Motortrend Car of the Year Announced...

[NSXType-R]

On the other hand though, EDM Civic v USDM.

Wonder why Japanese cars never sell at all here...

Are you comparing the hatchback to the sedan we usually get?

[f6fhellcat13]

We get IRS and they don't, though I think that's mostly because we get the JDM Civic (basically). However, now that the Civic has been axed in Japan the US will probably get some bespoke overly-unsophisticated piece of crap.

[NSXType-R]

We get IRS and they don't, though I think that's mostly because we get the JDM Civic (basically). However, now that the Civic has been axed in Japan the US will probably get some bespoke overly-unsophisticated piece of crap.

I thought the only Civic they get that got the solid rear was the hatchback because of the packaging reasons?

Eh, solid rears aren't new on Hondas. The old 1st gen Integra hatchback sedan we had had a solid rear. My dad and I still think that was the most fun car we had. It was this utter piece of crap, but the engine was pretty good, even though it was mostly running on 3 cylinders most of the time. He had picked it up from a customer who had flooded the engine. We used it as a beater car and we put on at least another extra 100,000 miles on it, if not more.

If it had survived any longer, I would have used it to learn stick shift.

We threw it out because there was so much rust on the car that air bubbles came up through the carpet when we were at speed on the highway.

[culver]

No Civics have a rigid rear axle. A twist beam rear end is not the same thing as a rigid axle as it most certainly does allow relative wheel motion. While we all seem to feel twist beam is less than an articulated IRS (multi-link or strut) really it can be done very well and shouldn't be shunned. VW, Audi, GM (Cobalt SS), and many other Euro compacts have done well with the suspension.

[RacingManiac]

The thing is its pretty much the opinion of most Euro mags that had access to both European and grey market JDM Type Rs, that the JDM was a much better car. I don't think Honda's is that well done comparatively speaking. The bar is pretty high though comparing to the JDM Type R, which is not a slow car at all...

[RacingManiac]

But for the most part Diesel costs more than gas.

But the cars generally are more efficient, the price difference I think can probably be justified by the extra mileage you get. The problem is the normal gas is cheap, people don't feel that impact as much.

[NSXType-R]

No Civics have a rigid rear axle. A twist beam rear end is not the same thing as a rigid axle as it most certainly does allow relative wheel motion. While we all seem to feel twist beam is less than an articulated IRS (multi-link or strut) really it can be done very well and shouldn't be shunned. VW, Audi, GM (Cobalt SS), and many other Euro compacts have done well with the suspension.

Right, I think I need to distinguish that a little better.

The thing is its pretty much the opinion of most Euro mags that had access to both European and grey market JDM Type Rs, that the JDM was a much better car. I don't think Honda's is that well done comparatively speaking. The bar is pretty high though comparing to the JDM Type R, which is not a slow car at all...

the Euro Type R and the JDM Type R were quite different though.

[Ferrer]

No Civics have a rigid rear axle. A twist beam rear end is not the same thing as a rigid axle as it most certainly does allow relative wheel motion. While we all seem to feel twist beam is less than an articulated IRS (multi-link or strut) really it can be done very well and shouldn't be shunned. VW, Audi, GM (Cobalt SS), and many other Euro compacts have done well with the suspension.

It is true, and some of the best hot hatches have employed this torsion beam suspension, like the Mk I and II GTIs, the Peugeot 205 GTI or more recently the Clio RS and Megane RS.

However while it can be made to work, if you start with something more sphisticated the results always have the potential to be better.

[RacingManiac]

Right, I think I need to distinguish that a little better.



the Euro Type R and the JDM Type R were quite different though.

Hence what I said. Culver mentioned that torsion beam can be made to work, I just mentioned that with direct comparison of what essentially the 2 different take by the same OEM to make the "same car", that one was made superior to the other.

AFAIK structurally the 2 is not that different, its very un-Japanese to build 2 platform, and they are no like US vs Euro Accord that they are hugely different in size....

[roosterjuicer]

http://www.automobilemag.com/feature...olt/index.html

looks like automobile magazine gave it to the volt too.

[Kitdy]

You really have to wonder if these awards mean anything given the heavy presence of advertising dollars.

You really have to wonder if any results from any car magazines mean anything given the heavy presence of advertising dollars.

[ScionDriver]

I don't think this is a very good choice because I read Car and Driver's review and they seemed to say it's a nice start but it's not much better than a Prius in any way. They said in there driving they only got in the 30 mile range on the battery before it kicked over to the gas engine. They said it's a decent car but really not any better or worse than the Prius. Seems to me it's a good idea that is only tapping it's potential.

[culver]

I recall C&D saying it was a more refined car than the Prius. The drivetrain simply was much smoother. The handling was also better. Of course it also costs a lot more. Then again if we looked at cost effectiveness the original Prius was a joke and the current one would be questionable if Toyota offered a gas model. They wisely don't so people don't know just how much of the Prius's performance would be available with a plain gas motor.

[guitarmax42]

My guess is that they chose the volt because its a leap into a realm where no other american carmaker has ever gone before. The hybrid technology in the volt will be seen in many new cars later down the road, so the volt really is a benchmark that other car manufacturers will have to beat. The COTY award isn't necessarily for the fastest or the most utilitarian, it can also go to cars that push the boundaries of whats accepted as "normal".

[Kitdy]

Not bad reasoning guitarmax.

Welcome!