New VE Pictures. Is it a Commodore or a Falcon???

[Rockefella]

ok, to be perfectly honest with all of you, i am a ford fan yes, but this car bores me more than a nite with conan o'brien

Conan O'Brien is funny. [/endthread]

[IBrake4Rainbows]

I guess if your american you get Conan O'Brien, as Australians, we don't.

Interesting point FPV raised regarding the Territory taking over Family Lugging Duties, so the Falcon can become more of a Performance/Desireable piece of kit, it's good that Ford could use this product positioning line, which would further allow the Falcon to make a name for itself as a performance icon following the V8 debarcle of the 80's.....

But again, Mitsubishi are not looking the healthiest, and unless there is some good local and international product on the way, Mitsubishi will be in a much larger pickle than they are; i highly doubt they will ever repay all of the debt there in.

[fpv_gtho]

Mitsubishi have made it fairly clear that in order to completely secure their future, they need a second model line in production locally, and for a while it was between the Pajero and the Territory-esque Endeavor sold in the US, based off the 380's platform.

[IBrake4Rainbows]

The Current Outlander is nothing more than a Niche player in one of the biggest-growing markets; partially due to it's oddball styling, partially due to it's utter-averageness.

The New one, by all accounts, Should do well, but, if built here, and to be sold in competition with the Territory and Captiva (S3X) will need to do much better to overcome the stigma of being a Japanese car with all profits going towards an offshore-based company.

That, and the fact it's also styled to minority tastes; I love it, but the general market may not find it totally attractive, when the Default Territory is so classy in comparison.

[TVR IS KING]

Dude lay off!
It isnt "omg fully sick"? its a family car! what do you want? Falcons and 380's arnt fully sick either, and lets not go to America...
I like the car, I will be awaiting the removal of the tape.

[IBrake4Rainbows]

Thats exactly my point; the VE will look heaps hot in SS guise, but underdone in Exec spec.

Bad styling.

[adrenaline]

TVR, if you read what I said, its a good looking car, but I am disappointed because Michael Simcoe said the car design was REVOLUTIONARY. It is far from revolutionary. Its boring. Are you basically saying that the VE has the RIGHT to be boring because its a family car??

[fpv_gtho]

I dare say the 2008/9 and 2010/11 models will be alot bolder. The VE had to be toned down so that the carryover VZ models wouldnt look out of place

[TVR IS KING]

TVR, if you read what I said, its a good looking car, but I am disappointed because Michael Simcoe said the car design was REVOLUTIONARY. It is far from revolutionary. Its boring. Are you basically saying that the VE has the RIGHT to be boring because its a family car??

No, Im saying it doesnt have to be breathtaking...or "fully sick"
I wouldnt call a Falcon XT or 380...base model...exciting either.

[adrenaline]

I dare say the 2008/9 and 2010/11 models will be alot bolder. The VE had to be toned down so that the carryover VZ models wouldnt look out of place

OMG I forgot about that...the wagon and utility will stay on the current architecture for now...lol ur a genius!

No, Im saying it doesnt have to be breathtaking...or "fully sick"
I wouldnt call a Falcon XT or 380...base model...exciting either.

I didnt say it necessarily had to be absolutely amazing, but I think thats what most people were expecting. Its Next Gen, most people expected next gen design. Itll prolly look pretty slick in the metal though, as ive said already.

And about the XT and 380...the XT is and old design, on old architecture. Its reaching the end of its life. The standard 380...lets not go there.

[fpv_gtho]

I think its fairly safe to assume the Falcon and Commodore cant survive with their base models looking like theyre ready for the taxi ranks. I personally would be dissapointed if the VE Executive was only "slightly" better equiped than the VZ Exec.

[SlickHolden]

When you see the VE exec you can see they are trying to disguise it as a Astra.
BA Lights?
Audi Glass?
Looks more like a Falcon? Looks more like a torana SSX. When it's ready we can all judge it fully. See what it has in common with others.
I remember some first comments when the VY was first released, So many said that is Holden's AU, Time showed it wasn't.
But i think of fuel economy.
The VT with VS engine was alright on Fuel, It got better by the VY it might even have been the best for fuel economy in a large 6, It could get easy under 7L per 100 on highway travels.
The Alloytech engine wont be worse on fuel as the VT wasn't over the VS and the VT was over 200-300kg heavier,

I reckon the commodore will sell. A little.

Holden are taking last minute measures to compete with the BF falcon for economy and interior noise. They can try to get close but they will never reach the BF's standard in time for launch. The BF's upgrade cost over 100 million, I cant see Holden starting a project like that on the alloytech and the mechanics of the next gen commodore this close to release. Of course they have already tweaked the alloytech for the new model, but I know for a fact that they didn't focus on economy. GoAuto, (i think it was them), reported back in December that holden were beginning last minute changes to the VE to favour fuel economy. Obviously they've sh** themselves when they saw the BF upgrade

And BTW I think that the Aussie large sedan is far from dead. Ford are giving their engine a major workover before the Orion Falcon. I haven't heard of them replacing it. Whilst Holden has developed the VE with export markets and other things in their mind, Ford has the next 2 years to focus in refinement and fuel economy, which i believe will draw people back...And then theres the 380......actually..forget it

In my opinion Holden is screwed. They are gone. No matter how good the car is, people are going to be overly conscious of fuel economy. So they better work quickly to fix up the alloytech...

Come to think of it, even if it guzzles 20L/100km, that wanker from the Holden ads is gonna make everyone want to have a VE....just ask the holden advertising team...

That was the 6lt they were talking about not the alloytech engine on fuel economy.

OK, to be perfectly honest with all of you, i am a ford fan yes, but this car bores me more than a nite with conan o'brien, or even worse, a morning with Bert Newton. The design is overly un-original, un-inspiring and lacks any visual allure at all. I am confident HSV will pull out something at least half decent and aggressive, but for the mainstream models it is all ugly and bland.

The SS looks like it has an identity problem, at first glance i thought it was the executive! The wide arches and sidevents, as well as quad exhausts are nice additions, but when you look at the overal presentation it is a letdown.

This is an oppurtunity for Ford to strike back and deal the real hard blow and steal more sales. If they can capitalise on a new design that truly is revolutionary, looks great, modern, yet aggressive and design cues from past falcons - it will sell. I do hope they leave the design open for a gt-ho as well.

Im dissapointed in the design, i can't say much about the rest because i know little, but i can only imagine that they have done something good with interior. Good luck with this one Holden, you've practically handed the blue over the chance to bring out a new Falcon that will spread its popularity further

Why stop now you didnt hold back in the first Quote lol

[adrenaline]

When you see the VE exec you can see they are trying to disguise it as a Astra.
BA Lights?
Audi Glass?
Looks more like a Falcon? Looks more like a torana SSX. When it's ready we can all judge it fully.
That was the 6lt they were talking about not the alloytech engine on fuel economy.

If you cant see audi in the statesman then consult your optometrist

The lights have merged into BA/F falcon..more rounded...if anything they look like tezza lights...shapewise.

I agree when its ready for show and tell we can judge it...but Id say thats the final design.

[2ndclasscitizen]

i reckon the SS looks pretty damn good, and as for the lights, they're taped, so who cares? they'll look different on the proper car. I'm saving final judgement for the real car, not something lathered up with tape. And i know this is a proper production line car, but my point remains vaild, the tape hides alot of the lines and details

[adrenaline]

Your right the car will appear different with the tape gone...but the fact remains that the design is conservative...itll prolly look damn good but its conservative..