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  #16  
Old 02-25-2013, 08:28 AM
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This one is "without" the espresso but with added plastic coolness
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  #17  
Old 02-25-2013, 08:29 AM
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But this one comes with the best option available
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  #18  
Old 02-26-2013, 12:44 PM
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But this one comes with the best option available
I like the thumbnail title- WOW.
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  #19  
Old 03-02-2013, 08:19 PM
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I like it, it might be nice if it came with AWD or something like that. I'll be curious to see what they put in the inevitable Abarth version.
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  #20  
Old 03-03-2013, 03:25 PM
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I like it, it might be nice if it came with AWD or something like that. I'll be curious to see what they put in the inevitable Abarth version.
Overrated. Adds weight and decreases fuel economy without much advantage. Even in inclement weather, a decent driver can drive a FWD version almost as well. Only benefit would be in places (such as California) where having AWD allows you to bypass tyre chain checkpoints.
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  #21  
Old 03-03-2013, 05:11 PM
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Overrated. Adds weight and decreases fuel economy without much advantage. Even in inclement weather, a decent driver can drive a FWD version almost as well. Only benefit would be in places (such as California) where having AWD allows you to bypass tyre chain checkpoints.
After having driven last weekend a front wheel drive car with summer tyres (and not precisely small one at that) while snowing heavily, yes four wheel drive is overrated.
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  #22  
Old 03-06-2013, 08:47 AM
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After having driven last weekend a front wheel drive car with summer tyres (and not precisely small one at that) while snowing heavily, yes four wheel drive is overrated.
My fiancee and I do OK in the Indiana winters in our little FWD drives (Hers a Mini, mine, well yeah, still in my name) but both cars are low to the ground, which when we get a big 6-8 inch storm (like last night) it's hard to get through the drifts and even in and out of parking spaces with only FWD.

Once you're out on the road, yeah it's fine but there are times where the confidence of AWD (Sleet, ice, unplowed roads) would be a nice luxury.
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  #23  
Old 03-06-2013, 07:05 PM
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After having driven last weekend a front wheel drive car with summer tyres (and not precisely small one at that) while snowing heavily, yes four wheel drive is overrated.
ಠ_ಠ

You don't know the meaning of snow. Were I in a position to have a "winter beater," I would like to have an AWD car, with winters on, but FWD but would be nice as well.

The key is still tires.

I drove in near whiteout conditions on a highway with all seasons in the R class and it was un-fun.
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  #24  
Old 03-07-2013, 12:02 AM
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ಠ_ಠ

You don't know the meaning of snow. Were I in a position to have a "winter beater," I would like to have an AWD car, with winters on, but FWD but would be nice as well.

The key is still tires.

I drove in near whiteout conditions on a highway with all seasons in the R class and it was un-fun.
Snow isn't the white thing that falls from the sky when it's cold? You are right we are not really familiar with it. Our thing is more sun and beaches, you know.

Anyway.

I maintain that four wheel drive is unnecessary but in the most daunting of the situations. All my encounters with this white thing in front wheel drive cars (including a trip to Sweden in the middle of winter) have met with satisfaction.

I agree though that rear wheel drive cars can get a bit frisky. I remember once driving the BMW in snow-covered small slope downhill and it got sideways at like 10. Opposite lock corrected it, but it could very well have been the most exciting piece of driving I've ever done. And I certainly wouldn't have been as confident a pair of weekends ago if I had been in the rear wheel drive sportscar rather than in the front wheel drive diesel hatchback.
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  #25  
Old 03-07-2013, 05:21 AM
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Where were you in the snow?
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  #26  
Old 03-07-2013, 07:47 AM
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Where were you in the snow?
The day in the BMW in Barcelona, about three years ago.

This year from Sant Cugat to Sant Hilari it snowed heavily. It was also 3 in the morning.

And ten years ago with a Volvo S80 around the are were the Swedish Rally was held.
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  #27  
Old 03-07-2013, 11:46 AM
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We used to go skiing in the Sierra-Nevada mountains in a FWD minivan. In probably three years of using it to haul us there an back, we hit a decent number of snowed-over roads and lost traction only maybe once or twice, and then never more than a split-second. The biggest hassle were the snow chain checkpoints, past which you were required to have tyre chains unless you had 4x4 or awd. After the minivans we had an AWD Passat. Obviously it handled the snowy days quite well but the FWD mom mobiles from before left little room for improvement. Bypassing the checkpoints was a bigger advantage than the actual ability of the vehicle to get along on snowy roads.

Incidentally, the only time we got stuck was in the Passat...it didn't have quite the ground clearance of the minivans and got stuck high-centre on a snowbank. I tease my Dad for that one, saying he had delusions of adequacy for the Passat as an off-roader

That Passat was a really nice car, though.
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Last edited by jcp123; 03-07-2013 at 11:48 AM.
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  #28  
Old 03-07-2013, 12:08 PM
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The biggest hassle were the snow chain checkpoints, past which you were required to have tyre chains unless you had 4x4 or awd.
I believe it's not the four wheel drive that lets you pass but rather, if the police stops you, you have to have tyre chains or winter tyres to continue.
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  #29  
Old 03-08-2013, 09:01 AM
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I believe it's not the four wheel drive that lets you pass but rather, if the police stops you, you have to have tyre chains or winter tyres to continue.
Now that you mention it, I think winter treads allowed you to pass as well. But so did awd or 4wd.
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  #30  
Old 05-26-2013, 01:15 PM
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USDM version #10
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