2009 Porsche Panamera

[Matt]

I know it wasn't literally a debacle. I see a few of them around here too. But it's stained Porsche's reputation. You'd think they'd try not to follow it up with more mainstream tomfoolery. We all appreciate that there's financial gain to be made from selling stuff like this, but to be honest it's embarassing to watch. It's like seeing [insert your favourite hollywood totty/hunk here] making great movies for so many years, then building on that success by publicly offering backstreet hand shandys for a fifty grand a throw. Financially great. But just plain tragic to watch.

Which would be less embarassing in your eyes? A car company stepping outside of it's own box to create new vehicles? Or the same company going out of business because the market changed around it and it didn't work to keep up? Porsche was SO CLOSE to going bankrupt when the Cayenne was introduced. In fact, for nearly 6 months, Porsche couldn't afford to build all three models at the same time and shut down production of the 911 and the Boxster to make way for the Cayenne. The Cayenne *literally* saved Porsche.

[crisis]

The Cayenne *literally* saved Porsche.

Financially maybe, but who will save their soul?

[Matt]

Financially maybe, but who will save their soul?

Again, would you have rather them gone bankrupt? What does that do for your reputation?

[crisis]

Again, would you have rather them gone bankrupt? What does that do for your reputation?

Just kidding, but in any case someone would have bought them.

[Matt]

Just kidding, but in any case someone would have bought them.

And destroyed their reputation as being a wholly independent self-sustaining successful sports car company.

[crisis]

And destroyed their reputation as being a wholly independent self-sustaining successful sports car company.

Some rich Russian bought TVR I believe, not the same league but you never know. They have sullied their rep by building SUVs so being owned(!) by another company would be on par. As long as they survived and continued their philosophy (whatever that now is?).

[ZeTurbo]

Some rich Russian bought TVR I believe, not the same league but you never know. They have sullied their rep by building SUVs so being owned(!) by another company would be on par. As long as they survived and continued their philosophy (whatever that now is?).

you mean making the best cars around? yeah theyr still doing that you know.

people dont stop saying how BAD it was of them to build the cayenne. i am fed up of hearing the cayenne beying labaled as "debacle" as someone said. its the best freaking SUV ariound. if it was some piece of junk like a ford explorer i would understand all the bashing, but the cayenne is an incredible vehicule.

porsche did something different, but they made sure they did it well. and that for me keeps theyr reputation intact.

[crisis]

you mean making the best cars around? yeah theyr still doing that you know.

Rather broad statement.

people dont stop saying how BAD it was of them to build the cayenne.

Thats because its what they think.

i am fed up of hearing the cayenne beying labaled as "debacle" as someone said. its the best freaking SUV ariound.

In which area/s?

if it was some piece of junk like a ford explorer i would understand all the bashing, but the cayenne is an incredible vehicule.

Point taken on the Explorer but in which particular are is the Cayenne incredible?

porsche did something different, but they made sure they did it well. and that for me keeps theyr reputation intact.

What is different about the Cayenne from any other luxury SUV?

[Pando]

you mean making the best cars around? yeah theyr still doing that you know.

people dont stop saying how BAD it was of them to build the cayenne. i am fed up of hearing the cayenne beying labaled as "debacle" as someone said. its the best freaking SUV ariound. if it was some piece of junk like a ford explorer i would understand all the bashing, but the cayenne is an incredible vehicule.

porsche did something different, but they made sure they did it well. and that for me keeps theyr reputation intact.

I totally agree, porsche came, saw and conqured. Apart from the looks (which rather grow on you) and conservatism I have no idea why people are complaining.

[Pando]

In which area/s?

Point taken on the Explorer but in which particular are is the Cayenne incredible?

What is different about the Cayenne from any other luxury SUV?

Power, handling & speed, maybe? If I could have any suv it would hands down be the cayenne turbo.

[crisis]

Power, handling & speed, maybe? If I could have any suv it would hands down be the cayenne turbo.

All great in a sports car. Explain the use of speed in an off road situation. Only so much power is actually needed in these situations and supreme on road handling at the expense of ride height and as a consequence off road handling are not what makes a great SUV.
It is not a matter of the Cayenne being better or worse than other sofr SUVs, its a matter of them being useless at what dedicated 4x4s are desinged for and comprimised at on raod performance over conventional vehicles.

[ZeTurbo]

Rather broad statement.


Thats because its what they think.

In which area/s?

ok yes it is a rather broad statement, what i meant in fact is that they make very well crafted and performing cars. they have applied that same philosophy to a different concep, and it worked like hell!
the cayenne is the best performing SUV on the road. but this by no means compromises its capabilities on the dirt track. the cayenne is one of the most offroad capable SUVs in the market compared to other SUVs (except the hummers i dont know if any suv in the world market is better off road than the cayenne).

Point taken on the Explorer but in which particular are is the Cayenne incredible?

What is different about the Cayenne from any other luxury SUV?

compare the Range Rover or even the aging X5 to a cayenne and you can easily see the difference. the cayenne simply does evrything better. on pavement in the road inside and out.

[ZeTurbo]

All great in a sports car. Explain the use of speed in an off road situation. Only so much power is actually needed in these situations and supreme on road handling at the expense of ride height and as a consequence off road handling are not what makes a great SUV.
It is not a matter of the Cayenne being better or worse than other sofr SUVs, its a matter of them being useless at what dedicated 4x4s are desinged for and comprimised at on raod performance over conventional vehicles.

yes but the cayenne can GO off road without comprimising road use. isnt that a big deal!?! if u want a strict offroader get landrover defender. but dont do more than 100mphin the highway on your way to the wild because the LR will fly out at slightest wind. now the cayenne can pretty much go anywhere or even further than that, yet cruize at ease in the highway thanks to that pneumatic suspension.

[crisis]

ok yes it is a rather broad statement, what i meant in fact is that they make very well crafted and performing cars. they have applied that same philosophy to a different concep, and it worked like hell!
the cayenne is the best performing SUV on the road. but this by no means compromises its capabilities on the dirt track. the cayenne is one of the most offroad capable SUVs in the market compared to other SUVs (except the hummers i dont know if any suv in the world market is better off road than the cayenne).

I think my idea and your (and probably most Cayenne owners) idea of off road are two different things. A "dirt track" is also a rather broad term. I use my Landcruiser for beach, dunes and rough off road driving. The Cayenne has limited ground clearance which would inhibit its off road ability in large pot holed or rocky situations. It has high speed rated low profile tyres which are useless off road also. It has limited suspension travel which is admittedly part made up for by traction control. The Hummer is designed to drive over everything so I dont consider it a sensible option for genreal off road driving unless you require anti tank capabilities. Basically a Landcruiser, Patrol or Discovery would leave a Cayenne for dead in serious off road situations. In fact the Toureag is a better bet off road.

compare the Range Rover or even the aging X5 to a cayenne and you can easily see the difference. the cayenne simply does evrything better. on pavement in the road inside and out.

The Range Rover would perform much better off raod. Im not talking about smooth dirt tracks either. The X5 is in the same category but I would definitley prefer the Porsche if I had to have a soft SUV.

[crisis]

yes but the cayenne can GO off road without comprimising road use. isnt that a big deal!?!

No. For the reasons stated above it can do no more really than a similar sedan, perhaps drive on sand. Its road use is comprimsed however compared to a similar type of dedicated road car, say a BMW or Merc.

if u want a strict offroader get landrover defender..

No, get a Discovery, Landcruiser or Patrol. But your point is true.

but dont do more than 100mphin the highway on your way to the wild because the LR will fly out at slightest wind. now the cayenne can pretty much go anywhere or even further than that,

Huh?

yet cruize at ease in the highway thanks to that pneumatic suspension.

But a S600 Mercedes will do it far better.
The fact is the soft SUVs offer the ability for the owners to drive on reasonably hard beaches and dunes and perhaps navigate some slippery surfaces ie snow and mud a little better than a comparative sedan. Most owners will never find this out however. What you loose is the handling that a lower cog sedan has by default. The Cayenne may be the best soft SUV in on raod handling but it is still not as good as a comparatively priced sedan.