The new Vauxhall VXR8

[ozzycarnut]

Wow. You ever looked up the term irony?
If not it may explain how you can happily use such vernacular as - “muttering bs in between french kissing your kingswood” to accuse me of “muttering bs”.

I appreciate we each have our personal preferences and what we want in a car. That’s all subjective really. Making judgements on areas such as technology and build quality is far more objective and can be backed up with facts, evidence and experience. Something not difficult to do but something you have not done.

The colourful way you describe the design and manufacturing process of Australian cars is based on conjecture born from what appears to be complete ignorance of the facts.

This thread was initially about the new Vauxhall VRX8 (HSV GTS). The article mentioned that it was “undercuts full-size super saloons like the Audi RS6, Jaguar XFR and Mercedes-Benz E63 AMG by between £13k and £29k”. You “had a problem” with this because “mercedes probably inject $1m into research and development for the lock on the glove box of their e class, whereas holden / Vauxhall would inject maybe $100 if you are lucky.” To me this is not only not ”a valid argument” but also “bs”. Unless you have information to the contrary but even then I don’t see where a $1m glove box actually advances the state of the art.

A comparison on purely technological terms between a VRX8 and a RS6 or E63 is probably not fair given the amount of money spent and as a result asked for these cars. However the VXR8 is not exactly bereft of technology.

Magnetic Ride Control (MRC), a suspension system which adapts up to 1000 times a seconds to road conditions and driver inputs.
Launch Control
Electronic Stability Control
Enhanced Driver Interface

What extra/other useful/functional/beneficial technology do the high “precision” "German, Italian and Japanese stuff" offer (glovebox notwithstanding) for the premium in price?

With a view to “considering a view point” and “responding with a valid argument”
Could you explain the reason you consider Falcons and Commodores “garbage” (and perhaps define garbage). Clearly the couple of million owners of Falcons and Commodores have somehow escaped your survey of people who “know” what you “know”.

May you also explain your definition of a “solid viewpoint”? From what I read it appears to be a prejudiced opinionated rant but I would hate to jump to conclusions.

meh...

[clutch-monkey]

good for you that you burn up your dough in fuel.

i don't mind paying extra for fuel if it gets me out of a shitbox. i'd drive a '67 camaro everyday if i wanted.. point is falcons are mass produced commuter cars, taxi's, rentals etc.. apples to oranges, and you lose more on the euro stuff anyway

[crisis]

meh...

You make a good point!

[fpv_gtho]

Warning to everyone: Personal insults will not be tolerated. You all know the rules, attack the post and not the poster.

If it continues, members will be taking a holiday for Xmas.

[ozzycarnut]

You make a good point!

i know, thank you. at least you have finally realised that i have far more productive things to do with my time than converse with a simpleton. who knows, next you may realise that footwear is beneficial or that ciggaretes dont do your health any favours. the possibilities are endless. the world is your oyster my friend.

[Kitdy]

Warning to everyone: Personal insults will not be tolerated. You all know the rules, attack the post and not the poster.

If it continues, members will be taking a holiday for Xmas.

i know, thank you. at least you have finally realised that i have far more productive things to do with my time than converse with a simpleton. who knows, next you may realise that footwear is beneficial or that ciggaretes dont do your health any favours. the possibilities are endless. the world is your oyster my friend.

I... Did you read the above?

[ozzycarnut]

I don't think a Barina should be compared with anything other than walking. And even then, I think I'd prefer to walk....
A $12K Barina or Barina Spark should only be considered by those who MUST buy a new car and cannot walk or use public transport. Walking and all forms of public transport are vastly superior modes of transport to a Barina.
In fact, I can't think of any $12K new car that's worth buying. Better off spending another $4-5K and looking at Suzuki Swift, Toyota Yaris, Mazda2, VW Polo, Ford Fiesta, etc.

i would agree quality wise, a barina cant be compared to a golf, but they are they are the same category vehicle (small, fwd, 4 cyl etc). even though this thread refers entirely to another vehicle, this scenario is exactly what i am on about. holden and ford stuff simply doesnt compare to german or japanese stuff.

[ozzycarnut]

I... Did you read the above?

about a minute after i posted. i havnt slandered anyone btw, merely responding (in my way) to demands and innuendo. if thats a crime, lock me up officer.

[Kitdy]

I say - in the spirit of Jesus' birthday - we all sit around a cyber campfire and sing songs about how all cars are amazing in their own special way.

[ozzycarnut]

I say - in the spirit of Jesus' birthday - we all sit around a cyber campfire and sing songs about how all cars are amazing in their own special way.

*sings* 'koom bye yah my lord ...'

[Kitdy]

*sings* 'koom bye yah my lord ...'

Yes, that is the way.

This car is my car, this car is your car, from Alfa Romeos, to Eldorados....

[ozzycarnut]

i don't mind paying extra for fuel if it gets me out of a shitbox. i'd drive a '67 camaro everyday if i wanted.. point is falcons are mass produced commuter cars, taxi's, rentals etc.. apples to oranges, and you lose more on the euro stuff anyway

at around $1.50 a litre, thats a fair bit extra, but anyway, each to their own. who wouldnt love to drive to work in a blown camaro, or a veyron, common sense needs to enter the equation at some point. life gets in the way of the 'nice to haves', mortgages, families, costs of living etc, and the majority aim for stuff that wont burn a hole in their pocket. i am fortunate in this regard that i dont need to worry about the commute, and in the process saving around $3k a year just in public transport costs / fuel, i still travel from the office to other areas, but its obviously all taken care of by my employer.

i guess in this scenario, i certainly would not want to be sitting in gridlock in a 6 cylinder car, as it wouldnt matter if you are on a scooter, or in a v12 hearse, you are all burning fuel, just at different rates. if i had to sit in gridlock, and i was paying the way, i would be looking for the most economical way of doing it, and spending the savings on something i'd actually like driving for the weekend, and therefore not subjecting the prized possession to torturous gridlock conditions etc.

[f6fhellcat13]

I think the perspective Kitdy is coming at it from is be grateful for what you have; diversity is the spice of life and such... Cheap RWD sedans with hi-po options are not something the rest of the world has readily available to them. For some reason we car enthusiasts, for the most part, love the pleasure/pain of coveting what we cannot have. This is why a lot of American car enthusiasts look longingly to Europe's hot hatches and wagons and other obsess over everything JDM while the Japanese are busy obsessing about emulating USDM Nip cars, which are in turn emulating JDMs...

For me it's like the Viper; driven almost entirely by asshats, so I should hate it. However, taking away any comparisons of its drivers or competitors it is such a great thing; four wheels, some rebar precariously holding everything together, and the biggest mother****in' engine you can find shoved in. It is a very pure thing when you take it out of its normal context.
Try applying the same to the Falcodore. Very cheap proper-wheel drive sedans that can come with great engines, support the domestic economy, and, while simple, are not ill-conceived.

[whiteballz]

what the hell? Where was a personal attack ever made or hinted towards?

[motorsportnerd]

i would agree quality wise, a barina cant be compared to a golf, but they are they are the same category vehicle (small, fwd, 4 cyl etc). even though this thread refers entirely to another vehicle, this scenario is exactly what i am on about. holden and ford stuff simply doesnt compare to german or japanese stuff.

Technically Barina is a sub-compact and could potentially be compared with a Polo - but that would be doing the Polo a massive injustice. Besides, Barina is a Daewoo built in Korea and Holden should have stuck with the German built Opels that it used to sell. The only real competitors with the Barina are things like the Suzuki Alto and Proton S14 - but personally I think walking is still preferable to these options.
The Holden Cruze could be compared with the compact class Golf. I could find a few good things to say about the Cruze - its has high equipment levels, lots of safety equipment, and unlike some of its competitors it offers a 6-speed auto. Also, being Korean, it will probably be quite reliable, and the quality of Korean products has improved dramatically in recent years. However, the Golf is still the standard setter in the compact class - at least until the new Focus is released in Australia. The Focus tends to be rated either equal to or better than the Golf as a drivers and all-round car in European magazine comparisons and the new Focus has some pretty impressive new engines in the range. I suspect that Focus will be considered the class leader when it is released and it will probably be cheaper than the Golf. I suspect the only question mark over the new Focus will be resale. That will depend on just how well Ford markets the car and how well the market receives it.

By the way, while I am a Ford fan and also like Holdens, for now anyway, I consider a VW Golf GTi Mk6 pretty much all the car anyone needs. It is one of the best all-round cars on the market at any price point. However, I understand why people chose different cars. Needs, wants, opinions and all that.