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  #16  
Old 01-25-2009, 06:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleeding Heart View Post
IMO... the Lotus is as perfect as it can be nowadays.
No they aren't.

Current Lotuses are far too heavy.
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  #17  
Old 01-25-2009, 06:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferrer View Post
No they aren't.

Current Lotuses are far too heavy.
first gen Elise was better from this point of view.

Perhaps we should remember the Elise GT1 never played too well, not probably only because of the added power, but because the design was already quite extreme.
I would use a 400 bhp or so engine for a track day version, or a less powerful but with more torque than the Toyota unit for the road, 300 bhp, not more.
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  #18  
Old 01-25-2009, 07:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferrer View Post
No they aren't.

Current Lotuses are far too heavy.
860 kg is still too heavy?

Remember the 340 R, that thing weighs 700 kg more or less. i wouldn't call that heavy for a car.
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Last edited by Bleeding Heart; 01-25-2009 at 07:08 AM.
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  #19  
Old 01-25-2009, 07:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeonOfTheDead View Post
first gen Elise was better from this point of view.

Perhaps we should remember the Elise GT1 never played too well, not probably only because of the added power, but because the design was already quite extreme.
I would use a 400 bhp or so engine for a track day version, or a less powerful but with more torque than the Toyota unit for the road, 300 bhp, not more.
Whoever said a Lotus doesn't need mega power, I agree with him.

In my opinion the original Elan and Seven embody the Lotus philosophy. If you want meag power buy some german panzewagen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleeding Heart View Post
860 kg is still too heavy?

Remember the 340 R, that thing weighs 700 kg more or less. i wouldn't call that heavy for a car.
The original Elise weighted over 100kg less than the current one. On that basis the current one is just too heavy.
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  #20  
Old 01-25-2009, 08:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferrer View Post
The original Elise weighted over 100kg less than the current one. On that basis the current one is just too heavy.
wasn't it also very hot, with a fragile drivetrain? imo i'd go straight to the 2-eleven thing, i don't need a roof all that much.
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Last edited by clutch-monkey; 01-25-2009 at 08:26 AM.
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  #21  
Old 01-25-2009, 08:24 AM
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and the 340R besides being marginally an Elise, was based on the previous gen.
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  #22  
Old 01-25-2009, 11:41 AM
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Elite: 503 kilos
Elan: 680 kilos
Proper weights for a car.

I know I said a Lotus shouldn't have more than 300hp, but I do love the Caterham Levante (if you consider that a Lotus).
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  #23  
Old 01-25-2009, 12:37 PM
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When you google lotus elite, this is the second thing that comes up... I'm angry now. and will refuse to ever look at TIME magazine again
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  #24  
Old 01-25-2009, 01:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clutch-monkey View Post
wasn't it also very hot, with a fragile drivetrain?
But I doubt those problems have been solved by adding weight...
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  #25  
Old 01-26-2009, 06:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferrer View Post
But I doubt those problems have been solved by adding weight...
rather changing drivetrain and using more kilos of heat insulator
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  #26  
Old 01-26-2009, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeonOfTheDead View Post
rather changing drivetrain and using more kilos of heat insulator
They could've put a lighter engine.

And since it was hot, remove the heater save some more weight...
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  #27  
Old 01-26-2009, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f6fhellcat13 View Post
Elite: 503 kilos
Elan: 680 kilos
Proper weights for a car.

I know I said a Lotus shouldn't have more than 300hp, but I do love the Caterham Levante (if you consider that a Lotus).
You can't really compare cars from 50 years ago to cars of today in terms of weight like that. The cars of today have to meet a lot more in the way of safety requirements that make it almost impossible to hit those old weights, even with more advanced technology. Obviously, there are exceptions, so don't start flaming me for this, but it's not a fair comparison.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferrer View Post
But I doubt those problems have been solved by adding weight...
Well, it's not like they just added lead weights to the vehicle. Beefing up the powertrain, etc. is going to add weight.
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  #28  
Old 01-26-2009, 04:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wwgkd View Post
Well, it's not like they just added lead weights to the vehicle. Beefing up the powertrain, etc. is going to add weight.
Yes, but the whole point of a Lotus is lightness.
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  #29  
Old 01-26-2009, 07:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wwgkd View Post
You can't really compare cars from 50 years ago to cars of today in terms of weight like that. The cars of today have to meet a lot more in the way of safety requirements that make it almost impossible to hit those old weights, even with more advanced technology. Obviously, there are exceptions, so don't start flaming me for this, but it's not a fair comparison.
IKWYM.
I said it slightly sarcastically (in my own head, at least) because I realize how unfeasible that would be today. That being said, many cars today do need some simplification and added lightness.
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