mazda rx8 or honda civic si

[Spastik_Roach]

you can buy 4 rotors from a new zealand workshop i believe, don't know if i'd reccomend it for an RX-8 though

A drift RX-7 down south has a quad-rotor set up and some Cosmo drag car had one too...

absolutely nuts!

[Matra et Alpine]

Not wanting to soudn too much RX-8 fanboy ( coz the Alpine is still my first love )

But, rooster ? See post #18, I am talking about roads. Did also use the track experience as it's easier for the comaprison as you can talk to the driver and swap cars and swap lead etc etc to see where each has it's strengths.

cmc, I wonder if we've another US poor solution or maintenance ?
The RX-8 is one of the sweetest gearboxes around over here and with a short shift is the equal of many of the considered "best".
One comment I've heard is that folks in the club who had "difficulty engaging" were tyupically shigfting at lower revs and by virtue the rotary engien has almost zero inertia that you have to heel/toe to rev match to make it ideal. Run it to the beep tho and this doesn't suffer due to the higher revs and match at speed.

The comment on "usability for family" is also perhaps a culture thing. I've carried 4 adults, no problems. Club runs have included to Le Man from Scotland (!) with tents, clothes, cooking gear and food ( and oil of course ). Scottish tours have seen familes ( teenager kids ) and all their camping gear etc etc IN comfort and "at speed on twisties" However, I do concede that compared to a saloon it will always be a little down on space.
Biggest problem I foudn only with the PZ is that with hte ProDrive suspension setup it sits a lot lower and "large" folks find it very difficult getting in and out. Personally I've developed a "rolling method" to get out

[roosterjuicer]

well when you said roads i assumed you meant normal roads, like daily driving, like point a to point b, like going from home to wal-mart and stopping by blockbuster on your way home.

[coolieman1220]

the thing about the civic si is that its not that much of an upgrade from a regular civic. they give you a 200 horse engine and a 6 spd. some upgraded suspension and what else? i know in my lx coupe, it body rolls a lot. bounces all over the place on the highway, it's very loud. i just got back from a road trip to orlando florida from NYC. 1070 miles in 14 hours with stops. averaged 76.5 mph. took the civic to 110MPH crusied at around 80-90. averages gas mileage of 31 mpg. the car bounces all over the road and is very loud. but i'm not a fan of the rx-8.

[Zytek_Fan]

you can buy 4 rotors from a new zealand workshop i believe, don't know if i'd reccomend it for an RX-8 though

Mazdaspeed will sell you the rotor housing and possibly the rotors, but they will not sell you the eccentric shaft

[cmcpokey]

cmc, I wonder if we've another US poor solution or maintenance ?
The RX-8 is one of the sweetest gearboxes around over here and with a short shift is the equal of many of the considered "best".
One comment I've heard is that folks in the club who had "difficulty engaging" were tyupically shigfting at lower revs and by virtue the rotary engien has almost zero inertia that you have to heel/toe to rev match to make it ideal. Run it to the beep tho and this doesn't suffer due to the higher revs and match at speed.

The comment on "usability for family" is also perhaps a culture thing. I've carried 4 adults, no problems. Club runs have included to Le Man from Scotland (!) with tents, clothes, cooking gear and food ( and oil of course ). Scottish tours have seen familes ( teenager kids ) and all their camping gear etc etc IN comfort and "at speed on twisties" However, I do concede that compared to a saloon it will always be a little down on space.
Biggest problem I foudn only with the PZ is that with hte ProDrive suspension setup it sits a lot lower and "large" folks find it very difficult getting in and out. Personally I've developed a "rolling method" to get out

i doubt it was a maintenance issues, as the 2 8s i have driven were fresh off the boat, the last one had to be jumped in order to start since it hadnt been driven except off the line. 0.2 on the odomoeter. the previous one didnt have too many more miles on it.

i guess i would be a 'big guy' at 6'1'' 210 lbs. but i found it a bit too snug and couldnt get the seats back far enough to allow adequate pedal play (admittedly with the electric seats). i have fit 4 in the g before, and didnt have a problem, there werent any bags though. and as far as difficult to get in and out, you shoudl try an FB. i compare it to putting on a tight pair of pants. if i open the door i can touch the ground while still seated. and the giant steering wheel gets in the way of progress in or out.

[Matra et Alpine]

aha cultural differences again.
MY "local roads" ... YouTube - ZZR1400 ZZR ZX14 Kawasaki Bike run A701 - part one and YouTube - ZZR1400 ZZR ZX14 Kawasaki Bike Run A701 - part two ... and yes this IS the road I take from home to IKEA

My "normal" roads for sure !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PS: THe first minute of vid 1 is boring other than the great Satriani
These roads are hunting ground for the traffic cops and often book folks doing anything from 90 to 140 MPH

cmc, such LOW mileage on the 8 then it wasn't run in and you aren't supposed to rev it to the beep very often. THe Renesis engine has an epoxy-like coating in the cylinders when assembled and a "run in" period is used to bed the apex seals in using the epoxy. The user manual is quite strict on that.
Aslo gearboxes with 0 miles havent' got the burrs taken off the synchromesh
Get yourself out in one properly driven for a couple of thousand miles adn from the VERY negative posints you raised on the engien and gearbox I think you'll find it radically improved

Hmm check out the Le Mans pics from last year and the RX-8 camp scenes. Jan is a good 6'3" and HAS to be 22 stone
Hmm wonder if the US market gets differnet seats ? Or it might be you've long body or long legs realtive to the other bit. Al;ways an issue with classic Alfas, you need to be 5'6" but the arms of a 6'4" person

ONE of the "odd" things often commmented on is the offset pedals and offset steering wheel in the 8.
Renault and French sportscars have done this from day 1, so I've never had an issue with it. Maybe it made you feel uncomfortable. I know other mowners who say it took a whiel to get used to

[Kitdy]

Matra do you have any in-car RX-8 track day footage of your car?

[Matra et Alpine]

Loads and plenty from the other guys too. Knockhill, Forrestburn, Nurburgring, Donnington, Cadwell Park, ProDrive test track, have even got a number of tarmac rallies and four "demonstration runs" on gravel stages .... you're gonna ask me to post some of it aren't you All sitting in cameras at the moment. Can you ask me again in a couple of weeks. Needing to get my tax returns done and they're not pretty at the moment

I keep getting asked about the gravel rally event, so need to get my arse in gear and get some video productino done. Fisrt stage I did at about 20 mph talking the person in the jumpseat what a nav does. Second stage I got them to read out the notes -- still at 20. THEN we did one at about 40-50 to give them the "real experience" and THEN commone sense departed as I was having so much fun and final stage was 100% !! Bloody brilliant ... and of course horrified everyone else comepting and spectating

[clutch-monkey]

never heard of the RX-8's gearbox being rough, either. imo both honda's in general and the RX-8/mx-5 have really nice gearboxes.

[Matra et Alpine]

Interestingly I've heard a couple of upgraded owners to R3s complain that the 'box wasn't as good.
Mazda now shar ethe same gearbox for the MX-5 and the RX-8 R3 model.
Not had a chance to take one for a blast yet, so can't confirm/deny.

[clutch-monkey]

yeah, it just seems like something of a non-issue because both honda and mazda seem to get it right. i mean, the 'box on an sp23 is a bit notchy, but the mx-5 felt really good.

[Matra et Alpine]

One complaint on the RX-8 box is that it can be stiff and even a wee bit awkward when very cold. But by the time you've beeped the egnien a couple of times you've accelerated to 70mph and things already are warming up

WOrse still though is the LSD. It's a nightmare these last few weeks as we've had cold weather but no snow to scare me out of taking the RX out. BUT the cold oil in the LSD has the whole thing effectilvly loced permanently, which makes for fun exits from junctions. Of course being a big kid at heart I just make it even MORE dramatic by wellying it harder Once warmed the diff lock-up is more "normal"

[Niko_Fx]

So guys, I currently have a honda civic si 2007, and my friend has a mazda rx8 2005 that he is selling. The resale value on the Si is more so I could trade him and have the mazda. I trust him alot and he is a good friend, so I am not worried about getting ripped off. I am not sure though If I would rather have the mazda, it's not much faster at all and the reliability is worse than the honda. My honda has 30k miles and his rx8 has 67k, but a refurbished engine so really much less maybe 7k. I have time to decide just I am not sure what I would do.. :/

Anyway, being a bit more serious and after some research:
(Autotrader.com in South Florida)

2005 RX-8 with 50k miles (less than your friend) = $11,000.00

2007 Civic Si Sedan 28k miles = $16,000.00

Is that more or less what you had in mind? $5k-$6k, even $7k difference? Otherwise you'd be getting ripped off.

You can get a 2006 RX-8 with 21k miles for only $14k and have money left:

Cars For Sale: Car Details - AutoTrader.com

[clutch-monkey]

One complaint on the RX-8 box is that it can be stiff and even a wee bit awkward when very cold. But by the time you've beeped the egnien a couple of times you've accelerated to 70mph and things already are warming up

WOrse still though is the LSD. It's a nightmare these last few weeks as we've had cold weather but no snow to scare me out of taking the RX out.

well i wouldn't know about that, so no complaints here
especially with rotary's heat soak is more of a concern this time of year