Dauer 962 LM vs...TVR CERBERA SPEED 12

[sicilian973-2]

The 962 vs F1 comparo has promted me to make this one.

Dauer
price $1 200 000 USD
engine Porsche Watercooled Flat-6
position Mid Longitudinal
aspiration Twin KKK turbochargers
valvetrain Quad Cam, 4 Valves / Cyl
fuel feed TAG Mototronic Fuel Injection
displacement 2994 cc / 182.7 cu in
bore 95.0 mm / 3.74 in
stroke 70.4 mm / 2.77 in
compression 9.0:1
power 544.4 kw / 730.0 bhp @ 7400 rpm
hp per litre 243.82 bhp per litre
bhp/weight 708.74 bhp per weight
torque 700.9 nm / 517.0 ft lbs @ 5000 rpm
redline 7800
drive wheels RWD w/Limited Slip Differential
body / frame Carbon Fibre / Kevlar
front brakes Brembro Ventilated Discs w/4-Piston Calipers
f brake size 330 mm / 13.0 in
rear brakes Brembro Ventilated Discs w/4-Piston Calipers
r brake size 330 mm / 13.0 in
front wheels F 45.7 x 26.7 cm / 18 x 10.5 in
rear wheels R 45.7 x 33.0 cm / 18.0 x 13 in
front tire size 285/30ZR-18
rear tire size 345/35ZR-18
f suspension Double Wishbones w/Adj Anti-Roll Bars, Spring/Damper Units
r suspension Double Inverted Wishbones w/Radius Rods, Adj Anti-Roll Bars, Spring/Damper Units
weight 1030 kg / 2271 lbs
length 4650 mm / 183.1 in
width 1985 mm / 78.1 in
height 1050 mm / 41.3 in
transmission Porsche 5-Speed Manual w/Tiptronic Control, Hydraulic Sinter Clutch
top speed 404.6 kph / 251.4 mph
0 - 60 mph 2.6 seconds
drag 0.

TVR price $245 000 USD
engine V12 w/High Molybdenum EN14T steel block, EN40B nitrided steel crankshaft and EN24B conrods, Dry Sump Lubrication
valvetrain 4 Valves per Cyl
fuel feed Fuel Injection
displacement 7731 cc / 471.7 cu in
compression 12.5:1
power 656.2 kw / 880 bhp @ 7250 rpm
hp per litre 113.84 bhp per litre
bhp/weight 902.56 bhp per weight
torque 881.3 nm / 650.0 ft lbs @ 5750 rpm
drive wheels RWD w/Harrop LSD
body / frame Carbon Fibre Body over Aluminum Honeycomb Tub w/Tubular T45 Steel Rollcage & Subframes
front brakes Vented Discs
f brake size 378 mm / 14.9 in
rear brakes Vented Discs
r brake size 273 mm / 10.7 in
front wheels F 45.7 x 27.9 cm / 18 x 11 in
rear wheels R 45.7 x 33.0 cm / 18 x 13 in
front tire size 245/35ZR18 Goodyear F1 Fiorano
rear tire size 335/30ZR18 Goodyear F1 Fiorano
f suspension Double Wishbones w/Coil Shocks over Gas Dampers, Anti-Roll Bar
r suspension Double Wishbones w/Coil Shocks over Gas Dampers, Anti-Roll Bar
weight 975 kg / 2150 lbs
wheelbase 2642 mm / 104.0 in
length 4300 mm / 169.3 in
width 1960 mm / 77.2 in
height 1100 mm / 43.3 in
transmission 6-Speed Hollinger Sequential
top speed 386.2 kph / 240 mph
0 - 60 mph est 3.5 seconds

which would win around the nurburgring or which is the better overall car,by any parameter.

[Rockefella]

"Members are not supposed to make posts out of context."

Thank you, have a nice day.

[fisetdavid26]

What's happening with you? There's no Ferrari in your comparison.

[Ferrer]

Apples and oranges anyone?

Why? Aren't both road going endurance racers?

[Sledgehammer]

Well I for one cant ever vote against the Cerbera speed 12, so I guess ill take a quick and specacular death.

[kingofthering]

Well... we know for sure that the 956 set a record at the old Nuerburgring, but my cousin's 92 LexUS Sc400 with NOS and turboZ and a SuperCHArger has lik 10002 hp anD We SET a REcoRD at NurBurgring.

[carreragt10]

Dauer 962 LM

[FlameRide]

Does the fact that the TVR is nearly impossible to drive make a difference?
Either way the Dauer over anything England can spit out.

[Coventrysucks]

Does the fact that the TVR is nearly impossible to drive make a difference?
Either way the Dauer over anything England can spit out.

Ah, mistruths served with a latant racist undertone.

A valuable contribution.

I struggle to think why anyone would want either.

Both would be less than ideal on the roads, and on track the Dauer has been reverse engineered from a race car to a road car, which is slightly unconventional, whilst the TVR will, as it often did, overheat.

Considering the rarity of both cars, especially the TVR, servicing and maintainance would be expensive at best, impossible at worst. If anything breaks on the TVR, you are probably going to have to manufacture a replacement yourself as even if TVR still existed, the car was cobbled together from spare parts in the first place, so there wouldn't have been much left lying around. The Dauer is a early nineties race car, so, similarly; I doubt there are vast reserves of components around.

And I'm sure that an engine that, originally, only ever needed to last 24hrs or so will be all the better for additional boost.

It would make more sense just to get an actual 962 and join in some period racing.

[sicilian973-2]

Ah, mistruths served with a latant racist undertone.

A valuable contribution.

I struggle to think why anyone would want either.

Both would be less than ideal on the roads, and on track the Dauer has been reverse engineered from a race car to a road car, which is slightly unconventional, whilst the TVR will, as it often did, overheat.

Considering the rarity of both cars, especially the TVR, servicing and maintainance would be expensive at best, impossible at worst. If anything breaks on the TVR, you are probably going to have to manufacture a replacement yourself as even if TVR still existed, the car was cobbled together from spare parts in the first place, so there wouldn't have been much left lying around. The Dauer is a early nineties race car, so, similarly; I doubt there are vast reserves of components around.

And I'm sure that an engine that, originally, only ever needed to last 24hrs or so will be all the better for additional boost.

It would make more sense just to get an actual 962 and join in some period racing.

no actually Dauer still have over 20 962lms not sold

[:Exige:]

no actually Dauer still have over 20 962lms not sold

And that makes it any less rare? No ... that just means that people don't want them.

Does the fact that the TVR is nearly impossible to drive make a difference?
Either way the Dauer over anything England can spit out.

And what are you basing this "fact" on? Something you saw in a dream? Maybe you saw it written on the side of an alpaca? Maybe it's impossible for YOU to drive because you don't have any legs, or more likely are much too younger to drive. The reviews I have read are very much to the contary, but I haven't really checked any comic books for any test drives of it like you probably have.

Why? Aren't both road going endurance racers?

The TVR was marketed around £120k, The Dauer for over £1m. Both the Toyota Carina and Mercedes E55 AMG are 5-door saloons ... that doesn't mean that they're in direct competition with each other.

[Rockefella]

And what are you basing this "fact" on? Something you saw in a dream? Maybe you saw it written on the side of an alpaca? Maybe it's impossible for YOU to drive because you don't have any legs, or more likely are much too younger to drive. The reviews I have read are very much to the contary, but I haven't really checked any comic books for any test drives of it like you probably have.

Well, neither of you have driven the car so the point is null and void here methinks. Obviously, the car has A LOT of power, and NOT a lot of weight.. so I'm sure it'd be difficult, but let's not flame one another on absolute guesses of the car's driving prowess.

[Ferrer]

The TVR was marketed around £120k, The Dauer for over £1m. Both the Toyota Carina and Mercedes E55 AMG are 5-door saloons ... that doesn't mean that they're in direct competition with each other.

Well yes, but those two cars are quite similar. Both are based in endurance racers, both have monumental peformance and both are rare. They are perfectly comparable in my opinion.

[:Exige:]

Well, neither of you have driven the car so the point is null and void here methinks. Obviously, the car has A LOT of power, and NOT a lot of weight.. so I'm sure it'd be difficult, but let's not flame one another on absolute guesses of the car's driving prowess.

Well journalists have driven the car and strangely enough they wrote about it. You could say exactly that with most debates we have on this forum, but we'd get nowhere. We have to made an educated guess based on the sources we have and I think reviews from people who have actually driven the car and have driven a lot of other cars is a pretty reliable source. Read Evo Magazine's review of it ... someone posted the scans up on the forum a while back.

Well yes, but those two cars are quite similar. Both are based in endurance racers, both have monumental peformance and both are rare. They are perfectly comparable in my opinion.

Wrong. The Cerbera Speed 12 was developed as a road car first and thus is not based on an endurance racer. And by your calculations we could also add the TVR Tuscan ... the TVR Tuscan was homolgated and raced precisely as the Cerbie was.

[Coventrysucks]

no actually Dauer still have over 20 962lms not sold

I do not understand that sentance.

Obviously, the car has A LOT of power, and NOT a lot of weight.. so I'm sure it'd be difficult

Well, on the one hand it has nigh on 900bhp/tonne and no traction control - so it is always going to be a bit hairy.

On the other, it won races (when it wasn't overheating) and Evo gave it 11/5 or something, hardly pointing to it being an absolute pig.

The Cerbera Speed 12 was developed as a road car first and thus is not based on an endurance racer.

The 7/12/ Speed 12 wasn't based on an endurance racer, but it is fairly obvious that it was always intended as one, the full rollcage, race seats etc, etc are a strong pointer. TVR had already fielded a Cerbera Speed 8, rather unsuccessfully, in the GT2 series, so something more powerful was needed...

The Cerbera Speed 12 was always intended to be a racer - hence the narrow cabin compared to the Speed 12 - it had to be the same width as the "standard" Cerbera for homologation purposes.

And by your calculations we could also add the TVR Tuscan ... the TVR Tuscan was homolgated and raced precisely as the Cerbie was.

There are still a couple in the dailysportscar classifieds. £90,000, inc. a raft of spares and bits...

The obvious choice in terms of a TVR race car is the Tuscan AJP8, less than £20,000, devastatingly fast and you get to loon about in the Tuscan Challenge.

Try that in your Dauer...