RWD outdated?

[SLoppYJeeP]

Any of you guys read this months motor trend? They had an artical on tuner cars for v-8 (and v-10 for the viper) engines produced in America....It seemed like the biggest limit on these cars was the grip at the rear wheels....Do you think that even RWD is out dated? is AWD or 4WD nessesary for all high power sports cars to lay down the power?

[2ndclasscitizen]

Cars have been over powering RWD for years, this nothing new. Tyre, suspension and aero technologies get advanced and compensate. Motor Trend is definately on the cutting edge, pointing out problems that have been around for years

[drakkie]

Cars have been over powering RWD for years, this nothing new. Tyre, suspension and aero technologies get advanced and compensate. Motor Trend is definately on the cutting edge, pointing out problems that have been around for years

you forget that in America almost every car produced is old-fashioned and using 60's technology..... no wonder the magazines are also outdated...

[2ndclasscitizen]

you forget that in America almost every car produced is old-fashioned and using 60's technology..... no wonder the magazines are also outdated...

Ah yes, good point. But remember, the outdated technology used on a lot of RWD US cars actual helps RWD traction, i.e, Live rear ends

[SlickHolden]

Just imagine if F1's were AWD the cars would act real funny with all that down-force.
Some of the best handling cars in the world a RWD.
Something like the new Ford GT handles very nice on a track with that supercharged power.
Tell me what AWD or FWD car can get wide and use it's rear to get better steer when you have under-steer You drive them so different, Only RWD can bite a corner and help steering out i done it the other day myself, Was going around a corner roundabout with a very wide flowing corner, the car drifted as i went around i wasn't go to slow, As i got closer to the curb i floored it and the rear bit down hard and the front turned me over and away i was going.

[Matra et Alpine]

Just imagine if F1's were AWD the cars would act real funny with all that down-force.

AWD on dry smooth circuits gives very little advantage and costs a LOT in weight - and hence performance.
Getting drive frmo back to front takes up space -- space that isnt' ther anymore Even when it was tried the last time it was a struggle

Some of the best handling cars in the world a RWD.

Actuall some of the "best handling" cars are FWD
Just not "FAST and best handling"

Something like the new Ford GT handles very nice on a track with that supercharged power.

Confusing "handling" and "power" ? Which is it ?
Both being an accpetable answer in that case as being "very nice"

[SlickHolden]

AWD on dry smooth circuits gives very little advantage and costs a LOT in weight - and hence performance.
Getting drive frmo back to front takes up space -- space that isnt' ther anymore Even when it was tried the last time it was a struggle

Actuall some of the "best handling" cars are FWD
Just not "FAST and best handling"

Confusing "handling" and "power" ? Which is it ?
Both being an accpetable answer in that case as being "very nice"

It would be both.

I have seen FWD cars left a rear wheels and loose the rear and huge speeds and just never come back, thats what good about RWD there is always a chance,
AWD is for drivers who can't drive RWD cars over the limit

Now i don't want F1's to have AWD, With the down force they have now who needs a AWD that has under-steer? And for the wet who needs AWD My cars weight is about the same as a V8 supercar. It can get twitchy in the wet And it's throttle snappy that helps.

[KnifeEdge_2K1]

It would be both.

I have seen FWD cars left a rear wheels and loose the rear and huge speeds and just never come back, thats what good about RWD there is always a chance,
AWD is for drivers who can't drive RWD cars over the limit

Now i don't want F1's to have AWD, With the down force they have now who needs a AWD that has under-steer? And for the wet who needs AWD My cars weight is about the same as a V8 supercar. It can get twitchy in the wet And it's throttle snappy that helps.

you cant generalize something based on one incident, if i see a guy lose it in a rwd and smack ass first into a tree does that make all rwds bad ?? no

fwd's are better then rwd at some elements and rwds are better in others, there is no perfect drivetrain, just a perfect drivetrain for specific types of driving, in small cars with relatively low power the ff's disadvantages are mellowed out and often do better then rwd cars of the same class, when you move up in power and size rwd becomes better, when you have so much power (bugatti) without alot of downforce (most road cars) then awd becomes a neccesity

would you say the original civic type r had bad handling ?? the TSX ?? the integra ??

[2ndclasscitizen]

I'd rather drive a 'teg Type R round a track than a GT, probably much better handling and you wouldn't really have to worry about when to give it some right foot

[Lagonda]

Any of you guys read this months motor trend? They had an artical on tuner cars for v-8 (and v-10 for the viper) engines produced in America....It seemed like the biggest limit on these cars was the grip at the rear wheels....Do you think that even RWD is out dated? is AWD or 4WD nessesary for all high power sports cars to lay down the power?

I think it's more a case of AWD being seriously overrated.

[fpv_gtho]

IMO AWD is alot like stability control. To most people theyre the solution to all road accidents, but theyre more of a placebo than anything. 9/10 times, RWD is all you need as Matra pointed out. AWD becomes a necessity when youre driving on the limit in the extremes of weather.

Ive got an interesting bit of a story for this actually as well. Recently the Targa Tasmania event was held here and as usual, Jim Richards was entering with one of his Porches. There'd been alot of rain already on the roads covered, and plenty more predicted, so Richards was saying he didnt have time to switch between his RWD 911 GT2 to his AWD 911 Turbo as under the conditions, that wouldve been faster. He ended up still winning in the GT2, and had some stiff AWD competition with a pair of Gallardo's entered and a few factory backed STi's.

[mclaren_crazy]

[QUOTE=fpv_gtho] 9/10 times, RWD is all you need as Matra pointed out. AWD becomes a necessity when youre driving on the limit in the extremes of weather. QUOTE]


It may be 9/10 times for someone from sydney, but when you live here and there is snow sometimes for 5 months at a time, RWD is the most useless thing to have. Many people here who have RWD cars also have a seperate FWD or AWD car for the winter

[KnifeEdge_2K1]

[QUOTE=mclaren_crazy]

9/10 times, RWD is all you need as Matra pointed out. AWD becomes a necessity when youre driving on the limit in the extremes of weather. QUOTE]


It may be 9/10 times for someone from sydney, but when you live here and there is snow sometimes for 5 months at a time, RWD is the most useless thing to have. Many people here who have RWD cars also have a seperate FWD or AWD car for the winter

rwd is prolly better in winter then fwd, if you understeer with a front driver you really have nothing to do but lay off the gas and wait till the car stabilizes, if you understeer with a rwd you can give it some throttle and put it sideways which corrects your bearing and scrubs off alot of speed, tho in the hands of an inexperienced driver rwd is more of a curse then a blessing

[Matra et Alpine]

[quote=KnifeEdge_2K1]

rwd is prolly better in winter then fwd, if you understeer with a front driver you really have nothing to do but lay off the gas and wait till the car stabilizes,

That's when a quick stab of the brake whilst still keepign a little power on adn at the final a quick pull on the handbrake.
RWD has hte advantage you can control steer with only the throittle.
FWD has more possibilities, but requires more actions from the driver

[charged]

There is a Toyota starlet over in NSW in Australia that absolutely dominates against RWD cars in Improved Production racing. Its a under 2Litre car. It's that quick that its faster than most over 2litre cars, in it's last race it would have placed second in the open class at Eastern Creek Raceway NSW, which is known as a HP circuit due to its long straights. A well set up FWD car can be as fast as a RWD car, just cant do big skids out of corners

Overs 2litre race
http://www.natsoft.com.au/cgi-bin/re.../2006.ARDC.R27

Under 2 litre race
http://www.natsoft.com.au/cgi-bin/re.../2006.ARDC.R25