vanquish S (may have since sold it)

Napolis not only has an Enzo, but he had PinninFarina modify it into the P4/5

There are also several others who own high performance cars and so none of those mentioned would be outside their budget or possibility off their list off cars.

I suspect there may be a member or 2 that have a 599 or have 1 on order, but they have not announced it here so its not my place to disclose that.

Well you learn something everyday!!! I had no idea that people with that much money would post here....

By the way technically it isn't my "uneducated" opinion in the case of "noone on this forum would have those cars" I would be naive....

Wow you can post lots of cars that have forced induction (I keep reading FI as fuel injection) if desired I can look and find plenty more that reach 500+ NA. How about the BMW M5&6s, the McLaren F1? M5s are very common - at least in this part of the world. Should I go on?

the M5 and M6 just make 500hp and they are high revving engines (the kind I like) I don't quite get where you are going with this? My point wasn't that there aren't any NA cars that make over 500hp my point was that the majority of cars with over 500hp use Forced Induction.

[fpv_gtho]

What is your point? running on race gas is fine (as it isn't hard to get)

and even with 310whp from 15psi boost that is a serious beating on an engine running 9:1 compression ratio...

But its not 400rwhp on 25psi, which is what youve been boasting. If you want to state figures relevant to a stock engine, at least get the right ones. Pump gas vs race gas is EXTREMELY relevant in this discussion as you can effectively run higher compression ratios and higher boost with race gas.

[Quiggs]

What is your point? running on race gas is fine (as it isn't hard to get)

It's also $7/gal, and with rare exception, only available at drag strips.

[johnnynumfiv]

Hightower, your argument sucks. You nitpick at little irrelevant details and avoid the main discussion.

[Quiggs]

Johnny, post up some 500whp NA American muscle that's running on race gas. Since race gas isn't for race cars.

[Cyco]

Well you learn something everyday!!! I had no idea that people with that much money would post here....

By the way technically it isn't my "uneducated" opinion in the case of "noone on this forum would have those cars" I would be naive....

You have been here a year, in that time a 23 page thread on the P4/5, with the owners contributions, was running and it was featured on the front page for over a month.

Naive, uneducated you take your pick.......

My point wasn't that there aren't any NA cars that make over 500hp my point was that the majority of cars with over 500hp use Forced Induction.

As I said NA is only good to about 500hp (rare occasions due happen but not on american V8s) FI is cheaper and more effective after that.

Just wondering if 500+ bhp motors that I keep pointing out (like the Lamborghini V12s) are really only good to 500 or if the designers just happen to know a lot more about engines than you do?