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Thread: The State of The Car

  1. #121
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    2011 sales in UK ....

    Chrysler 1182
    Lexus 8269
    Mitsubishi 9843
    Subaru 2634

    So here. Mitsu doing a LOT better than Subaru !!

    EDIT: fFor comparison Honda was 50577
    Last edited by Matra et Alpine; 02-04-2012 at 05:36 PM.
    "A woman without curves is like a road without bends, you might get to your destination quicker but the ride is boring as hell'

  2. #122
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    AU sales 2011
    Code:
    Rank	Brand		2011	2010	% diff
    1.	Toyota		181,624	214,718	-15.4
    2.	Holden		126,095	132,923	-5.1
    3.	Ford		91,243	95,284	-4.2
    4.	Mazda		88,333	84,777	4.2
    5.	Hyundai		87,008	80,038	8.7
    6.	Nissan		67,926	62,676	8.4
    7.	Mitsubishi	61,108	62,496	-2.2
    8.	Volkswagen	44,740	38,016	17.7
    9.	Subaru		34,011	40,025	-15.0
    10.	Honda		30,107	40,375	-25.4
    
    
    Rank	Vehicle			2011	2010	% diff
    1.	Mazda3			41,429	39,003	6.2
    2.	Holden Commodore	40,617	45,956	-11.6
    3.	Toyota HiLux		36,124	39,896	-9.5
    4.	Toyota Corolla		36,087	41,632	-13.3
    5.	Holden Cruze		33,784	28,334	19.2
    6.	Hyundai i30		28,869	29,772	-3.0
    7.	Nissan Navara		21,675	21,171	2.4
    8.	Toyota Camry		19,169	25,014	-23.4
    9.	Ford Falcon		18,741	29,516	-36.5
    10.	Mitsubishi Lancer	18,717	23,076	-18.9
    Source.
    Last edited by pimento; 02-04-2012 at 08:36 PM.

  3. #123
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    Hmm... Mitsubishi is selling better than I assumed.

    Thanks for the figures.

  4. #124
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    Honda will come back, especially if they can push through to the next generation of Civic and Accord. Also, they need to improve both the programming and batteries of their IMA hybrid system. Toyota is on a tear and there's no reason Honda's IMA can't do better and give a good share of the hybrid market.

    I'll mourn Saab for a while; they have some interesting cars and I think there's some faint hope for them. I definitely agree Mitsubishi is on its way down; we rent Galants and Endeavours and both are trashy cars not worth anywhere near the MSRP. I have some doubts about Volvo too.
    An it harm none, do as ye will

    Approximately 79% of statistics are made up.

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by RacingManiac View Post
    I don't know about that, Driver's Aids is one thing, chassis dynamic control is something else. And the line between the 2 is blurry at best. Much like the whole argument with 458 being more "alive" vs the McLaren. The E-diff and magnetic ride control still works in maximizing the performance envelope of the car even if the driver is powersliding to his heart's content. The car is still flattering the driver. And there is no question its making him faster, whether he is a F1 superstar or Joe Blow Dentist. Can Nigel Mansell drive faster than his Williams did without his active suspension equipped, ABS assisted, automatic gearbox shifting and traction control optimized car? I very much doubt that....

    Subjective performance-wise it may be a different story. You might feel more involved in a dumb car where you are doing everything to make it go fast at the limit, than a smarter car with its performance envelope so high that at legal speed its just not thrilling....
    Precisely. There's something uniquely special about "flying manual" - taming a brute of a car and driving it with real vigour. You take the perfect line through a corner and there's an unmatched level of satisfaction in saying "I did that.", not Skynet.

    That's why, for me, the TVR Tuscan is the ultimate road car. Nothing else from the last 10 years comes close.
    "This is hardcore." - Evo's John Barker on the TVR Tuscan S

  6. #126
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    Is anyone annoyed at the styling decisions that Ferrari is making?

    Stylistically the last "modern" Ferrari I actually like is the F430.

    I don't like the 599 GTB or the 458 Italia or the California.

  7. #127
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    Ferraris have been rather ugly for a while now.
    I'd name the 456GT as the last good looking Ferrari.

    I'm rather annoyed by the fact that many of the facelifts for cars these days make the cars look more modern but less aesthetically pleasing.

  8. #128
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    I like the 458 more than the 430 or 360, but I like the 355 more. The big cheesy grinning front ends of the 599 and FF turn me off, but they're not so bad. The 550 I really didn't like, especially coming off the 512TR (the less said about the 512M the better..).
    Life's too short to drive bad cars.

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clivey View Post
    Precisely. There's something uniquely special about "flying manual" - taming a brute of a car and driving it with real vigour. You take the perfect line through a corner and there's an unmatched level of satisfaction in saying "I did that.", not Skynet.

    That's why, for me, the TVR Tuscan is the ultimate road car. Nothing else from the last 10 years comes close.
    In modern traffic the TVR is (may be) the ultimate track car, where one can experiment with what you can do with such a car. I'd prefer to have cars on public roads fitted with all sorts of safety gadgets so that the average drivers that use them may not be tempted to reach the level of satisfaction that you are referring to
    Last edited by henk4; 02-26-2012 at 01:20 AM.
    "I find the whole business of religion profoundly interesting, but it does mystify me that otherwise intelligent people take it seriously." Douglas Adams

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by henk4 View Post
    In modern traffic the TVR is (may be) the ultimate track car, where one can experiment with what you can do with such a car. I'd prefer to have cars on public roads fitted with all sorts of safety gadgets so that the average drivers that use them may not be tempted to reach the level of satisfaction that you are referring to
    Pieter, I'm only passing comment from an enthusiast's standpoint. - The Tuscan certainly isn't practical transport for the average motorist (hence me having the BMW and the C4 rather than a Chimaera for the same money ). When I get one, it'll be a second (or third) car. However, even driving one at normal speeds feels like an event.

    As regards to safety equipment: I would prefer that average motorists were better educated and trained than they currently are - watching some people's driving is truly frightening for me and I'm appalled that many of them have licences. If someone needs to rely on ESP and other electronics, I want to be as far away from that person as possible. I've never had to rely on the system, though in the C4 the traction control helps you up snow covered slopes to a certain degree, which I was impressed with as usually the first thing you should do in snow is deactivate the system.
    Last edited by Clivey; 02-26-2012 at 08:59 AM.
    "This is hardcore." - Evo's John Barker on the TVR Tuscan S

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by 092326001 View Post
    Ferraris have been rather ugly for a while now.
    I'd name the 456GT as the last good looking Ferrari.

    I'm rather annoyed by the fact that many of the facelifts for cars these days make the cars look more modern but less aesthetically pleasing.
    Agreed- it looks very modern, but not in a good way at all. Amongst its competitors, I feel that the styling of the Ferrari will age the quickest.

    Quote Originally Posted by pimento View Post
    I like the 458 more than the 430 or 360, but I like the 355 more. The big cheesy grinning front ends of the 599 and FF turn me off, but they're not so bad. The 550 I really didn't like, especially coming off the 512TR (the less said about the 512M the better..).
    The 550 Maranello I like very much- much better than the 599 GTB.

    The 360 I like too.

    The grill I know is based on old Ferraris, but it had yet to turn into the cheesy grin, which sort of began on the 612 Scaglietti, but it had yet to grow into a tumor at that point.

  12. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by f6fhellcat13 View Post
    If gasoline prices are brought up, not only do the Feds get a much-needed pile of shekels, but customers are incentivized to pick cars that in the real world will return reasonable mileage figures. This will create demand for genuinely frugal vehicles, not just ones that look like they are on the EPAís dynos. There are definitely times when the market cannot be trusted to regulate itself, but I feel that higher gas prices would be a much less artificial push in the right direction than CAFEís standards. I am not sure how Europe is handling it, but governments tend to be the same brand of stupid the world over.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kitdy View Post
    Troubling for me are the new CAFE standards. As much as I hate gas tax (and as much as my interest in saving the environment has faded in recent times), the current approach seems utterly moronic, and a totally political play. Raising the gas tax in the US as a politician would be suicidal, so one must instead obfuscate the price the consumer will ultimately pay by putting the onus on the manufacturer, not the consumer. I mentioned this to hellcat last night, and he and I agreed that it was not the right path to take (as he has written). The very high MPG standards could easily grind new sales to a halt, and give an advantage to automakers that place less an importance on the NADM (ie, all but the big three).

    Ultimately though, the big monkey in the closet is gas prices. Gas pre-recession here was very expensive, and for other places, near unbearable. Will we start seeing cars become tame in the next 5-15 years? Will anodyne greenness via expensive gas keep anyone from driving tire shredding beasts? As someone that likes fast cars, this worries me, probably even more than model bloat. I know the performance car will survive, but I could see it be placed in an even less important supporting role that it already is.
    Endorsing making fuel expensive through tax is completely insane. You only have to live in this country to realise that (over 70% of the cost of fuel is tax - they even put sales tax (VAT) ON TOP of the standard fuel tax ).

    A raise in fuel tax has a knock-on effect on the price of everything as transport and haulage costs rise. - Prices here have gone absolutely mental in the last few years. We're seeing £1.50/litre ($2.38 USD) prices for fuel and it hurts. It SHOULDN'T and DOESN'T HAVE TO be this way...but politicians being what they are we're bent over for everything. Even the weekly food shopping is now costing us £10-£15 more than when we bought our house 18 months ago. 2+ litre petrol cars are now considered a luxury over here and if you Americans / Australians / Canadians had to drive some of the crap that's littering our roads, you'd be shaking with fear.



    *Pukes*

    We need to make government smaller and tell them to keep their greedy, interfering noses out of our lives and let us live. All the "green" this and "eco" that is just a ploy to tax us more and during a recession it's completely inappropriate.

    If the authorities really gave a shit about climate change, being overzealously obsessive over exhaust emissions and taxes would be a pretty low priority. More of a concern is mankind's overpopulation of the planet, but that's another discussion.
    "This is hardcore." - Evo's John Barker on the TVR Tuscan S

  13. #133
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    Hello, my fine gentlemen I haven't been posting in here for a while because of real life issues, but whatever...

    I'm not entirely sure about the current state of the car. One development that I really like is that car makers are beginning to mix up their styling again (it isn't like one face for 50 brands anymore, or at least it has become better). BMW is a great example, they have really improved their cars in the looks department. The new 3-series is a great looking car, let's hope they stay on track with their next products.
    Also, it seems like FINALLY car makers have realized that weight is actually pretty bad for a car (mainly driven by the ecology concerns, but still). Many new cars are getting lighter, a few even smaller (new Pug 208) which is cool to see after many years of overall fatness.
    Best news for me is the incredible growth of the youngtimer/oldtimer scene in our region. There are so many classic cars here it's just mindblowing. I've also began to appreciate many other car scenes (I've become a huge fan of decently modded executive saloons for some reasons).
    The state of Opel (I mean wtf is happening with those guys? Last time I checked they seemed to do fine, but after my break from motoring news I was just flooded with bad news --> if anybody can elaborate what exactly happened, I'd be very thankful) is one of the only things that make me kinda sad, but overall, I like big parts of the development. Funnily enough, design seems to head into the direction that I imagined it would a few years ago.

    PS:WTF FERRARI!? What the hell have they done to their design team T-T
    FIXIE EVOLVED INTO SMALL MOTORBIKE! Now driving a Simson KR51 <3

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  14. #134
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    Pah! Weight concerns?

    You go tell that to Ford, with their 4,800 lb Explorer "SUV" that can barely tow its own weight.

    Saab is more dead than Opel, but that being said Opel may not be far behind.

  15. #135
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    Good to see you back commodore!

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